Axis Victories (what's the "magic" trick?)

[Cornwallis]

All the things you have said is what we Always do :) and even then the russian stack is to big to attack.
It’s simple mathematics, if the russians buy almost 100% infantry, they have over 40+ inf at the end of turn 4. adding the once they begin with + canons, and fighters you come up around 60. the british need just throw in the French fighter and maybe 2 or 3 of their one, and you got a well dug in russian defender.
I don’t know what your russian player usually does?

[Zhukov44]

If Germany could always conquer Moscow on G5 or G6 or G7……then this would be a pretty boring (and unbalanced) game.  If you can reduce Moscow’s income to >10, then they won’t be able to resist forever.  Use the Wehrmacht’s superior mobility.

As noted by others, flying a bunch of American and British planes to Moscow is merely a stopgap and not a winning strategy over the long game, because planes there are not very useful strategicially.

If you get to Bryansk on G5 and Russia responds by turtling, Axis has the strategic advantage–Germany can go pretty much anywhere it wants to go on the map.

[simon33]

@Cornwallis:

All the things you have said is what we Always do :) and even then the russian stack is to big to attack.
It’s simple mathematics, if the russians buy almost 100% infantry, they have over 40+ inf at the end of turn 4. adding the once they begin with + canons, and fighters you come up around 60. the british need just throw in the French fighter and maybe 2 or 3 of their one, and you got a well dug in russian defender.
I don’t know what your russian player usually does?

Their growth from this point should be slow. Without any of their 2IPC territories from about turn 5 and strategic bombing on Moscow, they should be only adding few infantry per turn while Germany is moving in a few artillery bought G1 in Berlin, Leningrad and Ukraine. You can also try putting an IC on W Ukraine but most players find this superfluous. In some games a mobile force will run across Siberia to take that.

Also, is Calcutta able to assist UK Europe? Something isn’t quite right if that is happening.

[Cow]

Russia 40 inf? Big deal. Germany buys more than Russia g2 and g3 10 units and g4 another 10. Hits g6 add in starting units, air and that is a wrap. G4 air g5 air G6 dead russia unless allies fly in defenses.

[weddingsinger]

@Cow:

Russia 40 inf? Big deal. Germany buys more than Russia g2 and g3 10 units and g4 another 10. Hits g6 add in starting units, air and that is a wrap. G4 air g5 air G6 dead russia unless allies fly in defenses.

Yeah, I was gonna bring up that Germany can get 30 infantry to Russia with the additions from Finland and Bulgaria.

The real issue is if Germany can add artillery to that stack.  10 art and 10 tanks with all of Germany’s planes will still win against 50 Russians defending at 2 with 5 or so tanks/planes

[Cornwallis]

@Zhukov44:

If Germany could always conquer Moscow on G5 or G6 or G7……then this would be a pretty boring (and unbalanced) game.  If you can reduce Moscow’s income to >10, then they won’t be able to resist forever.  Use the Wehrmacht’s superior mobility.

As noted by others, flying a bunch of American and British planes to Moscow is merely a stopgap and not a winning strategy over the long game, because planes there are not very useful strategicially.

If you get to Bryansk on G5 and Russia responds by turtling, Axis has the strategic advantage–Germany can go pretty much anywhere it wants to go on the map.

So basically you are playing this on the long term, so 10-11 turns for example. Then it’s indeed possible, to “starve” Moscow to death while exanding with japan. I was just trying to check my facts, that if you want, you can hold Moscow at G6 (perhaps at the cost of losing other thinks).

[Cornwallis]

@Cow:

Russia 40 inf? Big deal. Germany buys more than Russia g2 and g3 10 units and g4 another 10. Hits g6 add in starting units, air and that is a wrap. G4 air g5 air G6 dead russia unless allies fly in defenses.

We have had over 80 RUSSIAN units defending Moscow around G6. Without allied fighters. What does you Russian player usually buys? If he buys 95% inf and he slowly falls back to Moscow, not risking his main force, he can stack 75-80 units by G6.

[Cornwallis]

@weddingsinger:

@Cow:

Russia 40 inf? Big deal. Germany buys more than Russia g2 and g3 10 units and g4 another 10. Hits g6 add in starting units, air and that is a wrap. G4 air g5 air G6 dead russia unless allies fly in defenses.

Yeah, I was gonna bring up that Germany can get 30 infantry to Russia with the additions from Finland and Bulgaria.

The real issue is if Germany can add artillery to that stack.  10 art and 10 tanks with all of Germany’s planes will still win against 50 Russians defending at 2 with 5 or so tanks/planes

We usually have for the germans around 25 Inf/art, 25 tanks and 12-15 german planes around G6-G7. Russia then has around 70-75 Inf/canons + 5 tanks/fighters plus some 3-5 allied fightrs. It’s usually a sovjet win (with some 3-5 fighters remaning). Its because when you role the dice, the german inf get’s killed the first round of dice, and then on you start losing tanks versus their inf.

[Cornwallis]

@Arthur:

Trust cow!  He manages to capture Moscow often enough against good players on G5 or G6, and can bail out to other options if the battlecalc shows that the odds are not in his favor.Â

I trust Cow, but I always do the things he says and it still doesn’t add up :p

[weddingsinger]

@Cornwallis:

We usually have for the germans around 25 Inf/art, 25 tanks and 12-15 german planes around G6-G7. Russia then has around 70-75 Inf/canons + 5 tanks/fighters plus some 3-5 allied fightrs. It’s usually a sovjet win (with some 3-5 fighters remaning). Its because when you role the dice, the german inf get’s killed the first round of dice, and then on you start losing tanks versus their inf.

Germany starts the game with about 35 infantry available, if you take Finland and Bulgaria, 5 artillery, and 9 tanks.

The biggest benefits to your attack are more artillery to make your infantry more valuable and bombing Moscow starting 2 turns after your invasion starts and never stopping.

[aequitas-et-veritas]

THIS:

@Cow:

I don’t have a problem winning with the axis. Most of my wins come from Germany taking Russia G5, G6, or G7.

Why? If you strafe yugoslavia g1 and retreat into Romania and lose 2 inf only. You get a decent stack that is ready to hit Russia G5 assuming you move it towards Russia each round. If you hit too much, that is okay, the G6 attack has better odds because you add in the bulgaria stack and the norway/finland stack as well. 
There are concessions you have to make. You have to give up norway/finland, usually empty west germany and hold Germany the round before you attack Russia (you buy bombers to max your odds of winning Russia so you aren’t buying inf the round before a major battle).

I have had to give up france to take Russia many times. Retaking france is much easier than taking Russia, but it can take 2-4 rounds (Germany’s income goes really high from Russia, volgograd, and caucasus… and if you are pushing into the middle east for the VC win (which you should be doing) it goes even higher.

G7 Russia sometimes happens when things are going so well that 80% chances at Russia is stupid when waiting a round yields 99%. Like those blow out games happen sometimes in dice where you get to buy mech/armor g4 on germany (g5 mech/armor placements on germany are silly because they simply don’t hit Russia on g7).

Typically G4 you buy inf to hodlgang and bombers because that is what reaches russia for the final attack (armor on novgorod/ukraine if you got it).
~

I do not dow Russia g3 so I can’t comment on later attacks of Russia. I always dow russia G1 or G2 (fast game or standard play depending on how much time I have).

So that is that.

~

In the Pacific I go into every game with the high hopes of winning in the Pacific. It happens sometimes. Crush india J3 or J4 and hope things are going well enough to take Hawaii someday.  Sometimes it happens, sometimes I bust, sometimes I am forced to just have Japan, India, SEA, and all my ships air died, but hey I gave it a go!

Cornwallis, it is not allways like copy a style and expect to win.
This is a very good layed out Plan from Cow.
Study this, catch the Details (i highlighted a few ,not all) and sharpen your skills from Game to Game and add slowly your scent to it.

There is no magic, just sharpen your skills!

[thespaceman]

As Germany my motto is attack where they are weakest. Not strongest. If Moscow has 80 inf bypass it and mop up IPCs until he is forced to attack you.

[weddingsinger]

So, what are the German buys if you attack Russia G1?  What about G2?

Do you still get 2 bombers on G1?  Or is a metric ton of artillery the way to go?

Any inf/art purchased on G1 can reach Moscow G6; G2 you can reach G7.  That could be an extra 17 artillery (plus, what, tanks?  6 tanks on G2?)

And is it a big deal to attack G1 since UK will now not have to worry about Sea Lion?

[oysteilo]

@weddingsinger:

So, what are the German buys if you attack Russia G1?�  What about G2?

Do you still get 2 bombers on G1?�  Or is a metric ton of artillery the way to go?

Any inf/art purchased on G1 can reach Moscow G6; G2 you can reach G7.�  That could be an extra 17 artillery (plus, what, tanks?�  6 tanks on G2?)

And is it a big deal to attack G1 since UK will now not have to worry about Sea Lion?

If you attack G1 you need fast movers, like 1 arm 6 mech, If you plan on G6 attck on Moscow its better with 6 art and 2 inf
If you plan on a G1 or G2 attack on Russia I would not buy bombers G1 or G2. If you plan on G3 attack you can buy a few bombers on G1 or G2

[weddingsinger]

@oysteilo:

If you attack G1 you need fast movers, like 1 arm 6 mech, If you plan on G6 attck on Moscow its better with 6 art and 2 inf
If you plan on a G1 or G2 attack on Russia I would not buy bombers G1 or G2. If you plan on G3 attack you can buy a few bombers on G1 or G2

And that doesn’t cause issues with UK’s buy?

I’m thinking G1 I need bombers no matter what because with a G1 attack I take Eastern Poland (or Italy does on their turn), G2 you land 4 bombers on it, G3 you start bombing Moscow.

[oysteilo]

It’s all about your goal. If you want to try to take moscow on G5, you need fast movers on g1 and g2. Planes on g3 and bombers g4. You can’t worry about what uk is doing. If you want g6 moscow you add the art on g1, otherwise the same.

I dont think you should focus on landing bombers in eastern poland in order to hit moscow, because you dont have fighter escorts. Basically it is your bombers, more than 3 is silly, against his fighters. Remember it is not unlikely to have only one bomber left after intercept and AA guns. That sucks. The risk is too big

Also, dont get distracted, head straight for moscow.

[MarshmallowofWar]

@oysteilo:

Also, dont get distracted, head straight for moscow.

That’s the real secret to Axis victory – focus on the objective and don’t give up the initiative to the Allies. That doesn’t mean that you don’t respond to the Allies, but it does mean that you keep your eyes on the prize while making sure the Allies can’t wreck your day!

Marsh

[FMErwinRommel]

Re Germany Sea Lion if Brit doesn’t build defensively on B1.  In a game earlier this year, G1 built ground troops, so I as Brit, built no ground units in London, instead built in S. Afr and dd in Canada and sub off London.  So G2 built tt’s and bombed London.  Brit AA rolled snake eyes, killing both Ger bombers.  That allowed me to build inf without spending on repairs and Ger had no bombers for Sea Lion.  He attacked anyway and rolled until he lost everything and conceded the game on G3.  But I don’t tempt fate like that anymore.  Pure luck of the dice.

[Aaron_the_Warmonger]

I’ve found that the game is Japans to lose and must be played that way.  Japan can opt to not make a DOW against anyone but china and get calcutta and kwantung consistantly by T3, and if you wait for T4 you can have the philipines as well, which puts you only one VC away from winning.  The USA must put a lot of IPCs towards stopping this, and by doing so, allows the Germans and the I-Ties a pretty good reign over europe and can slug their way to moscow.  My group views getting Italy’s income into the 30’s by the time the US is coming over for the Axis to be in strong position, and i view turns 7-9 as the turns that the Allies need to be turning the corner in IPC and unit advantage.  Just my thoughts.  Good Luck!

AW

[simon33]

@Aaron_the_Warmonger:

I’ve found that the game is Japans to lose and must be played that way.  Japan can opt to not make a DOW against anyone but china and get calcutta and kwantung consistantly by T3, and if you wait for T4 you can have the philipines as well, which puts you only one VC away from winning.  The USA must put a lot of IPCs towards stopping this, and by doing so, allows the Germans and the I-Ties a pretty good reign over europe and can slug their way to moscow.  My group views getting Italy’s income into the 30’s by the time the US is coming over for the Axis to be in strong position, and i view turns 7-9 as the turns that the Allies need to be turning the corner in IPC and unit advantage.  Just my thoughts.  Good Luck!

AW

Hold on, are you saying that Japan not doing a DOW until turn 3 then results in Calcutta’s capitulation on the same turn as the DOW?

How? Wouldn’t the UK put down a blocker in SZ37?