League General Discussion Thread

[axis-dominion]

rules question:

so i know a plane can’t fly over a hostile neutral that hasn’t been attacked during combat movement, but can it fly back over during noncom if that neutral gets attacked in a different battle during the same combat round?

specifically, i am attacking both argentina and chile during this combat round, the bomber wants to fly around argentina (not over) during combat movement to get to chile, but needs to fly OVER argentina on its way back to brazil. is this legal??

[farmboy]

@axis-dominion my recollection is that as long as it has been attacked or is being attacked it can be flown over

[axis-dominion]

@farmboy said in League General Discussion Thread:

@axis-dominion my recollection is that as long as it has been attacked or is being attacked it can be flown over

yea that’s what i think too, it makes sense. just can’t fly over during the combat move if it’s not attacked yet.

[Adam514]

@axis-dominion I think it can’t rely on being able to fly over a neutral that hasn’t been attacked yet in terms of landing spot during NCM, even if that other neutral will be attacked in the same combat moves.

[Arthur Bomber Harris]

@Adam514 planes are allowed to make moves that are potentially suicidal. They just need the possibility that there is a legal landing spot at the end of mobilization phase.

For example, you could send a single sub to clear the IJN and there theoretically is a chance the carriers would be freed to non-combat pick up fighters returning from the attack phase. Odds could be one in a quadrillion but the fighter plane still had a possibility of legal landing zone.

I don’t think your logic is consistent with this general principle.

[farmboy]

I need to correct my own statement. They can’t be flown over while they are being attacked. Flying over can only occur after. But that is not directly relevant to AD’s question. My guess though is that if there is a possibility of a landing zone, it would be allowed. But this situation might be treated differently than the one ABH describes so good to get confirmation from Gamer.

[Adam514]

@Arthur-Bomber-Harris said in League General Discussion Thread:

@Adam514 planes are allowed to make moves that are potentially suicidal. They just need the possibility that there is a legal landing spot at the end of mobilization phase.

For example, you could send a single sub to clear the IJN and there theoretically is a chance the carriers would be freed to non-combat pick up fighters returning from the attack phase. Odds could be one in a quadrillion but the fighter plane still had a possibility of legal landing zone.

I don’t think your logic is consistent with this general principle.

I think that principle doesn’t apply here. There are ways to plan to attack a neutral, and it never occurs in the end due to player choice (retreating from the naval fight before the amphibious assault on a neutral for example). That’s different from having the possibility of miracle dice to get a landing spot.

[gamerman01]

It is different than the miracle dice, yes, those examples don’t exactly apply here.

When making the combat movements, you KNOW the neutral (that will later be flown over) will be violated before NCM, so you KNOW the bomber will be able to fly over it in NCM.

[axis-dominion]

@gamerman01 said in League General Discussion Thread:

It is different than the miracle dice, yes, those examples don’t exactly apply here.

When making the combat movements, you KNOW the neutral (that will later be flown over) will be violated before NCM, so you KNOW the bomber will be able to fly over it in NCM.

ok, so just to be clear, i was right to fly back over the JUST attacked neutral territory (but wasn’t able to fly over it during combat movement)?

[gamerman01]

I think so, but I don’t think it can be found explicitly in the rules which is why we’ve been talking about principles and spirit and stuff.

If you really want to know, you ask Krieghund, and he often surprises me… There’s my caveat

My thinking is, the neutral immediately loses neutral status when it’s attacked. When the combat move is done, you know for sure that neutral will not be neutral when the NCM phase comes. That’s why I’m sure it’s OK

[axis-dominion]

@gamerman01 said in League General Discussion Thread:

I think so, but I don’t think it can be found explicitly in the rules which is why we’ve been talking about principles and spirit and stuff.

If you really want to know, you ask Krieghund, and he often surprises me… There’s my caveat

My thinking is, the neutral immediately loses neutral status when it’s attacked. When the combat move is done, you know for sure that neutral will not be neutral when the NCM phase comes. That’s why I’m sure it’s OK

that was my exact reasoning as well. you have to honor during combat move but not on the way back during noncom if it’s been attacked. kinda like if russia attacked afghan and flew the air over to india, or vice versa.

do you know which forum i could ask krieg or maybe look it up if it’s been answered already? adam has graciously just allowed it to happen and don’t think it’s relevant for our game anymore, but still good to know if there’s a definitive answer since as you said it’s not in the rulebook.

[gamerman01]

Forums -> Global 1940 -> Stickied Q&A thread

[axis-dominion]

@gamerman01 said in League General Discussion Thread:

Forums -> Global 1940 -> Stickied Q&A thread

thanks!

ok before posting i did an in-topic search and found this:

not sure if that was you gamer, or krieg, but whoever it is they seem official lol

so @Adam514 i believe what i did was correct after all. not that it matters now since you allowed it anyway, but for our future reference

[Adam514]

@axis-dominion said in League General Discussion Thread:

@gamerman01 said in League General Discussion Thread:

Forums -> Global 1940 -> Stickied Q&A thread

thanks!

ok before posting i did an in-topic search and found this:

not sure if that was you gamer, or krieg, but whoever it is they seem official lol

so @Adam514 i believe what i did was correct after all. not that it matters now since you allowed it anyway, but for our future reference

That just says you can fly over neutral after they are attacked. It doesn’t say that you can plan to fly over a neutral in NCM to land a plane that has no other legal spot.

[Arthur Bomber Harris]

@Adam514 as long as you have a chance of a legal landing spot at the end of the mobilization phase, you can do the combat moves.

[axis-dominion]

i guess i am reading this part of the statement “which means that during the noncombat movement following the combat move that was the attack on said neutral…” as meaning it takes effect immediately. and that last statement at the end further reinforces this interpretation by emphasizing that the flight over cannot happen during the combat movement, just on the way back during noncombat. let me see if i can get @Krieghund to weigh in on this for us.

[axis-dominion]

btw that was gamer who ruled that way back in 2013 lol maybe he can remember what he meant and interpret for us

[Krieghund]

@gamerman01 is correct.

[axis-dominion]

@Krieghund said in League General Discussion Thread:

@gamerman01 is correct.

thank you!

[gamerman01]

Wow! Crockett has already finished a 6th interview - @oztea Oztea!

https://www.axisandallies.org/forums/topic/40629/video-interviews-of-league-players-by-crockett36?_=1712067027108

This stickied league thread has links to all interviews.