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Legion of Christ
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I agree, for obvious reasons religion should be left out of these forums.
I did address this to humans. There is no logical point in talking to god. By definition god is omnipotent, so he knows what I am thinking before I do. In fact, by definition, omnipotent means god knows everything I ever will think. So logically, if he already knows, why tell him again, just wasting time. I don’t mean to be offensive, but the concept of god is kinda silly and should be left off of this forum, Praise be to Allah if it is.
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For real?! If I am not allowed to make arguments, neither are you guys. Everything stays as it is, but if you know you are walking over the edge, don’t do it! :mrgreen:
GG
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Discussing religion is one thing. Saying one should follow a religion or book I think is crossing the line. Saying you fail in life because you choose not to believe in god I think is also crossing the line. Now go a head and down vote this post as well, I shall take pride in that.
You can try to live a good life and may still fail because you demanded in your choice to live without God.
If people insist on thumping bibles in here then they’re going to be counter examples posted.
Now if there is no thumping of bibles then there are great conversations to be had IMHO.
I’ve got one…
The Ontological Argument: God is Perfect and Thus Exists
1. God is the most perfect (‘the greatest’) being conceivable.
2. It is more perfect (‘greater’) to exist than not to exist.
3. Therefore, God must exist.http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/theism/ontological.html
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I was meaning both sides, so yes, aequitas et veritas is at fault as well.
GG
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I view God as being all that exists in the universe. Therefore, if you deny God it follows the universe does not exist either.
That makes it possible to eliminate all the “if god exists, why can’t he end suffering” arguments, and at the same time removes organized religion and all the “pray and if God willing you will receive” arguments.
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There’s a difference between faith and religion. Whatever anyone wants to believe is entirely up to that person I’d say. And if they live a better life because of their faith, or are a better person towards others, that’s all wonderful regardless of whatever they believe has any basis in physical reality.
But religion…. that’s often when authority figures step up, building on faith to create a power base for themselves. Cloaked elderly men appear, indulging in arcane rituals, selectively quoting ancient texts to suit their own purposes. Whatever you believe… don’t believe them.
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Hear, Hear brother Herr KaLeun!
Faith can unite whereas religion too often divides.
Then there are the extreme religious nut jobs who in my opinion give religion a terrible image.
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nicely spoken Herr KaLeun, eins hoch!
I´m totally agreeing with you on that one.
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@JWW:
Read this in today’s paper….the link to the Wall Street Journal article is below. When will people learn? When will we stop supporting these types of organizations?
**Associated Press
PROVIDENCE, R.I. — Documents released Friday shed light on the inner workings of a secretive and now-disgraced Roman Catholic order called the Legion of Christ, including new details on how the organization solicited money from an elderly widow, eventually persuading her to bequeath it $60 million.
The documents, previously sealed in a lawsuit brought before Superior Court in Rhode Island, include thousands of pages of testimony from high-ranking leaders at the Legion, its members and relatives of wealthy widow Gabrielle Mee. They are the first-ever depositions of high-ranking Legion officials and include how the order’s former second-in-command learned in 2006 that its founder had fathered a child.
The No. 2 said he didn’t go public with the news of the paternity because the founder, the late Rev. Marcial Maciel, had already been sanctioned by the Holy See for having sexually abused seminarians and forced into a lifetime of penance and prayer.**
http://online.wsj.com/article/APe7fcd05a02314769aa1cc0021e2eb645.html
What about the MORMON Racket’s? If you know anything about them you can’t even argue they are a religion, or a faith. Just a Cult.
If the “Catholic Church” is going to be today’s target, why not all kinds of other hokies?
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@JWW:
Read this in today’s paper….the link to the Wall Street Journal article is below. When will people learn? When will we stop supporting these types of organizations?
**Associated Press
PROVIDENCE, R.I. — Documents released Friday shed light on the inner workings of a secretive and now-disgraced Roman Catholic order called the Legion of Christ, including new details on how the organization solicited money from an elderly widow, eventually persuading her to bequeath it $60 million.
The documents, previously sealed in a lawsuit brought before Superior Court in Rhode Island, include thousands of pages of testimony from high-ranking leaders at the Legion, its members and relatives of wealthy widow Gabrielle Mee. They are the first-ever depositions of high-ranking Legion officials and include how the order’s former second-in-command learned in 2006 that its founder had fathered a child.
The No. 2 said he didn’t go public with the news of the paternity because the founder, the late Rev. Marcial Maciel, had already been sanctioned by the Holy See for having sexually abused seminarians and forced into a lifetime of penance and prayer.**
http://online.wsj.com/article/APe7fcd05a02314769aa1cc0021e2eb645.html
What about the MORMON Racket’s? If you know anything about them you can’t even argue they are a religion, or a faith. Just a Cult.
If the “Catholic Church” is going to be today’s target, why not all kinds of other hokies?
The RCC wasn’t a target, this is just another recent example of how they or their subsidiaries prey on the weak. I strongly agree with you, “why not all kinds of other hokies?”, we need to ensure that all of these supernatural organizations aren’t harming people and society as they have been for thousands of years. We need to be prosecuting them for their crimes. I would be thrilled if we started with the church of LDS.
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How do you propse we start?
Maybe by putting them in camps that have gun turrets?
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How do you propse we start?
IMO, we start holding people and organizations accountable for preying on and hurting the weakest, physically and mentally, among us? The good news is, that we have started, one prophet, Jeffs is in prison, but others in that organization are certainly complicit! We need to, as someone else stated, change the RICO laws & change the laws as they pertain to the statue of limitations that prohibits prosecuting child predators after so many years. That would be a good start IMO. Perhaps we prosecute the laws currently on the books that pertain to polygamy? I think people in the UK & Germany are considering trying to bring the Pope up on charges that he was complicit in the global RCC pedophile ring. The HBO documentary https://www.hbo.com/documentaries/mea-maxima-culpa/index.html makes this point very clear!
Educate the masses on the crimes these groups cause. I am certainly in favor of taxing these organizations/businesses.
It is certainly a good start.
Maybe by putting them in camps that have gun turrets?
I would put this idea in the “very bad idea” category! I would hope that, as T.Jefferson stated,….I hope I am not butchering this quote, that once humanity, by educating the masses, “lights” up the room, that the religious men in cloth will run back into the shadows and hide.
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GG & JWW
If you’re going to break your policy and allow a monitored tread discussing religion, don’t all beliefs discussed deserve a more encompassing title for said thread?
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YG,
At this point, I don’t know whether I should or shouldn’t. I’ve monitored other threads like a hawk, and in the end, people keep leaning toward the edge.
As to your question, I am looking at the originating content, and the thread is about an organization, ergo the title being about the organization. I would think that’s a legitimate title for a thread. The material below it is not necessarily on topic or within the rules.
GG
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I did not start this thread in the hopes that people would discuss religion.
I started it so that this community could be warned about the practices of the Legion of Christ.
On a personal note, I find it comforting, and I am sure his victims found it quite a relief to know that the Rev. Marcial Maciel was disciplined by the Vatican for sexually abusing seminarians. Rev. Marcial Maciel, had already been sanctioned by the Holy See for having sexually abused seminarians and forced into a lifetime of penance and prayer.
Read the article, http://online.wsj.com/article/APe7fcd05a02314769aa1cc0021e2eb645.html
I hope the organization he helped build will suffer dearly for stealing millions from the elderly. We should prosecute everyone invloved who hurts our children and steals from the elderly! Perhaps make everyone involved say 3 hail marys and two our fathers? It is sickening.
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Understood.
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Pfftp, the LOC is a drop in the bucket compared to the crimes of our own governments against us.
In another thread, my government is being accussed of GENOCIDE.
Maybe we should focus on bigger targets?
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Don’t go after people who kill 1 person because there are mass murderers out there. Maybe we should focus on bigger targets?
On the other hand, maybe we should do what we can. You take the LOC, I’ll go after the Pope, a few others are looking into that genocide thing.
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The members of these religious organizations should also take responsibility for drinking the kool aid. Unless you believe that God gave you free will, in which case… bottoms up.
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Pfftp, the LOC is a drop in the bucket compared to the crimes of our own governments against us.
In another thread, my government is being accussed of GENOCIDE.
Maybe we should focus on bigger targets?
Sure, agreed, there is a long list……With respect to your argument that we should address governmental abuses first, I would suggest that we (americans) do, annually, when we have the right to vote in new politicians/criminals. I don’t think any of us will be in the room voting on the next Pope.
I do know that Cardinal B.Law, who did shuffle Ped priest around Massachusetts, providing these “men of god” with new unsuspecting children to prey upon, will get a vote. Gives me the warm and fuzzies about the future direction of this organization.
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