Thank you.
👍👍
What if U.S. invaded Soviet Union?
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Well the soviet union never would have conquered America!
You are right though… Factories being beyond reach was a BIG problem for the Germans. Their aircraft simple didn’t have the range to make it out there, bomb what they could find, and make it back, with weather permitting.
Trade Embargo’s, and WORLD support, would have been the only way…
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Well the soviet union never would have conquered America!
Negative. Alaska would fall first and then your precious British Columbia would have been taken next. Then they would have discovered the wonderful women of Alberta and settled for peace, giving back BC, probably to America.
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…and California would now be called Calivostok and Vodka and Caviar would be sold to puplic on Zuhkov Beach :-D :-D :-D
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But they would never have had England! Only knights led by a bastard using underhand tricks or ancient peoples in rowing boats made of wood could conquer this island.
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But all of England’s actors would defect so they could star in all the blockbuster films coming out of the big Stalinwood movie studios.
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The US already invaded Russia during the civil war 1918-1920, along with UK and failed.
Russia is too big and logistics would be a nightmare. Also, the Soviet manpower advantage would really be felt. Consider the total manpower delivered to France 1944-45 and compare that to the Soviet figures.
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@Most:
But all of England’s actors would defect so they could star in all the blockbuster films coming out of the big Stalinwood movie studios.
As soon as the Russian 1st waves arrived at the Franco German border all actors would have been put against a wall to avoid such an eventuality. We did not have the luxury of right wing actors like you: Reagan or John Wayne to name two.
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@Most:
But all of England’s actors would defect so they could star in all the blockbuster films coming out of the big Stalinwood movie studios.
“Hollyngrad” would be a good name too.
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Oh Hollywood is a communist enough name itself. Believe me.
But…
Los Archangelsk
Seattleostok
Colovrado
Euguineorov
Portlandolesk
San Fransicovik
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Maybe Stalinfrancisco is better… ?
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In Virginia we could have the Kremlin District, so instead of Washington DC we could have Lenin KD
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Chicagogorsk
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@CWO:
A few comments:
On the part about the US using on Russia the same techniques it used on Japan, note that Japan is a tiny in size, and is an island nation that sits in the Pacific Ocean,
Sure I agree that Japan was much smaller. However Japanese were much more reluctant to surrender than Russians. In Iwo Jimma out of 23,000 defenders, 22,000 died defending and only ~1,000 surrendered. Russians on the other hand were known to surrender by hundreds of thousands.
Now if you are referring to Japan being smaller than Russia, know this that Japan was much more industrialized than Russia. They might have been a smaller nation but they were very powerful smaller nation.
@CWO:
The overwhelming proportion of its industry is far inland, completely out of range of any coastal bombardment.
Thats true. Russia is a huge land mass, yet B24 Liberator had a range of 3,000 miles. Given that USA would invade coastal cities around Russia, they would be able to lunch bombing missions anywhere in the country and knock out whatever industry they still had going.
@CWO:
On the part about “U.S. could repeat Pearl Harbor but this time with Russians as offenders”, this seems to imply that it was the US rather than Japan which arranged the attack on Pearl Harbor. I assume this is a reference to the old Roosevelt-wanted-the-Japanese-to-attack conspiracy theory which has been floating around for decades.
Yes. This is perhaps a discussion for another topic. But the way US lined up their fighters and ships nicely in a row and ready to be bombarded was either a complete idiocy or
they simply needed a good reason to convince public to go to war with Japan.
Even country like Poland in August 29th-30th 1939 did not line up their fighters on airfields. Contrary to popular believe most of the Polish fighters were relocated to smaller and hidden airfields and survived initial Blitzkrieg.@CWO:
As for the part about enlisting the Chinese, I would simply point out that the Chinese spent most of the period from 1937 to 1945 on the losing end of a war with Japan…a country which, when it took on the Russians in the border incident wars of 1938 and 1939 achieved stalemates at best and got trounced at worst.
That’s okay that Chinese were not very good fighters. Their only purpose would be to open 2nd front which would forces Russians to divert resources from Europe.
So in the end this would be my plan for invading Russia in 1945:
A well coordinated invasion of Russia from Eastern Europe, Asia and Pacific led by veteran U.S. troops from Normandy and Italian Campaign. German elite army would have been used as initial strike forces supported by U.S. air force. As the US/German forces would be hitting from the East, the Norwegians would engage in another Winter war. Chinese would hit the Russians in Asia along with U.S. Pacific forces capturing key port cities and lunching bombing raids deep inside Russia. The point would have been to attack Russian on as many fronts as possible. An element of surprise could have been achieved by invading during winter when Russians would least expect. There would be actually an element of advantage for the invading forces since air force is less crippled by cold weather than ground forces. A prolonged bombing raids during winter would cripple Russian supply chain and cause mass starvation of their armies.To sum it up, the goal of such invasion would have been:
- Paton knocks out Moscow
- German army bypass Stalingrad and goes after Oil Fields
- U.S. airforce initially criples Russian supply chain
- U.S. airforce supplies Paton army and German army with supplies via air
On Pacific Front - U.S. invades costal cities and lunching bombing missions deep into Russia
- Chinese open yet another front
Yes the downside of invading a large land mass is that it is hard to control. Nevertheless, winter could have been used to allied advantage, along with it’s powerful airforce and the fact that a large land mass when invaded from multiple locations would have been impossible for Russians to defend.
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I hope I am not the only one getting off on this!
I like how you put the Germans in the front line. A sort of: you started the damn war! -
And remember the Red Baron never died!
He should be worth at least a Russian Armoured Division. -
Now if you are referring to Japan being smaller than Russia, know this that Japan was much more industrialized than Russia. They might have been a smaller nation but they were very powerful smaller nation.
This is not true, the Soviet Union was actually vastly more industrialized and technologically advanced when it came to warfare then Japan. The Japanese learned in 1939 after their defeat at Khalkhin-gol that the Soviet had superior armour and artillery designs to Japans and were able to deliver accurate firepower on a scale that dwarfed Japans. Also, Soviet logistics (the real deciding factor in war) far out paced their own. The Soviet had shown that they were able to transport and operate large mechanized forces over 600km from a railroad head but they had used over 6,000 trucks to support their forces at Khalkhin-gol, while Japan had only 9,000 motor vehicles of all types in Manchuria at that time. Also, in 1940 Japan produced only 573 tanks as opposed to 3,000 in the Soviet union and even though in 1941 Japan was able to double their numbers from the previous year, all types were vastly inferior to the ones the Soviets had.
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Czar Peter spent a lot of time bringing the Russians up to European snuff. This was later reflected by their Navy (and St. Petersburg of course.) It allowed the Russians to fight the Chrimean wars. Even though they lost, it proved to the world that Russia could take on the major European empires (France won in particular here, but it was not the only one on the allied side fighting.)
One of the reasons Russia was treated as an honorable ally was their industrial power. Were they an actual ally in world war 2? I’d argue they were not, but we digress.
I point these out because I do not think America would have faired any better invading Arkhangelsk in the 1950s than they did invading Arkhangelsk in the 1920s. Russia is vast, industrialized, hardened after many battles and harsh living conditions, and as fiercly patriotic as many Americans. IMNSHO.
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You know… the trick would be to do what hitler didn’t.
Arrive as a “Liberator”.
Any powerful commanders who defect, become part of a new provisional democratic government. Let the people rule themselves - the states they had just conquered. Maybe then, the Russians could have defeated themselves.
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You know… the trick would be to do what hitler didn’t.
Arrive as a “Liberator”.
Any powerful commanders who defect, become part of a new provisional democratic government. Let the people rule themselves - the states they had just conquered. Maybe then, the Russians could have defeated themselves.And make sure that the operation receives good paratrooper support:
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You know… the trick would be to do what hitler didn’t.
Arrive as a “Liberator”.
Any powerful commanders who defect, become part of a new provisional democratic government. Let the people rule themselves - the states they had just conquered. Maybe then, the Russians could have defeated themselves.
Agreed. “Friendly” US troops arriving with plenty of good tobacco and quality foodstuffs may have been welcomed.
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