The Guns of Navarone
I think a John Wayne movie should be included so I’ll nominate The Sands of Iwo Jima.
I nominate: Stalingrad
So we have 10 already, now we need to move them around and bump titles off the list if there’s better films not on it.
I suggest we focus on WW2 movies that have a significant amount of battle scenes, therefore great films like “Schindler’s List” and “The Counterfeiters” would not qualify.
@CWO Marc
Is “The Bridge” better than any of your previous nominations?
Enemy at the Gates?
A Matter of Life and Death (Stairway to Heaven)?
Ice Cold in Alex?
Downfall?
None of which are on the list yet, but which I think deserve consideration at least. That gives the problem of what to take off and how to decide.
PS - I would have nominated “The Hill” but for the must have battle scenes guidance. Perhaps that same guidance takes out “A Matter of Life and Death”? Yet how can we have a top ten list without such a classic film being considered?
Battle of the Bulge
The enemy below?
@Young:
@CWO Marc
Is “The Bridge” better than any of your previous nominations?
All the films I nominated have in common (though to varying degrees) their sober, low-key, realistic and at times harsh depiction of WWII. The Bridge is probably the harshest and grittiest of them; it’s very similar to All Quiet on the Western Front, the quintessential WWI anti-war movie. So it’s hard to categorize any of my nominations as “better” than each other; they’re all good in different ways. At the risk of giving a biased opinion, however, my feeling is that The Bridge is way better that The Battle of Britain and The Thin Red Line, which jointly hold the distinction of being the only WWII movies of which I never saw more than the first fifteen minutes because of how much I disliked them right from the start.
I agree that Downfall (Der Untergang) would be a good choice too, for the same types of reasons I gave for my four suggestions. Another one would be the 1949 film Battleground.
I’ve seen lots of WWII movies that I think are great for various reasons (one of them being The Enemy Below, which aequitas et veritas mentioned), but things get tricky when the concept of “the greatest” starts to be considered. For example, my absolute top-favourite WWII movie of all time is Midway, yet I’d be the first to admit that it’s not a cinematic masterpiece. Conversely, Twelve O’Clock High is an extremely tough and gritty and thought-provoking WWII film…yet I didn’t like it personally and I’ve only watched it once, even though I have the DVD. And one of the most shockingly brutal and uncompromising WWII fiction films ever made is a movie most people have probably never even heard of: “Went the Day Well?”, a 1942 British film by Ealing Studios. It’s an astonishing and unforgettable film, but I wouldn’t call it “one of the greatest” because it’s a very modest production.
Yeah, this topic does need some defining of terms. Having battle scenes - therefore being more of a war film than a wartime drama - is a good distinction YG.
Battle of the Bulge is one of the least historically accurate and has probably the most generalized plot based on a historical event that I have ever seen. That said, I love the movie. The action is quite good, the scale is huge and the actors are great.
It is a minor travesty that these two are not yet on your list:
Patton - with how universally lauded and awarded this film is, it is an automatic and permanent inclusion in the top 10 of all time.
Midway - I personally think this movie is excellent and the great use of real battle footage helps seal the deal. Fortunately my dad was able to tape it when it came on TV, so I got the pleasure of always watching the movie with the Battle of the Coral Sea included. It is simply not as good of a movie without that in it.
Maybe we can nominate Christopher Nolan’s new film prematurely? While I have never thought the Battle/Retreat at Dunkirk to be as compelling as other aspects of the war, I am sure Nolan will easily make it into an excellent film.
Oh yeah… how could I begin to forget:
Kelley’s Heroes - No reasons required.
Okay another glaring omission:
A Bridge Too Far - This may be the biggest and most ambitious WWII film ever made. The legendary cast alone is ridiculous.
@Young:
This forum has been quiet for a while now, so lets bring back an oldie but a goodie…
(…and please, lets leave “The Thin Red Line” arguments for last)
TOP 10 WW2 FILMS OF ALL TIME (under construction)
1. The Battle of the Bulge
2. Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo.
3. The Guns of Navarone
4. The Cruel Sea.
5. Stalingrad
6. The Longest Day.
7. Das Boot (The Boat)
8. Saving Private Ryan
9. Tora, Tora, Tora
10. The Battle of Britain
Bridge on the River Kwai, The Thin Red Line and Downfall certainly belong on such a list. Inglorious Basterds might be outside the Top 10 but deserves a nomination. “The Pianist” is another fine film but doesn’t have much of a military component.
Attack
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_dtOgHiDxU
Battleground
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fSsf6b9aWU
The Train
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_z_9w-Ffmo
Or don’t you do monochrome?
The Train is a great film - I’d like to add that to my nominations too.
Thanks guys, had a tough weekend with my Aunt passing, but I will definitely review and edit list on Monday… keep up the great discussion.
Sorry to hear about your Aunt YG.
@Private:
Sorry to hear about your Aunt YG.
Thank you Private Panic.
@CWO:
@Young:
@CWO Marc
Is “The Bridge” better than any of your previous nominations?I agree that Downfall (Der Untergang) would be a good choice too, for the same types of reasons I gave for my four suggestions.Â
I’ve seen Downfall and it’s a great film… although it doesn’t meet the criteria for battle scenes.
List has been updated, do you disagree?… explain what should be different.
@Young:
I’ve seen Downfall and it’s a great film… although it doesn’t meet the criteria for battle scenes.
I dunno…there are several scenes in which Hitler waves his hand over a map and orders virtually non-existent armies to crush the Soviet hordes with massive, all-destroying pincer movements. Don’t those count as battles? :lol:
@Young:
List has been updated, do you disagree?… explain what should be different.
I would say that I agree, although I cannot admit to having seen all the great WWII war films; especially many of the foreign ones that may exist. Any time you put together a greatest of all time list, there will be controversy and not everyone will agree, so I don’t expect that we will completely. I can make a case for the ones I have seen if it comes to that.
Naturally, I have other WWII favorites which may or may not fall under the “war/battle film” category. Just to name a few:
The Battle of Britain - another epic-style film with a big cast. This is a good war movie, with excellent battles scenes (primarily because they used the real airplanes!). But one thing I believe that really holds it back is its length and lack of a narrative climax. It has been some time since I watched it, but I recall it being drawn out and without (much of) a core story beyond the grand scale of the Battle of Britain. Midway had a similar format, but the film was tighter and the storyline was more focused on Charelton Heston’s character (and the relationship with his son).
The Dirty Dozen - This is a totally screwball film and I think the only reason I kind of like it are because of the actors involved. Even as a war film it strays into morbidity.
The Eagle Has Landed - I am not sure how many people actually know about this movie, which is based on a completely fictional novel. It stars Michael Caine, Donald Sutherland and Robert Duvall in a, again, fictional plot by the Germans to kidnap Winston Churchill from England. If you can stomach the craziness of the plot, which isn’t totally absurd, the actors involved make the film quite good, in my opinion. The story is fake, but interesting. Having watched it as a kid, I never questioned a very British Michael Caine playing a German officer.
Memphis Belle - This is by far the best air war over Europe film that has been made to my knowledge. I am amazed how real it seems for having been made in the early 1990s. The actors are pretty darn good and the whole story feels accurate, engaging and well crafted.
The Guns of Navarone - Lots of people deride this film for being completely made up and preposterous. Maybe so, but the cast is quite good and it is enjoyable at least because of their performance. I have always enjoyed it. It is also less of a battle movie and much more the sabotage/clandestine type.
Flags of our Fathers - This too is less of a battle film and actually a pretty introspective analysis of the war on a small group of guys. I think Clint Eastwood did a great job with it.
Letters From Iwo Jima - The Japanese counterpart to Flags of our Fathers. This was probably even better. I may even say it could go in the Top 10. For Americans especially, it provides a completely unique perspective of the war. It was highly moving and very well made. Clint Eastwood did an even better job here. Again the actors are great and it is extremely authentic; the whole film is basically in Japanese with english subtitles.
Sands of Iwo Jima - No relation to the above except in subject matter. This is a totally classic John Wayne film and one of my favorites for sure. As a piece of gritty, realistic cinema it doesn’t really belong up in the Top 10. But in terms of war film classics it probably does.
The Eagle Has Landed - I am not sure how many people actually know about this movie, which is based on a completely fictional novel. It stars Michael Caine, Donald Sutherland and Robert Duvall in a, again, fictional plot by the Germans to kidnap Winston Churchill from England. If you can stomach the craziness of the plot, which isn’t totally absurd, the actors involved make the film quite good, in my opinion. The story is fake, but interesting. Having watched it as a kid, I never questioned a very British Michael Caine playing a German officer.
If you like The Eagle has Landed, you should have a look at “Went the Day Well?” – the film I mentioned previously – because they share a key plot element: English-speaking German paratroopers dressed as British soldiers infiltrating a small British town to carry out a potentially war-winning secret mission.
Great post Hoff, I’ll look it over in more detail later and see what can be done, I also loved Memphis Belle.
@CWO:
If you like The Eagle has Landed, you should have a look at “Went the Day Well?” – the film I mentioned previously – because they share a key plot element: English-speaking German paratroopers dressed as British soldiers infiltrating a small British town to carry out a potentially war-winning secret mission.
Thanks Marc, I will have to look into that.
