Subjective Complaints about AAZ (Zombies are stupid thread)

@DouchemanMacgee:

Previous two posts

I would say something,  but for berevity’s sake, I’m in 100% agreement with DouchemanMacgee’s last two posts.

He’s spot on with my own observations and take on this.

My thoughts are:

AA Zombies but STILL no AA Stalingrad! That’s just… ugh. Terrible.

It would be hard to replicate the urban fighting in Stal.

The river crossing could be easily abstracted with die rolls.

Germans would have tanks, art. and inf. while the Russians would just have inf and maybe a little art.

Not a great balance.

A game on the Med. would be great though.

Naval land and air units. Spain to Iraq Italy to Egypt.

Americans come in late like in 1914. Germans/Italians/British/ANZAC/Neutrals, hell even Russians and if the map stretches east a bit, the battle of Stalingrad :evil:

Maybe I’ll look at making a map this coming winter…

I’d love to see a combined Battle of Britain/Battle of the Atlantic A&A game.

Britain getting squeezed, needs to decide to invest in destroyers, planes, or transports/land units for an attempted invasion.

Germans need to decide to invest in subs, planes, or transports/land units for an attempted invasion.

America limited in its ability to support.  Maybe a 3rd player.

Russian Front (or perhaps the tip of Africa) a wild card; as, if the Allies can successfully shift troops to either, the effect on Germany would be akin to an outsized Industrial Raid, simulating German forces pulled to other fronts.

First country to land troops on the other’s beach and hold for one round wins?  Or maybe just if Britain holds out for x amount of turns?  Maybe both?

Not sure that the A&A format really works well with the scale and vision of the game you propose… there’s only so much detail/focus that the A&A format works with.

A China/Asia Theater of Operations game could work, as a different take on the usual PTO game.

Factions:
Axis: Japan
Allies: Nationalist China/UK-India
Communist: Communist Chinese

Idea would be that Allies and Communists are fighting Japan as their primary objective, but can also fight each other. Once time expires, whichever Chinese faction holds more IPC/Victory Points/whatever in China wins. Japan wins if they can take certain objectives and hold them until time expires.

It always sort of bothered me that China in A&A is portrayed as this perfectly unified anti-Japan fighting force when in reality the Chinese were led by two main competing factions (along with several local warlords that I’m not going to bother getting into) that had only begrudgingly put their Civil War on hold to deal with the Japanese invasion.

@DouchemanMacgee:

It always sort of bothered me that China in A&A is portrayed as this perfectly unified anti-Japan fighting force when in reality the Chinese were led by two main competing factions (along with several local warlords that I’m not going to bother getting into) that had only begrudgingly put their Civil War on hold to deal with the Japanese invasion.

Yes, that’s the reason I gave the ChiCom forces a roundel in Shensi on my customized G40 map (see the “8 Pacific Left Panel.jpg” picture here: https://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=32700.0).  In fairness, however, I don’t think that Mao’s forces during the Japanese occupation of China were as strong (in either size or equipment) as they were during the Chinese civil war which followed WWII.  They had taken greatly depleted during the Long March, and I think that biggest operation they managed to pull against Japan was the Hundred Regiments Offensive.

I think people are overeacting to this.

At it’s worst, it’s a hilariously out of touch bid to increase the game’s fanbase by WOTC (seriously, the zombie theme is roughly a decade old). From what we’ve seen, it looks like an updated version of 1941 with more playability (the inclusion of cruisers and artillery is welcome), and the awkward addition of Zombies. Having played '41, I doubt the game itself will be that interesting, but it’s compatability with 1942 2nd Edition is definitely promising should the zombie thing actually work. I’m waiting on feedback before I invest.

As for it’s ‘disrespect towards ww2 veterans’, I’ll risk riling people up by saying that’s nonsense. It’s obviously not done in any air of disrespect, and will undoubtedly get some kids otherwise uninterested in history an unconventional, but still informative look at the war. I’ve taught a few history lectures, and I always try and find ways of packaging the material in a way that will resonate with the targeted audience, whether it be maps, videos, memes, etc. Heck, even the government during the war got it, look at their partnership with the rapidly growing comic book industry, which created some truly bizarre stories involving Superheroes and villains fighting on the front lines. If you think the zombies thing is new… well, check out DC Comic’s biography on Adolph Hitler’s fictional history, it basically implies he was tricked into starting the Second World War by a supervillain looking to create zombies.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Adolf_Hitler_(New_Earth)

That aside, I’m definitely hoping this is a one time thing, and the creative heads at WOTC look towards different time periods for variety instead. I mean, come on, I would play A&A: 1861 to death.

This is all a bunch of reacting in a vacuum.  You know that the person chosen to do this game would make their best attempt at making a fun new game.  They did that, and its different and fun.

Buy it, try it, stop reacting to the concept in isolation without understanding that the axa franchise, ruleset, and decision tree is solid but tried and a bit tired, and needed a shakeup that will make this a legit use of your money, time, and strategizing.

Quitting some amazing games because of one game that has the potential to be a flop is just nonsense to me.  Quit whining about it and think rationally for once.

My thinking is this: Zombies, really zombies, you have got to be kidding me! There is a 0% chance I will ever play this game with zombies on the board. The only chance in the world is if zombies get switched out for partisans, because zombies are F***ing stupid.

@Yavid:

My thinking is this: Zombies, really zombies, you have got to be kidding me! There is a 0% chance I will ever play this game with zombies on the board. The only chance in the world is if zombies get switched out for partisans, because zombies are F***ing stupid.

PS…. All that is the nice way of what I have been saying out loud to my wife about the game. She’s laughing at me so hard she’s going to pee herself.

Ok, first granted that AAZ is a bit silly and very pop-cultury.

However:

1. So what? If you don’t like purple, don’t use the purple crayon.
2. Having been at the preview last night, it’s great game for Halloween parties or after big games when no one wants to leave but everyone wants to play something fast.
3. If for every 100 zombie fans that play because of zombies ten of them buy the game, Hasbro/Wizards gets to keep chugging along. You may not like all their products, but many of us are a fan of at least some of their products and want to see the lines continued.
4. If for every 100 zombie fans that play a few of them pick up other A&A variants because they discover an interest in strategy games, Hasbro/Wizards gets to keep chugging along.
5. If even one of every 100 zombie fans that play starts playing other variants, you get to meet new and interesting people.

So yeah, it’s a bit silly. Who cares? The world can use a little more silly from time to time.

Marsh

So instead of a grand AA Collectors Edition or maybe an action card expansion or something, they come up with this crap.  My God, this game is terrible.  Can’t change my mind all you homers- this version is STUUUUUUUUUUPID. :x :x :x

While I completely understand your sentiments, I am personally willing to withhold final judgement/damnation until I actually play it. One of the ideas that does appeal to me is that each nation is, in essence, fighting their own war for survival. Alliances mean nothing if you aren’t there at the end!

Clearly it’s not meant for you. So the obvious solution is to not purchase it and continue to enjoy the game(s) you already have.

Au contraire, I dont think action cards, like the ones from D-day, have a rational place in A&A. It is first a plastic miniatures war game. Played by people that want to realize a military power fantasy. If you love card games, maybe poker is more your alley ?

Even if the zombie theme missed the major fan base, I belive all evolution is good. In A&A zombies the purchase of units is moved from the start to phase 7. Now you can purchase and mobilize units in one phase, saving time. I also think that phase 8 collecting income should be at the start of phase 7, saving even more time, and avoid doble dipping of contestet territories. Just imagine how much time the casual player spend to calculate what units he may need at the end of the turn. That is taken care of now. The next time thief is the endless swapping of territories defended by 1 inf. The next edition can take care of that by collecting income in phase 7, before you purchase and mobilize. Then we can spend less time on administrating and more time on strategies.

Second, because the majority of casual players are narrow mind, they dont like when the game depart to much from the historical correct path, like a German navy crossing the Suez canal and sailing into the Pacific, even if it did so in WWI, making the majority of players follow a scripted game. They make house rules for Vichy France and collapse of Italy, or make rules to punish a Japanese Tank push to Moscow, even if that is exactly what the Axis should have done to win the war. Of course the players are not aware of this forced thoughts. But my point being, A&A Zombies will set the players free. We know for sure there were never recorded any zombies or UFO’s in the real WWII, so now the A&A game is no longer a re-enactment or simulation of WWII, but a new game with no mental borders or straight jackets.

@questioneer:

So instead of a grand AA Collectors Edition or maybe an action card expansion or something…

But they did… it’s called “Axis and Allies Anniversary edition”… I suggest you get that instead and be happy.

Between 1941, 1942, Anniversary and Global… I’m not sure where else you can go with a WWII A&A title without repeating yourself beyond Zombies, Aliens or Kaiju…

This is like the 8th rage thread about this game can’t you just post one of those instead?

Thats because only you and one other guy like the zombies. Every thread has people that hate them and i have no idea why. Zombies are great! They need them in every game.