In the movie it seems like Sidious is actually in control of the situation and is using it to force Skywalker to betray the Jedi and become his apprentice. This would be consistent with Sidious being powerful enough to deceive Yoda and Windu for years.
On the other hand Sidious seems to have been injured during the confrontation with Windu. It’s not clear whether Sidious’ appearance had already been twisted by the dark side prior to the the battle with Windu (meaning his appearance as Palpatine was artifice) or if the injuries from the battle with Windu disfigured him.
I like this post
I like your last response too, Marc, just didn’t want to quote the whole thing :-)
@ABWorsham:
Here is a Star Wars question: If you were Mace Windu and discovered that Palpatine was the Sith Lord, and had your choice of any three Clone War era Jedi at your side for the confrontation, who would you choose?
Which three would you think would have the best chance to survive?
Obi-Wan, Anakin, and Yoda
@ABWorsham:
Here is a Star Wars question: If you were Mace Windu and discovered that Palpatine was the Sith Lord, and had your choice of any three Clone War era Jedi at your side for the confrontation, who would you choose?
Quinlan Voss, Ki Adi Mundi and Obi Wan
That’s right, Obi-Wan has proven himself as one of the best ever with a light saber. If only Anakin would have cooperated vs. Dooku…
P.S. Old Obi-Wan let Vader win! :-D :wink:
I go with Gamer here, Mace, Obi-Wan, Anakin and Yoda should cleary have a lot of synergy, being master-padawan for the middle two and Mace being padawan of Yoda, and Yoda being Yoda and holding his own vs Sidious, as seen (but lacking killer instinct, I guess because he felt most for the philosophy of always using the force in self defence, not aggressively - having beaten the foe is one thing, but is the killer blow then aggressive, or still defence?; the same is true,a s Gamer said, for Mace, I guess, at least to a lesser extent. It was almost as he sought acceptance from the only witness he had there before committing).
I didnt bother to check if there were martial arts specialists among the available Jedi on Corsucant (there are bound to be some who individually fight better than the mentioned three). In any case, it might not be a coincidence that both Yoda and Obi-Wan were away from Coruscant at the time (if memory serves right they were on Kashyyk and Utapau), its certainly possible Sidious manipulated it in that way (although we see that Yoda proactively says he will go to Kashyyk…still, with the attack on Kashyyk Sidious might have knbow that they send Yoda due to his special relations with the Wookies).
Yes, Sidious was able to hide himself, withdraw his force aura. Others could, Luke could it well I remember from the EU, as could his son. Coming back to an earlier post, Snoke must either be a grandmaster of that, or have no force ability at all. We will see.
Palpatines disfigurement I think quite clearly came from his own but reflected lightning. In any case changes should have been more stark after he revealed himself and overtly used his powers than the subtle manipulations during the CLone Wars. But I fully agree that he was likely always in full control vs Mace and needed it to look as dramatically as possible to effect the final click in Anakins already torn head. Which nicely worked. Had Windu taken Palpatine as prisoner, Anakin could have had continuous access with the hope to get the info out of Palpatine. All in all, I think the scene was ok. None of the Jedi really thought Palpatine would come at them with a red saber.
Generally speaking, though, there would be no movies without those totally illogical, totally absurd bad guy monologues to give the hero the chance to turn the table. Its incomprehensible to me that writers dont find better solutions that still keep up suspense. Ok, sure, in some cases its pathological for baddies, they need to show their supremacy over the opponent (Blofeld comes to mind, while Goldfinger had good reasons not to kill Bond in the last second), but for bad guys without that human weakness there are not many excuses.
I think the biggest disappointment for me was when Anakin so quickly gave in to Palpatine and killed Dooku. Yes, Anakin was conflicted and primed, but still.
Good stuff, enjoyed
You lose your title as my own personal Devil’s advocate…. :-(
Mace, Yoda, Oppo Rancisi and Po Koon would be my Clone War Era choices, although Oppo Rancisi was already dead that this point.
Perhaps this combination would have enough sense to not to confine themselves as a group in an entry way creating one large target.
I always had the impression that Palpatine was not defeated by Mace Windu, but rather allowed himself to be “beaten”, thereby putting himself in a vulnerable position for Anakin to sympathize with. It certainly is not beyond the realm of possibility considering how much orchestrating of events Palpatine conducted (successfully). I agree the writing is highly convenient, but I always got the impression that Palpatine’s defeat was purposeful on his part. Even after he is squirming on the floor and professing to be too weak, it is all deception because he very quickly unleashes a great deal of energy to finally blow Mace out the window.
And for the record Mace did try to kill Palpatine, but only at the very end and was stopped by Anakin cutting his arm off or something. Yes, too little, too late. But I doubt Palpatine was in any serious danger.
@CWO:
What fundamentally disappointed me about the Windu / Palpatine confrontation wasn’t the picky stuff I was criticizing in my above posts. It was the fact that the scene handled such a pivotal moment of the whole Star Wars saga – the moment when Anakin falls – in a way that was (in my opinion) so clumsy and so transparently contrived. It was a scene that deserved the highest level of writing of any scene in any Star Wars film, a scene that deserved to be both emotionally wrenching and utterly convincing…but instead of coming across as a first-rate moment of epic tragedy, in my opinion (and this is just my opinion) it came across as basically a connect-the-dots contrivance that checks off a plot point in Anakin Skywalker’s character arc.
Great statement. I agree entirely.
@ABWorsham:
Mace, Yoda, Oppo Rancisi and Po Koon would be my Clone War Era choices, although Oppo Rancisi was already dead that this point.
Perhaps this combination would have enough sense to not to confine themselves as a group in an entry way creating one large target.Â
You picked Oppo, Worsham?
Very good choice!
He would def. be a huge help in this skirmish against Darth Sidious and would have been able to prevent the death of all Jedis who fought against the Sith Lord. ( exception: Sidious kills him first of course :-D)
Since a few picked allready four Jedis. I also want to add one.
Herby my four Jedis are:
Quinlan Voss, Ki Adi Mundi, Obi Wan and Aayla Secura.
I did not pick four, the question was which three Mace should pick. Its Mace + any three :)
You are correct.
I am going to kick her out then. 8-)
@ABWorsham:
@ABWorsham:
Here is a Star Wars question: If you were Mace Windu and discovered that Palpatine was the Sith Lord, and had your choice of any three Clone War era Jedi at your side for the confrontation, who would you choose?
Which three would you think would have the best chance to survive?
The three Jedi with the best chance of survival when fighting Palpatine at Mace Windu’s side, and who are still alive at that point of the film, would be Yoda, Obi-wan and Anakin. Yoda because Yoda does later demonstrate in the film that he can survive (though not win) a fight against Palpatine. Obi-wan because Obi-wan later demonstrates in the film that he can survive (and win) a fight against Anakin, whose blood count and Force rating is quite probably higher than Palpatine’s. And Anakin for the simple reason that he and Palpatine have no reason to kill each other because they need each other and want to be on the same team.
@CWO:
And Anakin for the simple reason that he and Palpatine have no reason to kill each other because they need each other and want to be on the same team.
Yes, but Anakin is an unstable factor that could (and did) throw the entire operation. In terms of raw ability, Anakin should be up there with Yoda and Sidious, but you would also have to take into account the reality of the situation. Mace told Anakin to stay behind precisely because he was afraid how susceptible Anakin was to Sidious’ influence. Anakin almost contained himself, but ultimately felt the need to intervene.
I agree with Hoffman here.
Ani is to unstable.
Never go out unprepared. You never know.
After seeing the Rogue One trailer I’m convinced Star Wars should be renamed the Death Star Saga; Empire can now be referred to as “The One Without a Death Star.” I’d rather just play the superb arcade-style Rogue Squadron series.
After seeing the Rogue One trailer I’m convinced Star Wars should be renamed the Death Star Saga; Empire can now be referred to as “The One Without a Death Star.”
Actually, Episode 1 didn’t have a Death Star either.
But anyway, thanks for the tip about the trailer…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wji-BZ0oCwg
…which I’ve just watched. It’s just under two minutes long, but I actually enjoyed it way more than Episode VII.
After seeing the Rogue One trailer I’m convinced Star Wars should be renamed the Death Star Saga; Empire can now be referred to as “The One Without a Death Star.”
Well to be fair, this is not a “new” Deathstar (aka: Death Star III)… its’ the original Death Star (from Episode IV), and about the Rebellion’s stealing of the plans to find a way to destroy it (which some guy named “Luke” eventually does). Something about the Empire putting a trench, that leads directly to a button that leads directly to the core, that leads directly to exploding the entire thing up… someone at the Imperial Design Bureau seriously needs to be fired.
