• I’d say it would be 10 IPC based on the scale AnA does.


  • And 10 IPCs would help balance the game OOB too, if SZ125 was not the only gateway to it.


  • @wittmann:

    And 10 IPCs would help balance the game OOB too, if SZ125 was not the only gateway to it.

    Well if you want to do historical set up, you would need three paths, one from UK to Archangel, one from Persia going up north, and the last from Alaska to Far East but this one must be only non military equipment.


  • @Caesar:

    I’d say it would be 10 IPC based on the scale AnA does.

    D6
    Max LL 10 icps per turn.

    1. All destroyed
    2. Half gets through
    3. Half gets through
    4. All gets through
    5. All gets through
    6. All gets through

  • '17 '16 '13 '12

    British lend lease:

    Between June 1941 and May 1945, Britain delivered to the USSR:

    3,000+ Hurricanes
        4,000+ other aircraft
        27 naval vessels
        5,218 tanks (including 1,380 Valentines from Canada)
        5,000+ anti-tank guns
        4,020 ambulances and trucks
        323 machinery trucks
        1,212 Universal Carriers and Loyd Carriers (with another 1,348 from Canada )
        1,721 motorcycles
        £1.15bn worth of aircraft engines
        1,474 radar sets
        4,338 radio sets
        600 naval radar and sonar sets
        Hundreds of naval guns
        15 million pairs of boots

    Not bad…


  • Also with UK lend lease, it should be noted that some of those destroyers transferred were Lend Lease US destroyers.

  • '17 '16 '13 '12


  • @Omega1759:

    Interesting:

    http://www.historynet.com/did-russia-really-go-it-alone-how-lend-lease-helped-the-soviets-defeat-the-germans.htm

    It’s funny you brought that up because I can’t tell you how many arguments I have had with people who thinks that Lend Lease didn’t do anything for the allied war effort in the end.

  • '17 '16 '13 '12

    A mix of lend lease, action in North Africa, naval pressure, air pressure and commando raids. Add to this the fight in Greece, Crete, the battle of the Atlantic.

    In my opinion without Allied presence the Soviet Union collapses.


  • @Omega1759:

    A mix of lend lease, action in North Africa, naval pressure, air pressure and commando raids. Add to this the fight in Greece, Crete, the battle of the Atlantic.

    In my opinion without Allied presence the Soviet Union collapses.

    Watch out, some people here to try to argue that the Soviet Union won in Europe which is incorrect.

  • '17 '16 '13 '12

    @Caesar:

    @Omega1759:

    A mix of lend lease, action in North Africa, naval pressure, air pressure and commando raids. Add to this the fight in Greece, Crete, the battle of the Atlantic.

    In my opinion without Allied presence the Soviet Union collapses.

    Watch out, some people here to try to argue that the Soviet Union won in Europe which is incorrect.

    They probably spent 70% of the effort, but it doesn’t mean they could have won alone. Think about the troops deployed on the Atlantic wall, the air battles over Europe. The situation on the Eastern front in 1942-1943 would be quite different…


  • Well I hate the argument that is made because the Red Army destroyed Germany in the east and captured Berlin which obviously is true but it doesn’t take into account all the effort it took destroying their navy, “stopping” them from invading UK, all the help and supplies. I take the real argument, if you say the Red Army destroyed Germany by itself, then why did Stalin want UK and US to go from liberating Greece to begging them to open a huge front? The answer is that everyone who fought, was needed.

  • '17 '16 '13 '12

    The 60,000 aircraft shut down (not mentioning the slow down of German air production, pilot training, fuel production and impact on other industries). That alone appears quite decisive.

    One million personel tied down to man about 50,000 AA guns. An average of 5,000 shells were needed to shut down a bomber. Just the cost of producing the shells amounted for a significant fraction of the cost of producing the 4 engines bombers, and we know the considerable cost of UK and US strategic bombers.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_of_the_Reich


  • Remember, it took a while to know this:

    25% of Lend came to Archangel, 25% via Persia ( that’s why Soviets and British invaded Iran), and 50% from Soviet Far east ( Vladivostok)

    so if your modeling ocean bound supply routes ( convoy system) this is the division of total aid

    For example is using the 10 ipc figure, that’s 5 via the pacific route, 2-3 Persia, 3 white sea

  • '17 '16 '13 '12

    It always amazed me that the Japs would let US Lend Lease material sail to Vladivostok


  • @Caesar:

    Well I hate the argument that is made because the Red Army destroyed Germany in the east and captured Berlin which obviously is true but it doesn’t take into account all the effort it took destroying their navy, “stopping” them from invading UK, all the help and supplies. I take the real argument, if you say the Red Army destroyed Germany by itself, then why did Stalin want UK and US to go from liberating Greece to begging them to open a huge front? The answer is that everyone who fought, was needed.

    I think its more of an over compensation for every U.S. history book or movie that only shows the U.S. and maybe Brits kickin’ Nazi a**.


  • @Omega1759:

    It always amazed me that the Japs would let US Lend Lease material sail to Vladivostok

    Japan didn’t. USSR only allowed non combat equipment and they had to use USSR merchant ships otherwise if it was US, Japan would attack them.


  • Also the real reason why UK and USSR went into Persia was for two reasons; Oil and the fear of Persia joining the Axis powers as Iraq just did. It being occupied by the allies just made it easier to get supplies to USSR.

    Also once again, the pacific trade route would be the least amount due to USSR only taking non combat equipment like boots and food.

    Persia would be second.

    Archangel would be the most IPC’s due to both US, Canada, and UK sending equipment into this route.


  • @Caesar:

    Also the real reason why UK and USSR went into Persia was for two reasons; Oil and the fear of Persia joining the Axis powers as Iraq just did. It being occupied by the allies just made it easier to get supplies to USSR.

    Also once again, the pacific trade route would be the least amount due to USSR only taking non combat equipment like boots and food.

    Persia would be second.

    Archangel would be the most IPC’s due to both US, Canada, and UK sending equipment into this route.

    So you dont believe 5 icp or 50% comes in from pacific side?

    If you use my chart or not you would send 5 icps to the closest IC east of Moscow and 2 or 3 icps to the furthest IC south from Moscow and 2 or 3 icps to the IC furthest west and north of Moscow. Now you could build a tank here or there. If you send gr pieces using ships you would not get to build tanks using LL money. Otherwise only Russia could build tanks. Unless u delayed LL on a turn but you shouldnt get to.
    Id use my LL chart for all three LL amounts. 1 D6 roll for each try. Just me.  Until u know what happens u need to play test it both ways. Use chart or not to use chart.

  • '17 '16 '15

    @SS:

    @Caesar:

    I’d say it would be 10 IPC based on the scale AnA does.

    D6
    Max LL 10 icps per turn.

    1. All destroyed
    2. Half gets through
    3. Half gets through
    4. All gets through
    5. All gets through
    6. All gets through

    Looks good SS. Could make 4 and 5 half and increase to All 1 per rd. Makes it more complex but …

    @ CS thought some combat planes shuttled through the Pacific route. Don’t remember specifics. Could add planes to their route. Once again a bit more complex but if other routes can …

    Keeping in the spirit of the game, might as well let the country decide how much they want to send by each route. UK got a pile of stuff from the US too. Especially for Alamein. That would affect things as well. Once again, adding more complexity.

    Know their are a pile of HR’s out there that address that. DK has some good ones if I remember.

    Anyway, this was about aid to the soviets, so a good initial post

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