Here’s an idea for lend-lease: add a new unit type called “Supply Crate.”
Crates cost 5 IPCs each, can be built at any factory, can be loaded onto and unloaded from any transport as if they were an infantry unit (so a transport could carry 2 crates, or a crate and a tank, or a crate and an infantry, or any similar combination), and do not participate in combat. They move 1 territory per turn, but only during the non-combat move.
At the start of your turn, if there is a supply crate in a territory with a factory that you control, then you may convert it into 5 IPCs for your treasury. Each factory can only convert 1 crate per turn per IPC value of the territory. For example, if the British build 4 Supply Crates in London on UK1 and ship them to Archangel on UK2 using 2 transports, then those Supply Crates could be unloaded in Archangel on UK2 and then, on UK3, walk to Leningrad. On R4, Russia would see that it had supply crates in one of its territories with a factory, and convert 2 supply crates into 10 IPCs. Then, on R5, Russia could covert the remaining 2 supply crates into another 10 IPCs, for a total of 20 IPCs of lend-lease.
Also, if after combat there is a supply crate in a territory that you have just conquered, then you must immediately “loot” them by converting them into 3 IPCs each for your treasury. The money will remain in your treasury until your next regular opportunity to purchase units. There is no limit on how many crates you can loot in a single turn.
The Supply Crate would help facilitate the creation of a Canadian power (by giving Canada something to do besides just build fighters and fly them to Moscow, and by giving them a reason to maintain a navy), would help fill the otherwise lackluster 5-IPC slot in the unit roster, and would more realistically simulate the war and sea and the ability of the Russians to field massive armies later in the war using the economic might of the Western Allies. Instead of a stack of 30 Russian infantry with 6 British fighters, you could have a stack of 30 Russian infantry, 10 Russian artillery, and 2 Russian tanks – but only if you can keep the sea lanes reasonably clear.
Supply Crates could also be used as a less disruptive form of bidding in conventional G40: because supply crates don’t unbalance any turn 1 battles, they’re a gentler way of giving the Allies some extra economic oomph.
Good idea. Definitely worth trying out.
@Argothair can you bomb or destroy the SC’s?
@aequitas-et-veritas Sure! A roll of 5 or 6 on any bomber can be sacrificed (no damage) to destroy a Supply Crate in the target territory. So go ahead and roll for all your bombers. and then if you rolled some 5s or 6s and want to spend them that way instead of assigning them as damage, you can.
It’s intentionally inefficient because a crate of oil, spareparts, aluminum, etc. is probably less visible, more mobile, and smaller than an average factory or airstrip, but they could still be blown up if you get lucky.
hmm…don’t understand with the bombing. One designates it’s target, AB, NB, Factory and ? Supply Crate ? Or are you saying you can take any bombing hit and apply it to the SC ?
Was thinking target SC and 5 and over kills it and everything else subtracts from it’s value ? No AA I’m thinking ?
Obviously can be killed in transport too if sunk
I wouldn’t bother subtracting from its value; that sounds tedious.
If you prefer designating a target in advance, I would say get through the anti-aircraft fire, and then if you make your run against the crate and roll a 4, 5, or 6, then the crate is destroyed. On a roll of 1, 2, or 3 the crate is unharmed.
And, yes, if transport is sunk, your supplies are too! Just like any cargo.
ok I’m just thinking how it works against current AB, NB, Factory. You can’t build as much when hit. So not quite the same then.
wow 4,5,6 is basically 50% that seems pretty steep. I think i’m still not quite grasping it. Can you do a play by play in detail :)
Don’t you have to target what you want to bomb before AA in regular game ? Am I wrong on that ?
ok I’m thinking you can only bomb it when it’s on land before it’s turned into dough. No AA fire and 1-3 kills it.
You’d still have to specify it as a target though ? For Bombing it and not w/e else is there ?
So does Canada have there own income ?
UK buying supply tokens T1 make sea lion defense weaker ?
Is it gonna make minor countries weaker buying or using transport that they need and don’t need ?
Can UK afford to spend money on supply’s and taking away Transports that they need for Europe invasions ?
Is Norway going to be the spot for allies landings every game now ?
I’m in favor of LL. I have played 3 different kinds.
I think if you buy a supply token it becomes a cargo ship. If you don’t want to use cargo ships then use a transport on top of supply token.
Also if you buy a supply token you receive the ship free.
Now you can bomb it in port. A roll of 1 kills it.
Any AA gun in port can Defend too. If it has a naval base then the base gets a AA gun defense shot to against a ship. This depends on if naval bases have built in aa guns.
Same if it’s at sea travel. If it’s with ships then it’s up to defender to choose. This depends on your ship casualty rules.
Also the cargo ship supply token should get to move 2.
Just idea here. I use a LL piece chart for Russian. Kinda like Sitedblood’s if that helps if cargo supply ships don’t work out in this game.
Another one is each country starts with cargo ships and if it makes it to an allies port then they receive the cargo. Could be a free piece or money. In one game I have cargo ships can move 6 but if an enemy ship is in path it stops it from moving. Route drawings is an option here but unlikely in this game.
I also always felt a ship should get to shore shoot it too. Just like a sub could sink it too.
Not trying to go off topic here but why not give Russia tankograd factory ? They receive 1 free tank per turn.
Plus they use LL chart. No allies allowed in Russia period.
Lend Lease
Just ideas to help if at all
I’m glad people are interested in this idea!
That said, I really don’t have strong opinions about the best way to adjudicate bombing runs on supply crates. That’s just not the part of the house rule that excites me. I would ideally want to keep the bombing rules very simple, so as not to require a lot of accounting or distract attention from other parts of the game, but if you have a set of complicated bombing rules that you and your friends enjoy, then go wild. There’s nothing wrong with that.
If you’re looking for my ideal bombing rules, I will try to explain them one more time:
These rules should generate slightly less economic payoff than ordinary strategic bombing…if your bomber gets through, you do an average of 2.5 damage, instead of 3.5 damage on a successful regular run. If you want more damage, you can allow hits on rolls of 3, as well.
As far as Canada having its own separate economy, yes, that’s certainly part of what I’m envisioning here, although you can use the Supply Crate rules even if you have no interest in switching up the British economies. I would ideally like to have four English-speaking powers:
British Empire would be UK + Iceland + Gibraltar + British Africa + India + Malaya + Hong Kong, and anything they conquer or liberate during the game. The Indian major factory is downgraded to two minor factories: one in India, and one in West India.
Canada would get +1 IPC each in British Columbia (allows purchase of a minor factory if desired), Yukon (becomes passible), and Newfoundland, as well as an NO for clearing Axis subs from the Atlantic worth about 3 IPCs/turn. Alberta would start with an extra tac bomber, Hudson Bay would start with an extra DD, and Ontario would start with an air base. If anyone knows of other NOs that would make sense thematically for Canada, I’m open to suggestions. Politically, Canada is treated like ANZAC, i.e., it starts off at war with Germany and Italy, and it will declare war on Japan as soon as Japan is at war with UK and/or ANZAC. It can declare an unprovoked war on Japan if desired, but that keeps the USA out of the war for longer.
The lack of Canadian income would make Britain slightly more vulnerable to Sea Lion…but you can now spend Indian income to protect London if you want, so there is still plenty of flexibility for the Allies in terms of which English-speaking countries will come under early attack. If you build nothing in India, you would wind up having more money to spend in London than in a standard OOB G40 game.
I see what your getting at with one UK economy. Money to counter sea lion T1
And counter India crush T2 or vice versa
Canada should have at least 7 income. This way they can buy a destroyer or tranny. Once they get the NO can buy a fig.
I don’t know what Canada makes now but you could make Quebec worth 3 for an upgraded factory. But highly unlikely unless it becomes the new London capital but I don’t think this rule is in game
I check on them and don’t see really another NO unless maybe give them a free supply token per turn. What I mean is from history if I’m correct they never received a cent from US and by 1943 were suppling half of the convoys and by end of 44 most of it.
Average Canadian citizen paid more in taxes than anybody else.
Her supplies went to the United Nations.
End of 44 it was 4 billion which was more dollar per capital than our LL.
Anyway that’s that.
So with 1 UK economy then they start with 45 income ? I’m going off of g40 Uk Europe 28
Uk India 17 if this is correct. Well if Canada makes 7 icps then u would subtract that from UK income of 45 = Uk 38 income.
Or are you looking at keeping Uk at 45 income and giving Canada 7 so there’s no bid now also with your tweaks ?
Now if u upgrade to a major in India will they be strong enough down the road to deny Japan a victory or axis ?
@SS-GEN That’s right, British economy would start at 28 + 17 - 7 = 38 IPCs.
You can spend 20 of that on upgrading the India factory on UK1 plus 18 IPCs on 6 infantry for India on UK1 if you really want to…but now London has zero defense for sea lion, and if London falls then you are not going to be able to use the India factories!
More realistically, if Japan leaves India alone and Germany leaves London alone then maybe by uk3 or so you can upgrade the India factory and hold India for the full game.
@Argothair said in Supply Token for Lend-Lease:
@SS-GEN That’s right, British economy would start at 28 + 17 - 7 = 38 IPCs.
You can spend 20 of that on upgrading the India factory on UK1 plus 18 IPCs on 6 infantry for India on UK1 if you really want to…but now London has zero defense for sea lion, and if London falls then you are not going to be able to use the India factories!
More realistically, if Japan leaves India alone and Germany leaves London alone then maybe by uk3 or so you can upgrade the India factory and hold India for the full game.
Right.
Right on. I see what your saying now. I think triplea should support this. I’ll look into it and see what it would take to add it as an option.
I just reread everything and think the only thing triplea can’t do is the different bombing hits. It will have to be treated as if it’s a minor factory with no ability to repair.
Shouldn’t be too complicated since that’s how the other bombing targets work.
Think damage would be ok too, as in only part of the cargo got destroyed, but if one was playing ftf your bombing rules would work fine as well.
Maybe if it’s damaged it can’t be looted. Not sure if that could be done or not.
At any rate, i think it’s a cool idea :)
Argo
Here’s a few more NOs that I’ve played in other games for Canada.
2 icps for 1 warship in N Atlantic certain szs
2 icps for 1 warship in Atlantic certain szs
Same as no axis subs in certain sea zones maybe and or need a ship in these szs to get money
3 icps when US is at war with Axis this would take a load off Canada’s lend lease historically
Or as mentioned give Canada a 1 free supply token per turn
There’s a few more but mostly if allies in certain territories Canada receives more money but I
Don’t like them mostly unless it’s an actual
Canadain ground unit there. Like if an Canada inf gets in Normandy receive 2 or 3 icps.
Or maybe give Canada 3 icps per turn if UK Europe controls all there territories but don’t know how deep you want to go.
In one game I’ve seen Canada collect up to 13 icps per turn and another game up to 20 which to me was crazy. Canada was taking African territories
