I always like it for the Turkish invasion idea however I never invaded neutrals before mostly because you’re basically giving all the neutrals on the map to the Allies since 90% of neutrals already are close to the allies.
That is a good point, but if you knock out Sweden, Turkey and Spain (all at once, then possibly portugal) as the Axis, the allies only have Saudi, Afghani, 2 x 2 in SA and 2 x1 in Africa, which is a grand total of $8 and a bunch of men stranded at the edges of the board. So, if the plan wins you the game or leads to that, it is worth it, because the key 3 (STS) are where most of the money, men and position come from in the balance.
No I get that. I want to experiment with a complete world smash and just go for critical elements. As you said, Sweden, Turkey, and Spain, would be powerful in German hands but also, I don’t like the idea of South American and Africa going to the allies. Sure the allies will have to transport those units and money but they have the navy (and usually the freedom) to do it.
Ok, another aspect to consider is that unless the Allies know you are about to violate, they wont necessarily have the troops they need in the correct position to activate all of those at once, or the ships. If they suspect it, it is much easier to prepare to take advantage.
Because the Allies tend to be “over the $$ hump” at that point in the game, the $8 added and expended Axis effort used to attack the neutrals, could make a big difference over time. If you as the Axis violator can win the game in 4 or fewer turns, I say do it. If your game is long and slow (eg triple AAA slog) then the Allies could take advantage of your gambit and grind you down.
The big part about doing an Axis neutral attack is that in order to get ready to kill S/T/S Germany and Italy have to be moving away or sideways from their primary objectives and setting up for the neutral attack for +2 turns, which is a distraction, and a clue about what you’re about to do.
The dynamic of the true neutrals is interesting and it centers around Spain and Turkey.
Allies do not want to enter Spain to early, launching pad for the USA onto the continent because it opens up Turkey and the back door for Germany into the middle east.
The opposite is in effect also. Germany does not want to DOW on Turkey because that just leaves Spain wide open for a USA landing and free troops.
Also Axis suffer more from a DOW on turkey because it does open up the entire board and free IPC to the USA mainly. Granted they have to divert some TRS to the edges of the map but they do not have to fight for those IPC either.
UK also gets put in a bind with Turkey also if the Allies go into Spain. It opens up one more “path” of attack they need to worry about now. Regardless if they plan for the Spain violation and attack Turkey at the same time. UK will get a violent German response to push the turkey front. Especially if there is major IC in Romania. Germany can start flooding Turkey with Mech and ARM with in 2 turns from that factory.
All good points. When the Axis violate in our club group, they target all 3 of S/T/S on one turn. Any other plan could lead to disaster as UK gets a big stack for Turkey if it adds a mobility element.
The only Allied strategy that I know of that really takes advantage is the YG Spain/Cross (discussed last year). Short version, its a 1 turn shuck-shuck for US ground troops. I haven’t personally used this since we all hashed it out (playing 42.2 this year), especially because UK may or may not be able to take turkey, but not Sweden, and Switzerland…etc.
I’d like to when our G40 games restart. The neutrals thing for both teams is mostly a fun surprise, not a consistent road to victory… except where economic victory rules are being used (tournament timed play). Then, they can be game-winning.
My group is starting up a new 1940 game tonight and Iam playing Germany/Italy. Iam going to go with this major IC plan in Romania and see what comes of it. I will let you guys know and offer a battle report so to speak.
Heck, if I get “froggy” I might video recap the game and have my son post it on You Tube.
Yeah, I never liked Spanish Beachhead because USA has to fight it’s way on it and then factory it and that depends if Germany left a small force on France but the plus is that it opens up other neutrals to it.
My group is starting up a new 1940 game tonight and Iam playing Germany/Italy. Iam going to go with this major IC plan in Romania and see what comes of it. I will let you guys know and offer a battle report so to speak.
Heck, if I get “froggy” I might video recap the game and have my son post it on You Tube.
I would be happy if I was playing the allies, for all the reasons posted above.
I have done the black sea fleet thing. There are far more cost efficient ways to get into Caucasus or Egypt. But if you do want to try it, don’t forget you need an airbase in Greece and a destroyer in case Russia drops a sub out of Ukraine to stop you from loading transports.
I didn’t think a submarine makes the sea zone hostile, so the transports could still load. If there is a warship there they could also ignore the submarine and amphibious assault.
Ah that’s right. I gues the fear was that the sub could take a shot at the carrier
I would always equip any surface fleet with destroyers just in case of submarine attacks.
@Caesar:
I would always equip any surface fleet with destroyers just in case of submarine attacks.
What?
So you build a fleet in the Black Sea, a land locked sea zone and you are afraid that Russia will build a Sub in the Black Sea? The only concern of a fleet in the Black Sea is from air power, mainly UK/USA air power.
@Caesar:
I would always equip any surface fleet with destroyers just in case of submarine attacks.
What?
So you build a fleet in the Black Sea, a land locked sea zone and you are afraid that Russia will build a Sub in the Black Sea? The only concern of a fleet in the Black Sea is from air power, mainly UK/USA air power.
You just never know!
Speaking of the Black Sea fleet, making sz 100 a convoy zone would be a good mod.
Ok we finally finished our game, took 4 game sessions and the axis go down in flames at the end of J11 and “we” storm away cursing and cussing about bad luck and so forth.
Now to the discussion at hand of major IC in Romania.
** Warning, this is just one game which forms the basis of my post action report **
G1 went all in and bought the Major IC in Romania
G2 bought 10 mech in Romania
G3 bought 6 mech and 4 ARM in Romania
G4 bought 6 mech and 4ARM In romania
So, those where the first three purchases in Romania.
Germany goes in on a G2 attack on Russia.
The majority of the forces dedicated to France go the Northern Route and the Romania builds go south.
Time warp to G4. Germany has Leningrad but it is not a sold hold as the Russians are stacking in Belarus and do one counter attack into the Baltic states.
The southern path is opening up. Germany has pushed up to the gates of Moscow and threatening blitz’s into the oil fields and opening up the middle east which has a IC in persia.
Italy is going bonkers in the MED and has a huge fleet. This was mistake #1, instead of building mass Italian land units, mech/arm I elected to go heavy on fleet and it totally discombobulated the UK and that is a story in its self.
Mistake #2 was Germany stacked all its planes on G3 in Eastern Ukraine, with only 2 mech with them. Russia took advantage of that mistake and sent in a suicide squad of 4 mech and 2 ARM and all their air power. Dice came up cold for Germany and we eliminated each other to a man BUT Germany had 0 air power left on the Russian front and only 2 FTR and 2 STR left in West/Med.
Mistake #3 was that Japan lost its mind, got mired down in China, blew it on the money island rush, waited to long to threaten India, which turned into Moscow East and then the USA fleet started decimating the Japan fleet, taking 1/1 losses and laughing as Japan could not replace its fleet.
My partner and I re organized our forces and fended off the Allies for multiple turns and then on G9 went all In on the final stand of the Axis. Germany goes into Moscow on a 15% attack, loses, Send in a force of TRS into London, which was lightly defended at this point on a 25% attack and lost and went all in on Egypt on a 45% attack and lost. Germany just threw every thing into attacks and they all failed. Japan did the same in India and failed.
Now, back to the major IC in Romania. Here is what I found.
#1 Getting 10 MECH/ARM 1 turn closer to the south of Russia is very nice.
#2 it creates a lot of pressure on Russia to defend the south heavier than they normally would in the opening turns of the war since the Northern Route is easier for Germany.
#3 in the late game it was nice because it put Russian units advancing into Poland in a two stack attack. One from Germany and the other from Romania. That alone bought Germany about 2 turns as Russia was very leery of advancing into Poland.
#4 the downside is you spend your entire first turn build on a factory and lose X number of troops.
#5 the Black Sea gambit sounds fun to talk about but in reality there was no way Germany could spend IPC on making said fleet and defending it from allied air power.
SO, next time Iam going to try the Yugoslavia minor with Germany. Opens up the Med for ships in a protected sea Zone and gives the advantage of putting mech/arm on the southern front of Russia to push east.
** Foot Note**
The other downside was that since I committed to the MIC in Romania I decided to go all in on it also. Thus I was building 0 Navy and 0 Air Power. Not building air power crippled me in the mid game.
Thanks for the game review. I have bought a late game Polish IC, but cannnot justify the Major in Romania . Would a G2 10 Art build have been a better idea ?
@wittmann:
Thanks for the game review. I have bought a late game Polish IC, but cannnot justify the Major in Romania . Would a G2 10 Art build have been a better idea ?
I dont think so and here is why.
the main idea of the Romania MIC was being able to throw MECH/ARM into southern Russia at a faster rate. They can blow through Bessarbia and into E. Ukraine or the southern factory of Russia on one move.
10ART on G2 purchase in Romania would not arrive at the front until G4 or maybe even G5 depending on how far you could advance in the south. 10 ART is a fine build in Germany or W. Germany if you have some TRS because they can get to the Northern Front one turn faster and threaten Belarus/Lenningrad or maybe New York.
Now another thought I had was just to stack Eastern Poland, build the MIC in Romania and divert ALL German attacking units on a Southern Attack en mass instead. Hold off/stall the Russians in the North and see what they do. Go for Stalingrad/Moscow/Oil as the primary opening attack moves from Germany. Next game I will play the Allies so we will have to wait and see if I try that next time I play Germany.
If the idea is to control southern USSR and let northern USSR alone with a IC Romania then you should really debate about going after Persia and then decide to go east to India or west to Egypt.
