Major IC in Romania

[larrymarx]

So what type of Russia invasion would you propose that leaves the UK feeling like they might still be a target?

[Caesar-Seriona]

Straight infantry build followed by a naval build is the best sign of Germany either going west or east because you can straight up fake Sea Lion and take the fleet and just dump an invasion against USSR in the north.

[larrymarx]

Well, what you propose is probably a viable strategy, but it’s very specialized and the fact that it threatens both the UK and USSR doesn’t mean it’s the best strategy and we should all adopt it. Also, my question would be whether the dual threat and the immediate capture of the Leningrad objective can offset all the income from the south you’re foregoing and all the money you spent on transports without taking London.

Back to the original point: unless you build full naval for a turn as in the Sealion fake that you propose, UK is going to realize pretty fast that it isn’t the target whether or not Germany has built a Romania IC, so the “giveaway” of Germany’s strategy isn’t really an argument against the Romania major.

Keep in mind that buying the factory on turn 2 after an ambiguous buy on turn 1 does slow down the UK for a turn by forcing them to account for the possibility of Sealion. Also, if the UK lets down their guard, you could consider a late Sealion under some circumstances. In this case, the Romania IC could help because you can drop 10 infantry a turn to link up with your forces as you retreat from Moscow or to defend your territory if you decide to send the initial wave of troops south to the Middle East. The factory also opens up more strategies that don’t involve spending every dime on the Eastern front. For example, you could strengthen your air force instead of buying expensive ground units.

What I’m getting at is that the Romania major may actually help you target the UK in the long run, or at least keep the option open.

[Requester45]

Honestly I have come to like the “Dark Skies” strategy but with my own little twist. In reality you don’t need more than about 10 bombers maybe even 8 would do the trick. For me the Luftwaffe is the key to German success, and this has been tried and true for me. I try to stack the eastern front, while building planes in Western Germany. This threatens the UK keeping them occupied, and with the range of the bombers, even a small amount of German ground units can be effective. For instance if Germany only had 10 infantry (from Berlin) and a few artillery with maybe a tank or two push for Novgorod and used 10 bombers in support, it would take a hell of alot or Russian troops to stop that. Further and further into the game, Germany produces Mechs and Tanks to push push push while the Luftwaffe just decimates anything in its path. I think that the proper G1 purchase is a destroyer, transport, and Heavy Bomber. The following turn with around 70 IPC’s you can purchase 5 Heavy Bombers and a tank or two. This would put you already at 8 bombers as well as plenty of fighters and tacs to handle business. It becomes very difficult for Russia to stop a strong Luftwaffe.

[Caesar-Seriona]

I’m not saying my strait is perfect. I am just pointing out a plan that UK and USSR can’t tell which is being invaded first. I feel a major in Romania is a sign that UK is going to be ignored.

[Cow]

Check it out. Major IC = 30 ipc right? That is 30 infantry that could be mechanized.

[larrymarx]

But you can’t mechanize artillery.

[aequitas-et-veritas]

A minor IC in W.Ukraine will do the job if you prefer to build an IC.

With a G1 build IC in Romania, your options are really limited.

If i would be the Allied player and it is my UK turn, my Buy will be an AB for Gib. pr Egypt  and an IC for Egypt.
No need to stack London since your Initiative in London is gone.

A mid game IC would be interesting in Romania if i see Russia stacking up like a King and a neutral crush (NC) is in sight but that depends on my income as an Axis player.

As Germany you want to be aggressiv.
“Nicht kleckern sondern klotzen” was Guderians Motto wich means to not come in low, come in massive!

AetV

[Karl7]

Ah, the old MIC in Romania…. that used to be an old standby strategy in the early days when G40 first came out…

But the strategy wained with time for all the reasons stated above.  It’s such a heavy investment depriving Germany of early units and telegraphs pretty loudly Germany’s strategy.  (screaming actually)

I think the better move is to buy a couple transports and shuck infantry from Berlin to Leningrad.  You basically get the same result (i.e. infantry 4 moves way from Moscow) and less cost and more benefits:  4 transports (plus 1 on board) for 28 instead of 30 for a MIC that can’t be redeployed like the transports.

Of course there is the issue the Romanian MIC covers the southern flank of the Eastern front, but usually that resolves itself once Germany can stack Bryansk.

But, hey, sometimes old ideas can make a comeback.  Maybe there is something there that can be rejuvenated.  I will think on this…  :lol:

[PainState]

@Karl7:

Ah, the old MIC in Romania…. that used to be an old standby strategy in the early days when G40 first came out…

But the strategy wained with time for all the reasons stated above.�  It’s such a heavy investment depriving Germany of early units and telegraphs pretty loudly Germany’s strategy.�  (screaming actually)

I think the better move is to buy a couple transports and shuck infantry from Berlin to Leningrad.�  You basically get the same result (i.e. infantry 4 moves way from Moscow) and less cost and more benefits:�  4 transports (plus 1 on board) for 28 instead of 30 for a MIC that can’t be redeployed like the transports.

Of course there is the issue the Romanian MIC covers the southern flank of the Eastern front, but usually that resolves itself once Germany can stack Bryansk.

But, hey, sometimes old ideas can make a comeback.�  Maybe there is something there that can be rejuvenated.�  I will think on this…�  :lol:

Well, it seems I stumbled through a bush and stuck my foot into the skeleton of a old, has been, 1940 tactic.

Maybe those old hand, discarded tactics need to make a come back. Instead of the standard opening turn moves that are all the rage or the classic mad man rush to Moscow and if I do not win by the end of Turn 8 I quit plan of attack.  :lol:

:-D :-o

[Ichabod]

Keep in mind that in the G40 1st edition, Berlin had a minor IC on it (I think). I believe that was the reason that a major or minor IC was often placed on Romania. That would have been done in those days probably whether Sea Lion was going to happen or not.

[taamvan]

The answer?

Mechanized Infantry Instead.

You already have 26 production spaces, plus 6 more Russian ones.  After you grab the frontline Russian factories, Romania fades.  Wouldn’t it make more sense to spend the 30+30 (to buy there the 2nd turn) to instead buy 5 bombers to ensure the above occurs?

[Caesar-Seriona]

@taamvan:

The answer?

Mechanized Infantry Instead.

You already have 26 production spaces, plus 6 more Russian ones.   After you grab the frontline Russian factories, Romania fades.   Wouldn’t it make more sense to spend the 30+30 (to buy there the 2nd turn) to instead buy 5 bombers to ensure the above occurs?

Good point, and it’s not like the USSR player is going to stack units on the western flank, s/he can’t defend it.

[simon33]

@aequitas:

A minor IC in W.Ukraine will do the job if you prefer to build an IC.

Quite. The combination of 6 artillery/turn from Ukraine & W Ukraine plus a bunch of Mech inf from Leningrad and Germany is enough. Indeed, German income can’t really support even that, let alone a major IC on Romania.

[larrymarx]

Ok, you guys have brought me around. I’m going to try the W. Ukraine factory in my next few games.

[Zhukov44]

Germany is the last power who should be thinking about building additional production.  You start with 2 major factories and you acquire 2-3 more minor factories in the early part of the game.

[simon33]

@Zhukov44:

Germany is the last power who should be thinking about building additional production.  You start with 2 major factories and you acquire 2-3 more minor factories in the early part of the game.

Possibly an overstatement? UK starts with 1 major 2 minor and don’t get the same income uplift and you wouldn’t say they don’t need a factory.

Germany have a lot of difficulty in getting artillery to Moscow in large numbers. Using Bombers or tanks to provide attack doesn’t provide the same bang for buck.

[Zhukov44]

If Germany wants extra artillery they should buy it the first 2 rounds.

It’s more efficient for Germany to purchase mechanized units (which are more versatile than inf/art anyway) than buying an extra major or minor IC.  Germany can also capture Karelia and Ukraine and build artillery there if need be.

I’m not a big believer in extra UK ICs either, but at least there are good justifications for buying an Egypt or (on occasion) a Persia IC.

[larrymarx]

Doesn’t it depend on Germany’s overall strategy?

If Germany is trying to take Moscow as fast as possible, then the starting IC’s are enough.

If something goes wrong or if Germany is just trying to seize and hold income producing territories, they could make use of additional IC’s on the front.

[Elsaß-Lorraine]

@larrymarx:

Doesn’t it depend on Germany’s overall strategy?

If Germany is trying to take Moscow as fast as possible, then the starting IC’s are enough.

If something goes wrong or if Germany is just trying to seize and hold income producing territories, they could make use of additional IC’s on the front.

Like if Germany has to dig in and build up for a few turns, an extra factory in Russia would be more efficient and cheaper (unit-wise) because it’s more effective and less costly to build 3 infantry in a factory 1 turn away from your army than it is to build those same infantry, or even mechs, back in Germany or Western Germany.  It lets Germany produce a larger amount of cheap cannon fodder, in the form of infantry, than they would be able to if they only had 1-2 factories producing infantry in Russia and the western factories producing more expensive mechanized units that need to get to the front faster.