More on religion….

[Guest]

Yep, let’s just pay out $600 million for the hell of it.

Goddess forbid they go to trial if they are INNOCENT and pay NOTHING…  :roll:

[Jennifer]

@ncscswitch:

I think the Vatican has the cash to spare…

Who knows, if the corporate hierarchy has to pay for it, perhaps next time they will do a better job of policing their own, instead of just sending them to a knew place with fresh victims to molest…

Wow.  You sure you arn’t a liberal and anti-capitalist?  That’s almost verbatim right out of the Communist Economic/Market playbook.

We need MAJOR tort reform in this nation.  If it were not for lawsuits, we’d be able to go see the doctor for $10/hr and get major surgery done for a few hundred bucks instead of tens of thousands of dollars.

[Guest]

No dear, that is TOTALLY Capitalist.

If they have an economic negative occur as a result of failure to apply adequate controls on the performance of their employees while at work, then perhaps they will in the future do a better job of overseeing their employees activities at work.

That is 100% market driven correction… cash being the encouraging factor to prevent their priests from molesting more little boys.

I expect my accountant to be honorable, ethical and to be competent at math and tax law.  If he is not, then there is economic sanction (via litigation and lost business) for failure to do what is expected.
Why should an organized religious leader be held to any less of a standard (especially with how important organized Christian religion is to so many folks in this nation)… Enron is a MINOR entity to be held accountable for their ethics and performance compared to the Catholic Church, and Enron was ONLY cash, not homosexual abuse of minors…

[Jennifer]

You want to impose penalties on business from the government.

Totally capitalist would say no government intervention, if the consumers dislike the practices, they won’t shop there and the business will go out of business.

Captialism is punishing Citgo, at least out here.  They’re paying a fortune on advertisements trying to convince Americans here they are a good company to buy for, meanwhile, they are closing up gas stations left and right from the boycott out here.  There’s only 1 out of a dozen + Citgos left on my route.  And none of the affiliates carry their gas anymore.

That is capitalism at work.

Governments “punishing” business “on behalf of the people” whether by court or legislation is communism.

[Guest]

A law suit is not GOVERNMENT punishment.  It is ARBITRATION.

A neutral party hears the evidence and issue a ruling based on the law.

And in this case the Catholic Church is apparently scared shitless of being found guilty, and thus has settled every single lawsuit rather than face a jury (because they know that they did not keep their priests from abusing little boys perhaps?)

[Jennifer]

Who appoints the Judge presiding over the case?
Who pays the Judge presiding over the case?
Who enforces the judgement of the Judge presiding over the case?

It most assuredly IS government intervention into business practices.  Sometimes it might be warranted, sometimes not.  But it is government intervention either way.

[Guest]

It is the closest thing to neutral party that we have.

But, based on your view of the Schiavo case in another thread, as well as your posts in other threads, I understand why you vie wthe judiciary as somthing other than a neutral arbitration entity (though I largely disagree with you on that perception)

[Jennifer]

There are neutral arbiters.  You and the person holding a grudge against you can go out, interview professional arbiters and select one together for a binding resolution.  With that, I’d say you can have a neutral effect from the Government.  They still need government papers, so it is still government intervention into capitalism, but it’s mostly benign at that point.

However, you believe Judges are fair?  Try to fight a speeding ticket, at least in Cook County.

a) Your accuser is not present.  Some officer representing all departments in cook county fills in for him.
b) Even if you manage to convince the judge you were not speeding, you STILL pay the fine.

Want to make it fair?  Jury trials for every court case, I don’t care if it’s for jay walking.  Judges are limited to determining if evidence is fair and legal and in issuing sentences for convicts.  No more rulings from the bench.

Until then, the judicial system is a tyrannical wing of the US Government.

[Guest]

Sorry, but when the Arch diocese starts apologizing for the “lost innocence” of people that were sexually abused by priests, call that an open and shut case of ADMITTING that they failed to control their employees.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070716/ap_on_re_us/church_abuse_42

LOS ANGELES - Cardinal Roger Mahony, leader of the nation’s largest Roman Catholic archdiocese, apologized Sunday to the hundreds of people who will get a share of a $660 million settlement over allegations of clergy sex abuse.

“There really is no way to go back and give them that innocence that was taken from them. … The one thing I wish I could give the victims, I cannot,” he said.

“Once again, I apologize to anyone who has been offended, who has been abused. … It should not have happened and should not ever happen again.”

[Jennifer]

@ncscswitch:

Sorry, but when the Arch diocese starts apologizing for the “lost innocence” of people that were sexually abused by priests, call that an open and shut case of ADMITTING that they failed to control their employees.

Oh yea, forgot, in your world the Catholics are ALL christians.  There are no protestants or luthurens or mormons or non-demoninational or episcipalitans or any other sects, JUST catholics.

[Guest]

@Jennifer:

@ncscswitch:

Sorry, but when the Arch diocese starts apologizing for the “lost innocence” of people that were sexually abused by priests, call that an open and shut case of ADMITTING that they failed to control their employees.

Oh yea, forgot, in your world the Catholics are ALL christians.  There are no protestants or luthurens or mormons or non-demoninational or episcipalitans or any other sects, JUST catholics.

WTF are you talking about  :?

[Jermofoot]

@ncscswitch:

Yep, let’s just pay out $600 million for the hell of it.

Goddess forbid they go to trial if they are INNOCENT and pay NOTHING…  :roll:

That’s what I was going to say.  I’m sure proving you are innocent would cost less than $660 million, but if you are not…

[balungaloaf]

the juries will be from liberal areas anyways.  the people who do this arent dumb.  they will go to were the people already will give the theives their cash to punish the church not for the crime with no evidence, they’ll just punish it b/c they dont agree with its policies towards gays, abortion, etc.  the liberals would salivate at the chance.

you see how its a lose lose situation.  the church just decided that a priest going to court, getting railroaded, and having the liberal media have a hayday with it isnt worth it.

and that quote from the cardinal, of course he’ll say something like that.  if he said the truth, he’d be blasted in the press for it.  dont you ever think of that.

[666]

@balungaloaf:

the juries will be from liberal areas anyways.  the people who do this arent dumb.  they will go to were the people already will give the theives their cash to punish the church not for the crime with no evidence, they’ll just punish it b/c they dont agree with its policies towards gays, abortion, etc.  the liberals would salivate at the chance.

you see how its a lose lose situation.  the church just decided that a priest going to court, getting railroaded, and having the liberal media have a hayday with it isnt worth it.

and that quote from the cardinal, of course he’ll say something like that.  if he said the truth, he’d be blasted in the press for it.  dont you ever think of that.

unbelievable……truly scary…I’m at a loss for words.

[Flashman]

You keep saying “there’s no evidence”, but what evidence can there be in cases like this?  Witnesses?

One of the main causes of the reformation was the sexual deviances of the Catholic priesthood.  Men are sexual beings, priests or not, and allowing them to marry cured their deviances better than anything.  And now the evidence from the dead sea scrolls suggests that Jesus was married, and there’s nothing in the Bible saying priests cannot marry, the best cure for this problem is to ditch the senseless insistence on celebacy in the priesthood.
If the problem was restricted to one country or one age there might be a case for the defence, but the problem is everywhere there are Catholic priests, and has gone on so long as there have been Catholic priests.  That’s not to say that anything more than a small minority are involved, but that’s still far too many.

[balungaloaf]

unbelievable……truly scary…I’m at a loss for words.

are you an idiot?  have you not watched anti smoking groups lose and jump to a liberal area and be assured of a liberal jury, and win.  and get huge sums of money.  it doesnt take a rocket scientist.  its actually really smart.  your denial or ignorance doesnt change that.

And now the evidence from the dead sea scrolls suggests that Jesus was married,

oh really?  even among historians, which i am close to being, think thats a stretch.  we know the source, but it doesnt really prove or say anything that would make anyone think that but someone who wants to think that.

and did you know the cases among priests are lower than cases with pastors, reverends, imams, rabbi’s and are lower perctanges than the country as a whole?

and i know a small minority is too much.  but really, if you want to be a millionare, ever really strapped for cash, just say some priest touched you.  doesnt matter when, you dont even need a really good story, just say they touched you and wait for payday.

i was serious about above post where i said i’m thinking about it.  these student loans wont pay themselves off.  and i got the perfect back story too.  i was an alterboy for my gradeschool.  anyone would by my bs made up story, and i’d be rich!  hell yeah, i only need to get over the selling the soul part, but a couple of million bucks is sounding like a deal.

[Yemble]

lmao close to a historian yeah… toot your own horn there buddy.

[balungaloaf]

no i mean when you graduate with a major in history and a minor in russian language the major i went to school for makes me a historian.  i’ve been through the hellish process of learning how to write books.  books people read for knowledge.  we know how to see through bs b/c we all have to use primary sources and its just peoples interpretations of these sources that gets them to their conclusion.  we notice peoples bias when the do reports on a subject and come out with a conclusion that fit the mold they wanted before they started research.

lmao

[Jermofoot]

@balungaloaf:

are you an idiot?  have you not watched anti smoking groups lose and jump to a liberal area and be assured of a liberal jury, and win.  and get huge sums of money.  it doesnt take a rocket scientist.  its actually really smart.  your denial or ignorance doesnt change that.

What in the hell are you talking about?

and did you know the cases among priests are lower than cases with pastors, reverends, imams, rabbi’s and are lower perctanges than the country as a whole?

How would you know if there is no evidence of it?
Furthermore, why would that exonerate the priests that do diddle with little kids’ fiddles?

@balungaloaf:

no i mean when you graduate with a major in history and a minor in russian language the major i went to school for makes me a historian.  i’ve been through the hellish process of learning how to write books.  books people read for knowledge.  we know how to see through bs b/c we all have to use primary sources and its just peoples interpretations of these sources that gets them to their conclusion.  we notice peoples bias when the do reports on a subject and come out with a conclusion that fit the mold they wanted before they started research.

lmao

balungaloaf’s History of the World: How Eve Was A Stinking Liberal And Screwed Up Everything

[balungaloaf]

thats actually a really good name for a book.  especially in this politically charged time of ours, it just may sell a couple thousand due to its name.

there is no evidence of it, what it is is reported cases.