WW2 Path to Victory - Rules Discussion

No apologies needed! FMG has been a great help in carrying the product and getting it to folks like you. They need to be thanked too! Glad you asked about the rules and let us know what you think.

@eddiem4145:

I have downloaded the rule book from Xeno games before. In fact I printed it out. I would be willing to fax it to you if they do not have the download still.

Incidentally, I have played their online (so to speak) email version. I bought it in 2004 with the promise of a newer more practical version. Yes it has been 6 years. They are still working on it. I never asked for my money back. There last update was october of last year. If they ever get it out, it probabbly will be great.

eddiem4145@yahoo.com

These guys make WOTC look good.

Totaly agree with you Turtle!!!

Cards

sheet 1
http://www.mediafire.com/?gzydjjijzjr

Sheet 2
http://www.mediafire.com/?zmzut2rqn5n

Sheet 3
http://www.mediafire.com/?xj05mtmdyni

I have studied extensively the economic dynamics of the added benefit of how nations faired following conquest, and concluded that the conquering player for the most part has not increased his total economic output from either liberation or conquest, and even to a lower degree has the nation that was invaded had lost any of its war making potential as a result of enemy occupied lands.

Cases:

German invasion of the Soviet Union only caused the Soviets to mobilize to a full war economy, moving potentially targeted areas (factories and industry) out of harms way. Secondly, even after the period of 1943-45 the Soviet economy rose at a even level in spite of having recaptured most if not all of her German occupied territories.

In Germany’s case she did benefit marginally with the conquest of france, because Vichy government was forced to pay for the war but this didn’t add nearly as much as the Germans slowly moving into a full wartime economy.

In the British case the loss of Singapore, parts of Egypt or Tobruk only served to embolden the conquerer and which served to deliver only a short term psychological blow to national morale.

Japan did benefit from the conquest of the Dutch colonies and was able to sustain her war from the newfound oil imports to offset the American oil embargo effects.

The invasion and liberation of France did not afford the allies with income, nor did it cost the Germans anything but prestige, a few lost U-boat bases, and some strategic air fields… but no tangible economic benefits other than the stoppage of some foodstuffs and payments from Vichy.

I think in all these cases they represent examples of only lost or gained oil reserves, but did not effect the production of airplanes, tanks, ships, or raising of new cadres of Infantry formations. In Germanys case conquered peoples offered a few divisions worth of volunteers but the effect was marginal.

All of this points to the direction that it may be more realistic and in fact solve some of the games issues, by  doing the following:

Each nation is established with a basic starting income and this does not change, except by possible investments into the economy to grow it to full war making potential.

what does this mean?

It means that for example the Soviets, Americans and Germans had economy that took time to mature and that can be presented in the game, by setting benchmarks to illustrate its growth over each turn or following the nations victory conditions.  For example: Germany avoids Moscow and instead takes the oil fields of Baku… they would be rewarded each turn with a set value in IPC, but otherwise they maintain the original income.

Secondly, note that each nation has DIFFERENT IPC starting values… so the question would also be how do the Axis try to get more money than what they start with?

They can invest in building the economy. Say they have 45 IPC basic income, they decide to save 10 IPC and you multiply the 10 IPC to the nations growth rate ( say Germany is at 50% growth rate) , so on all future turns her new starting figure will be at 50 IPC  ( remember: this is just an example).

possible benefits:

–Nobody is gonna keep taking stuff just to collect the money
–It saves alot of time to figure out what money you have
–it will boost SBR campaigns which done seem to really be part of the game
– it will encourage submarine warfare and ENR attacks
– All these silly invasions would keep happening
– effective elimination of a game phase ( collect income), also solving that issue about double collection.

Now im sure some of you will say it will extend the game and make it longer, but if you also adopt the all Axis/ All Allies move sequence the time is a washout.

ok then thats what ill use in the future:

“that the ‘tomato’ is not just one plant, it’s two plants”

Logic can be fun if used in this manner… i suppose.

This sounds like one for Yoper. Where is that kid?

for the most part I like 'em - except it adds A LOT of complication & new stuff to the game. (Stalinist paranoia and the China rules, for example). Being sort-of opposed to IC’s in general and the somewhat long-ish ranges that fighters can potentially have, I gobbled up those rules pretty quickly. …mostly though, I borrowed a lot of the ideas to make simpler versions of these rules.

@Toonster:

The rules for World at War says the following about an Axis IPC win:

“Germany and Japan win whenever their combined IPC total is 20 IPCs higher than all of the Allies combined.”

Does this mean directly after Japan has finished his turn, implying Russia and US cannot fight back?

Toonster

I assume (as in orig. A&A), that the Axis must maintain the IPC total at the end on one complete round of play (meaning every player has had a turn).