League General Discussion Thread

[pacifiersboard]

@elche @MrRoboto @Martin @Pejon_88 @Adam514 @AndrewAAGamer

I would like to use this thread, too, in order to adress my current game mates: two colleagues ill, so much workload on me. If I dont get my turn(s)/responses in by Thursday it may take even until next Monday. All the best to you though!

PS: have not checked on UHD :)

[AndrewAAGamer]

@pacifiersboard said in League General Discussion Thread:

I would like to use this thread, too, in order to adress my current game mates: two colleagues ill, so much workload on me. If I dont get my turn(s)/responses in by Thursday it may take even until next Monday. All the best to you though!

No worries, no hurry. The only games I ever care about pace are Tournament ones.

[gamerman01]

Entering 2016 data into all-time ELO database -

Bids for OOB were about the same then as bids for BM are now

<ducks for cover>

[crockett36]

@gamerman01 That’s amazing. I think AndrewAAgamer’s opinions has really moved the football in the right direction for oob.

So going along with my yearly reset idea. 2024 would be >50 as the starting bid since the Allies won the tournament and the bid was 50. So balance is somewhere just south of 50 by the tournament results.

[gamerman01]

All game results for the league back to Nov 2014 (as of today) have been entered into ELO calculating spreadsheets constructed by our very own MrRoboto. G40 came out in 2012 and I have 2013 and 2014 (and a few in 2012) game results to enter for it to be totally complete, so overall and OOB rankings will be changing fairly significantly over coming weeks.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Larckt6iOuBZtZ-AVzDPv-HEofZJdeN8ptXXotun0Og/edit#gid=0

I am very happy with the system especially because of running all-time records. I could go on and on about pros and cons, but right now will just say I think the pros significantly outweigh the cons, which is why we’re converting.

As of Jan 1, 2024 the league rules will be changed accordingly. I have a week or two to make up my mind, but I think the playoffs will be seeded by

1. Players who have completed 3 games during the calendar year (6 for BM)
2. Current ELO for that version as of 12/31 (12/31/24 for the first year of the new system)

Playoff brackets will no longer be determined only by performance in the last calendar year, but by current ELO which is affected by all-time success/failure.

Arguments can be made either way and I would enjoy discussing, but for now I’ll just say I like that the playoff seeding/participation takes into account games/reputation that were settled more than 1 year previous.

Player has to be active (3 or 6 games finished in the calendar year) to participate, and more recent results count more than earlier ones.

I have also tested and seen that if a new comer enters the league and proves himself over 6-10 games he will definitely find a pretty appropriate seat at the table, so that allays a pretty significant concern.

There’s your 2 week notice.
I welcome if you have some major concern or complaint, and most I should be able to answer since I’ve been thinking about this for about 2 months.

But like ALL league rules, the vast majority of league players support the rules so your point may be over-ridden.

But I especially invite critique because there are just a few of us really working at this, so maybe the majority of the league actually will agree with you and we will change the setup accordingly.

I didn’t put an hour into fashioning this announcement, like to anticipate all points, so fire away and I’ll/we’ll whack the moles

[gamerman01]

@gamerman01 said in League General Discussion Thread:

All game results for the league back to Nov 2014 (as of today) have been entered into ELO calculating spreadsheets

This was 5 days ago? I’ve been pushing hard.
Limited greatly by lag/delays, I am now back to August of 2013. There is less than 1 year to go.

[crockett36]

@gamerman01 Wow! Great work!

[AndrewAAGamer]

It is impressive the amount of work being put in to have a historic view of the gaming here.

[gamerman01]

Full disclosure - most of my wins are in 2013, so I have a little incentive… 🤓

[crockett36]

@gamerman01 You’re obviously the kind of guy that keeps civilization going. Again, many thanks!

[gamerman01]

While others pick up the stones to build Rome, I sit back with my laptop and tally them.
Hey, we need to know how many more stones we’ll need, and I could save other laborer’s backs

[MrRoboto]

In this metaphor I am the one who analyzed the current bureaucracy and optimized it in a way so that the city manages itself with minimal maintenance interference from workers and citizens?

Did I just create the deep state?

[crockett36]

@MrRoboto NOOOO!

You are humble enough to govern by consent of the polis. Without the consent and appreciation of the polis you would just be rearranging 1 and 0 for a handful of troglodytes or neophytes.

[gamerman01]

@MrRoboto said in League General Discussion Thread:

Did I just create the deep state?

You ARE the deep state lol

Unelected behind the scenes government workers who have lots of power that no one sees, who can’t be ousted

[gamerman01]

max334 just signed up for PtV playoffs!!

Which reminds me that it is TIME to sign up for the 2023 PLAYOFFS

6 games for BM, 3 games OOB, or 3 games PtV are required to participate in the 2023 playoffs

Seeding will be done with the rankings spreadsheet we’ve always had, because that was set by the 2023 league rules 1 year ago.

All you have to do is PM me and I will add you to the list (which is a new sheet on the spreadsheet)

Do it before Jan 1 if you can so the playoffs can start promptly after 12/31/2023

And get ready to kiss good-bye to the year 2023

[gamerman01]

Balanced Mod 4 is the default in the Balanced Mod tournament

Meaning, both players would have to agree to BM3, otherwise it must be BM4

[gamerman01]

2024 League rules will be rolled out soon, probably 1/15 or earlier.

The biggest change will be the ELO ranking system being ushered in.
That is, the average PPG system will be discontinued after 12/31.

If you’ve been fighting in Siberia or New Guinea lately and cut off from world news, the link is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Larckt6iOuBZtZ-AVzDPv-HEofZJdeN8ptXXotun0Og/edit#gid=0

The 2024 playoffs (that begin 1/1/25, a year from now) will be seeded by ELO as of 12/31/24. You will still need to complete 6 games BM, or 3 OOB, or 3 PtV to participate in the respective playoff.

This means life-time reputation will be a factor, but the more games you play in 2024 the more that your 2024 games will be a factor.

For many years, playoff seeding/start positions have been determined by that year’s performance only.
There are alternatives (to my favored course of action), but my (cough) authoritative decision is to simply go by 12/31 ELOs. I can change course on this if many players have a better idea.

Will remain that everyone who wants to participate in playoffs will be given a seat. Only requirement is to meet minimum # of games.

[gamerman01]

The 2024 league rules have been updated and posted as a sticky thread. The previous one has been kept in case changes want to be analyzed, but unstickied.

Mostly shortening up redundant language that has lingered from a previous moderator,
Eliminated the limitations on playing the same player over and over
And much shorter ranking rules because the system doesn’t need to be explained.

[pacifiersboard]

I may be a bit late, but wanna share these two thoughts:

• Matches in our League take much more time than in other sports. So there occurs a difference, if new ELO ratings base on the values at the time when game started or when it ends. Because most matches are called by surrender before given victory conditions are met I suggest to from tomorrow on compare ELO as it was when game was started. This way deliberations about benefits by delaying resign are avoided.

• Triggered by the issue @oysteilo had brought I wonder if the K-factor serves us well truly. At least in terms of transparency new players who wanna boost their ELO should be advised to play low rated League players first. For my part I prefer to see ELO of new players with even more reservation until they at all got possibility to join playoffs. Without doubt formula is even more simple without K-factor.

[pacifiersboard]

I.e. formula needs a K-factor but it does not have to vary with numbers of games played.