Quick answer is that bids seem to keep going up with bids over 20 now common.
yes
just the dollar amount.
G40 Balance Mod - Feedback Thread
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@Shin:
Bombing India is a waste of time anyway. 90% of the game, they aren’t buying more than 2 or three units.
To give a longer answer to this, normally in BM India will still be making 9IPC/turn from around turn 5. West India, India, Burma, Indian Ocean NO.
That’s still 3inf/turn. SBR reduces this to only be able to be purchased about every 3rd turn rather than every turn.
It takes 2 runs with 2 bombers to accomplish this. And in the end, it will cause India to be able to buy one less Inf, total.
Example. Let’s say you start bombing round 2. Unlikely, since there’s prob a fighter there, but anyway. You do 11 damage. India is making about 22 at this point, so they actually don’t notice.
Round 3, India is now at full damage. They are making about 10. So they fix 2 points of damage and buy 2 Inf. Instead of three. Wow? You could bomb them again, but why bother? Not worth risking the AA guns.
And it pretty much stays that way until India gets conquered, unless things go really badly for Japan. So tell me again, why would anyone bother? There are so many handy things to do with bombers!
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That isn’t right.
Let’s assume round 2 works out as you suggest. Without SBR you can buy 7 inf with your 22IPC. With SBR you need to spend 6IPC on repairs and use 15IPC to buy 5 inf, with 1IPC change in both cases.
If the factory gets fully damaged, you need to spend at least 14IPC to buy the first infantry.
You seem to be ignoring that the factory can be damaged by 20IPC and can’t build anything with 10IPC of damage.
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Right on regularkid.
:-DI am familiar with the Lobby. I was among the first people to sign up and use it, and even remember the time in tripleA when it was still being created and didn’t yet exist. I tested some of its earliest features, and my handle there is still the same old triplelk. I know the drill for live testing, so not sure if that was meant to be sarcastic or playfully patronizing (like “get your ass to the lobby, you’ve been absent from the lab for too long!” haha) but my involvement with tripleA surely goes back much further than my involvement with A&Aorg or the Harris boards. I have also taken long breaks though, and don’t have nearly the same time these days for live play online, ever since I got hitched up with the lady right around that time, which is why you may not remember me.
:-)I do remember meeting many motivated people over the years that way, and some of you I recognize from back in the day. I totally understand the live play approach, and completely agree it is by far the best way to test games. What you guys are doing is exactly the way to go for this kind of project.
Whether some of those fixes found there way into BM by osmosis or multiple discovery, I couldn’t say, since I wasn’t there to know. But it seems to me that some of these ideas were not spontaneous innovations, and some go back well before the spring of 2015. The Russian NOs for example, or the concept of a warship with a transport capacity, or the one time looting for capital capture rules, NOs to activate worthless Pacific Islands etc. Theoretical ideas discussed here and on the Larry boards at length a while ago, with a lot of debate. I’m sure you guys probably think I’m all eidos and no praxis, or lack sufficient recent pbf play to seriously entertain some of my ideas about Global. But I’m not totally green here either. So I guess it’s just slightly demoralizing sometimes when I see people who have contributed cool ideas and playing A&A casually for ages get dismissed outright, just because they aren’t racking up league games in tripleA.
I admit, part of the reason I didn’t hop on board with BM initially is because I didn’t find Vichy all that captivating, and also wasn’t convinced about the C5 marines. It seemed like those were meant to be really central to the mod. But it seems like they have been well received so maybe I was wrong. I certainly find the NOs here a vast improvement.
I’m glad the project is going so well!
Somehow I sense there isn’t much room for rambling experimental digressions here though, and I don’t want to distract from steady progress towards mod balance by injecting ideas from left field. As far as a redesign team goes, you know it’s basically just Barney at this point. Collecting ideas and dropping them into the file.
The reason why we curious about what you lIke best from balance mod, is because it would be nice to include some of this stuff in the general package for modular use.
Vichy rules for example, or NOs, or C5 Marines, SBR mechanics or any independent concept used in this mod which can function as a stand alone HR. I think Baron just came here to ask, because this is where you guys are hanging out. But I know this isn’t a general discussion the thread. Its a league thread. Just that wasnt anywhere else to go really for an active thread.
Appologies again if it was an intrusion.
Keep on rocking it! And all the best
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thanks
this means that marines can’t be loaded to warships if you want the warship to conduct only a naval battle (no amphibious assult)? However, if the warship was loaded in NCM in an earlier round the loaded warship can participate in naval battles without unloading the marine?
Exactly.
Is it possible to load a Cruiser or a BB, fight a Naval Battle (ex.: one DD blocker) around an empty enemy’s island, for example, then unload Marines unit to conquer the island?
Of course, nor Cruiser nor Battleship can make a coastal bombardment, nor need to in my example.
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Yes, they work just like transports in this way
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@Baron:
thanks
this means that marines can’t be loaded to warships if you want the warship to conduct only a naval battle (no amphibious assult)? However, if the warship was loaded in NCM in an earlier round the loaded warship can participate in naval battles without unloading the marine?
Exactly.
Is it possible to load a Cruiser or a BB, fight a Naval Battle (ex.: one DD blocker) around an empty enemy’s island, for example, then unload Marines unit to conquer the island?
Of course, nor Cruiser nor Battleship can make a coastal bombardment, nor need to in my example.
Yes, they work just like transports in this way
So, you can still load 1 Marines on a Battleship or Cruiser and makes a Naval Combat.
Next turn, you can unloaded it somewhere, right? -
Yeah you need to watch out for it. I think China gets convoyed in all BM versions, while not in vanilla.
What is vanilla version?
Another name for G40 OOB? -
1) I want to reverse the Novgorod bonus to be a bonus for the USSR holding it rather than a bonus for Germany. Ties in with the KV-1 Tank factory there the way I see it.
2) USSR lend lease routes - do the Persian and Siberian routes have historic precedent? Particularly the former one through those mountainous regions. The latter one I guess had the Trans Siberian railway. Perhaps some stuff went that way.
3) West Indian ocean free of Axis subs - this is a bit too much of a gift for the Calcutta economy IMHO.
4) East Pacific Islands ANZAC NO: I think it is too easy to holdYou’re aware of my leaning that Marines are overpowered - although they are arguably expensive. At least disallowing bombardment support from a marine. Only inf/art/mec/tanks should count IMO.
Those are probably my main thoughts. I might have a bit more if I think of it.
Simon33,
do you still believe what you said about #1 NO on Novgorod?
and why do you think that Marines are overpowered (even at 5 IPCs)?
Thanks, -
@Baron:
Yeah you need to watch out for it. I think China gets convoyed in all BM versions, while not in vanilla.
What is vanilla version?
Another name for G40 OOB?Vanilla is the original version of something.
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Do you use “vanilla” when talking about G40 OOB or do you keep this expression for the first iteration of BMode?
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@Baron:
Do you use “vanilla” when talking about G40 OOB or do you keep this expression for the first iteration of BMode?
Vanilla is OOB.
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Thanks Adam.
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@Baron:
1) I want to reverse the Novgorod bonus to be a bonus for the USSR holding it rather than a bonus for Germany. Ties in with the KV-1 Tank factory there the way I see it.
2) USSR lend lease routes - do the Persian and Siberian routes have historic precedent? Particularly the former one through those mountainous regions. The latter one I guess had the Trans Siberian railway. Perhaps some stuff went that way.
3) West Indian ocean free of Axis subs - this is a bit too much of a gift for the Calcutta economy IMHO.
4) East Pacific Islands ANZAC NO: I think it is too easy to holdYou’re aware of my leaning that Marines are overpowered - although they are arguably expensive. At least disallowing bombardment support from a marine. Only inf/art/mec/tanks should count IMO.
Those are probably my main thoughts. I might have a bit more if I think of it.
Simon33,
do you still believe what you said about #1 NO on Novgorod?
and why do you think that Marines are overpowered (even at 5 IPCs)?
Thanks,It’s mainly the bombardment shot that I think is over the top. Put a marine on a BB and attack a fighter on Guam and you’ll easily kill it, more often than not.
Yes, I still think that reversing the Novgorod objective would be a neat improvement to the game and game balance. Come to think of it, what’s the Stalingrad objective for? Was a not that significant city of about half a million where the Germans just happened to be stopped.
They’ve given an NO to Germany for doing the main things that they weren’t able to do in the actual war.
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Thanks for your answer Simon.
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Stalingrad not a significant city where the Germans “happened to be stopped”?
You need to read up on your history. Ever heard of “not one step back”?
Never heard that Hitler was obsessed with Stalingrad because of its name?
Not to mention I’m sure the location was very strategic - gateway to the oil fields or something. And then there were the massive “tractorworks”The Germans were within spitting distance of Moscow and decided to turn and go towards Stalingrad, that’s how significant Stalingrad is. This game is a big letdown when the Germans walk into an empty Stalingrad…… Not to mention no battle at Pearl Harbor or Midway, etc etc etc :-)
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And Guam wasn’t the best example, because it has an airbase that gives that fighter a scramble option
I might scramble against that battleship, possibly sink it, and probably wound it, then finish it off in the following turnBesides, I don’t like the logic. You could say infantry are overpowered because 1 infantry has a 50/50 shot against a bomber
Now I’m back to disagreeing with Simon, so I guess all is back to normal :-D
3 upvotes in a half hour - scary :wink: -
Everything Gamerman said in his last two post is 100% . . . correct! :-o
I also find the lack of regular game circumstances for pivotal battles at Midway, Stalingrad, and a surprise attack at Pear Harbor annoying.
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I suppose “Midway” can happen anywhere in the Pacific and I’m not suggesting anything should be done to the game to ensure a big battle at Midway :-)
And you can’t really make Pearl Harbor happen unless you start the game in 1941 (like the AA50 game did)
But Stalingrad has possibilities! You could make a rule that the Russians can produce if they have a factory (don’t need the capital to produce and collect), that the Axis doesn’t sack all (some fraction maybe) of Russia’s money by taking Moscow or that the Germans sack some Russian cash (5 or 10 IPC’s? 1/2 of what’s on hand?) if they get Stalingrad (Russians can defend Stalingrad a lot better without the punitive capital rules)
Just off the top of my head. They do sound compelling, no? Remember, in history the Germans tried harder to get Stalingrad than Moscow……
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Just curious, don’t you guys think Hepster should get a nod in your credits for the Marine unit graphics you guys are using?
It’s cool to see it get some use, since it was just kind of collecting dust since 2011.
But it always kind of bugged me a little that he goes totally uncredited in the vanilla G40 file, despite doing work on nearly every unit in the game haha. Including that one.
Same deal with Eschelon and Dan, and Crystalct in the past. A lot of people made contributions there for custom maps that got packaged in by Puli several years ago. I don’t know that any of them really pushed for any kind of recognition, since it was all done for the love, but without the art assets we wouldn’t have much a game.
All you have to do is look at the shitty hack job cruiser unit I made, which for whatever crazy reason is still the default in G40, to see what this game used to look before the real graphics wizards stepped in to clean in up lol.
Anyhow, seems like it might be a nice gesture, even if the OOB files makes no mention, to at least give Hepster some props for all the work he did. The slick ass Marine unit is just one example among many.
Not to digress overmuch, but it was never the specific cost or abilities of the Marine unit that had me worried. More the fact that including a new unit to begin with just made it harder to use the mod FtF. Since you have to either order new materials or customize the boxed stuff (like painting infantry or whatever.) I saw it as a barrier to ease of adoption on the physical board. Or at least for peeps that don’t have killer skills to make amazing custom magna-boards and gloriously painted sculpts, stuff that always has me totally envious haha. Kind of had the same feeling about Vichy, since it seemed to require ordering/painting more sculpts or ordering/printing control marker roundels to pull that off FtF. Just that, to me, building those into the foundation puts real limits on accessibility outside of the digital tripleA arena, (where that stuff is way easier to include.) At this point thought, I think the ship has sailed. The mod is probably way too far along now to revisit any of that stuff. Just that when this idea was proposed to me at first, I thought there were other things that might be at the foundation instead (stuff that might be easier to also pull off FtF). But I certainly do dig the way it looks!
The Vichy territory color is very appealing to me, I think it was a great choice. And the Marine unit is an undeniably legit graphic.
But yeah, just thinking it might be cool to see that dude make the list, for hooking up those units.
:-D -
Ps. Maybe it would be cool to include some links to HBG for people that want to pull this off on the table top.
Hell with enough interest, maybe someone over there could be persuaded to offer like a package deal, so people can order all the balance mod stuff they’d need together at once.
Or maybe just some suggestions on other ways to do it. Like with a link to printout for Vichy roundels ready to print and cut out. Or suggested methods for a really simple paint job (like just going water based so it’s easy to remove.) You know like Red cap marines. Or if you need to do Vichy inf or ships, it could just be like paint a white dot on the standard French sculpts. Something that’s quick, and doesn’t require a whole lot of commitment.
That way it doesn’t have to be so tripleA exclusive
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