Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB

[trulpen]

Sorry for the extra posts, but saw two things, the 2 subs in z97 should scurry away to z98 and the sb in Vologda might as well SBR the mIC in Ukraine with nothing better to do.

[trulpen]

Now I will wait for atleast 5 h before committing.

[trulpen]

Oh, I see something now. The fleet in Marianas is exposed to 5 fig, 3 tac, 2 sb. Needs to be beefed up.

[trulpenplay]

TripleA Manual Gamesave Post: British round 4

TripleA Manual Gamesave Post for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 4.0

Game History

Round: 4

    Purchase Units - British
        British buy 1 artillery, 1 fighter and 7 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
        Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Americans takes 22 Sea Zone from Japanese
            EDIT: Americans takes 22 Sea Zone from Japanese
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Americans takes 22 Sea Zone from Japanese
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        2 fighters, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber moved from West India to India
        1 fighter moved from 76 Sea Zone to 99 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from United Kingdom to 92 Sea Zone
        2 submarines moved from 97 Sea Zone to 98 Sea Zone
        1 bomber moved from Vologda to Ukraine
        EDIT: British undo move 6.
        EDIT: 1 cruiser moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        1 battleship moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        EDIT: 1 destroyer moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Savegame

[trulpen]

The UK bs and aussie des and cr will also reinfoce z22. Should make everything very safe, unless I’ve missed something.

What I can see J may attack z22 with 5 fig, 3 tac, 2 sb and z33 with 3 fig, 3 tac.

[AndrewAAGamer]

@trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

An overlook then. Makes sense. Would you have used only air or chip in a sub?

Yes. I would have added a sub. I am happy to trade a $6 sub for an $8 destroyer instead of risking a $10 plane to get the destroyer for free.

[surfer]

@trulpen The counter requires the Italian AF to attack. If they get 3 hits 1 BB + 2 DD it would be favorable for the Axis. But I forgot that you could take 1 ftr hit and replace with french. Thus the 3 hits are 1 BB + 1 ftr (replaced) + 1DD. In which case it becomes 50-50 (very variable 50-50! Even the battle calc is all over the map.) I don’t think anyone would want to risk that unless they felt they were losing.

[trulpen]

I don’t understand. Where do the 2 italian des come from? Or do you mean 2 figs? He can actually attack with 3 fig, 1 sb, but it’s suicide. A desperado. We can safely assume he won’t go there.

The fleet in z112 should be rather safe even with 3 hits on it from Italy.

[trulpen]

Ah, sorry, noe I understand. You were talking about the causalties for the fleet.

[trulpen]

@AndrewAAGamer said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

@trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

An overlook then. Makes sense. Would you have used only air or chip in a sub?

Yes. I would have added a sub. I am happy to trade a $6 sub for an $8 destroyer instead of risking a $10 plane to get the destroyer for free.

That’s interesting. I’d say mathematically, concerning risk and effect, it’s more favourable to keep the sub and risk the air. It’s not completely evident though. Also depends on the situation if air or fleet is more valuable regarding position.

[farmboy]

I think it looks good. On the US turn, I wouldn’t have attacked Tunisia because you are not set up to take it back. But that is pretty minor.

Also, I presume you are building a couple of extra land units for London. Are you actually going to need them in London on the next turn? I presume your ncm will grab units from London to drop in Norway, but that two of those units will be AA? I don’t think this is too big a deal either, but I’m wondering if you might want to think of another fighter in Persia instead, or another mech in South Africa. Or even another transport in Egypt to raise the pressure on Italy.

[farmboy]

@trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

The UK bs and aussie des and cr will also reinfoce z22. Should make everything very safe, unless I’ve missed something.

What I can see J may attack z22 with 5 fig, 3 tac, 2 sb and z33 with 3 fig, 3 tac.

I believe this is correct too.

[trulpen]

@farmboy said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

I think it looks good. On the US turn, I wouldn’t have attacked Tunisia because you are not set up to take it back. But that is pretty minor.

Also, I presume you are building a couple of extra land units for London. Are you actually going to need them in London on the next turn? I presume your ncm will grab units from London to drop in Norway, but that two of those units will be AA? I don’t think this is too big a deal either, but I’m wondering if you might want to think of another fighter in Persia instead, or another mech in South Africa. Or even another transport in Egypt to raise the pressure on Italy.

The land is for ME and Africa. Nothing in London.

[AndrewAAGamer]

@trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

@AndrewAAGamer said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

@trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

An overlook then. Makes sense. Would you have used only air or chip in a sub?

Yes. I would have added a sub. I am happy to trade a $6 sub for an $8 destroyer instead of risking a $10 plane to get the destroyer for free.

That’s interesting. I’d say mathematically, concerning risk and effect, it’s more favourable to keep the sub and risk the air. It’s not completely evident though. Also depends on the situation if air or fleet is more valuable regarding position.

I guess do not play exclusively based on mathematics. 😊 Throwing in the sub gives me a more consistent advantage. Worse case I am losing a $6 sub and killing an $8 destroyer. Yes, the overall TUV is better without the sub but the variable is greater. I prefer consistency versus randomness. What I am saying is I will happily trade a sub for a destroyer all day long even if I could get the destroyer for free by risking losing a plane. As you can see by the below in the using the sub scenario the TUV is worse off but ONLY if the Opponent continues to attack the sub which continues the cycle of sub for destroyer trading.

Let us look at the two scenarios assuming a one round kill.
• Use sub scenario
• 66.6666% of the time sub survives and the destroyer dies = + 5.33 TUV
• 33.3333% of the time the sub and destroyer both die = + 0.66 TUV
• 11.1111% of the time the sub is counter attacked and kills a new destroyer = + 0.22
• 55.5555% of the time the sub is counter attacked and dies alone = - 3.33
• Total combined TUV = + 2.88

• Plane only scenario
• 66.6666% of the time the destroyer dies = + 5.33 TUV
• 33.3333% of the time a fighter and destroyer die = - 0.66 TUV
• Total combined TUV = + 4.67

The above does not take into consideration those times when the counterattacking destroyer dies while the sub does not. I have seen that happen plenty of times. I have also seen a bunch of destroyer hits killing a lot of planes. Again, my proposed style of play is to remove the dice randomness as much as possible. A sure small win is better than a possible larger win attached with a small possible loss too.

So, it really comes down to what is more important at the time. The fighter or the sub? Are you able to continue the trading or not by using the sub? Is it good to force your Opponent to keep using his destroyers to kill your subs?

[surfer]

@AndrewAAGamer Sure sounds like you play by mathematics – or statistics, at least! :) And from what I’m seeing it appears to be close to the truth.

[trulpen]

It’s a good analysis, and I agree upon it.

But it’s very sweet when you kill off those 3 blockers for free. Of course, the heart races a little before such battles and is accompanied by extensive cursing those times 2-3 air are lost. :laughing:

[AndrewAAGamer]

@trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

But it’s very sweet when you kill off those 3 blockers for free. Of course, the heart races a little before such battles and is accompanied by extensive cursing those times 2-3 air are lost.

Totally correct. And I would call that randomness.

[trulpen]

@farmboy said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

I think it looks good. On the US turn, I wouldn’t have attacked Tunisia because you are not set up to take it back. But that is pretty minor.

I’ll cancel the attack on Tunisia. You’re right. It’s getting 2 for the cost of 4. Pretty lousy deal.

[trulpenplay]

TripleA Turn Summary: UK_Pacific round 4

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 4.0

Game History

Round: 4

    Purchase Units - Americans
        Americans buy 1 bomber, 1 carrier, 2 fighters, 2 infantry and 3 submarines; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Americans
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Gibraltar to 91 Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 91 Sea Zone to 112 Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 112 Sea Zone to Norway
        1 artillery moved from Caroline Islands to 33 Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 22 Sea Zone to Marianas
        1 mech_infantry moved from Morocco to Tunisia
              Americans take Tunisia from Italians

    Combat - Americans
        Battle in Norway
        Battle in Marianas

    Non Combat Move - Americans
        1 aaGun, 1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from Gibraltar to 91 Sea Zone
        1 armour and 2 infantry moved from Morocco to 91 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun, 1 armour, 3 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 3 transports moved from 91 Sea Zone to 112 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun, 1 armour, 3 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from 112 Sea Zone to Norway
        2 carriers, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer and 2 fighters moved from 91 Sea Zone to 112 Sea Zone
        1 transport moved from 91 Sea Zone to 101 Sea Zone
        1 bomber moved from Morocco to United Kingdom
        1 carrier moved from 26 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        1 carrier moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 26 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone
        2 carriers, 2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands
        1 transport moved from 26 Sea Zone to 10 Sea Zone
        1 mech_infantry moved from Central United States to Western United States
        2 fighters moved from 33 Sea Zone to Caroline Islands
        2 fighters moved from Wake Island to Guam
        3 submarines moved from 33 Sea Zone to 6 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Western United States to Midway
        2 fighters moved from Western United States to Midway

    Place Units - Americans
        1 bomber and 2 fighters placed in Eastern United States
        1 carrier and 3 submarines placed in 10 Sea Zone
        1 infantry placed in Western United States
        1 infantry placed in Central United States

    Turn Complete - Americans
        Americans collect 56 PUs; end with 56 PUs
        Objective Americans 1 Homeland: Americans met a national objective for an additional 10 PUs; end with 66 PUs
        Objective Americans 3 Defense Obligations: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 71 PUs
        Objective Americans 2 Outer Territories: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 76 PUs
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Removing units owned by Americans from Caroline Islands: 2 fighters
        EDIT: Adding units owned by Americans to 22 Sea Zone: 2 fighters
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Removing units owned by Americans from 26 Sea Zone: 1 destroyer
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Adding units owned by Americans to 33 Sea Zone: 1 destroyer
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

    Purchase Units - Chinese
        Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
        Chinese buy 4 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Chinese
        1 infantry moved from Shensi to Suiyuyan
              Chinese take Suiyuyan from Japanese
        1 infantry moved from Kweichow to Hopei
              Chinese take Hopei from Japanese

    Combat - Chinese

    Non Combat Move - Chinese
        4 artilleries, 1 fighter and 15 infantry moved from Kweichow to Hunan
        1 infantry moved from Tsinghai to Shensi

    Place Units - Chinese
        4 infantry placed in Hunan

    Turn Complete - Chinese
        Chinese collect 10 PUs; end with 11 PUs

    Purchase Units - British
        British buy 1 artillery, 1 fighter and 7 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
        Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Americans takes 22 Sea Zone from Japanese
            EDIT: Americans takes 22 Sea Zone from Japanese
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Americans takes 22 Sea Zone from Japanese
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Changing PUs for Americans from 76 to 75
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        2 fighters, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber moved from West India to India
        1 fighter moved from 76 Sea Zone to 99 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from United Kingdom to 92 Sea Zone
        2 submarines moved from 97 Sea Zone to 98 Sea Zone
        1 bomber moved from Vologda to Ukraine
        EDIT: British undo move 6.
        EDIT: 1 cruiser moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        1 battleship moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        EDIT: 1 destroyer moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        EDIT: 1 mech_infantry moved from Tunisia to Algeria

    Combat - British
        Strategic bombing raid in Ukraine
                AA fire in Ukraine : 0/1 hits, 0,17 expected hits
            Bombing raid in Ukraine rolls: 8 and causes: 6 damage to unit: factory_minor
            Bombing raid in Ukraine causes 6 damage total. 
        Battle in 99 Sea Zone
            British attack with 1 fighter
            Italians defend with 1 transport
                1 transport owned by the Italians lost in 99 Sea Zone
            British win with 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7
            Casualties for Italians: 1 transport
        Battle in 92 Sea Zone
            British attack with 1 fighter and 1 submarine
            Italians defend with 1 cruiser
                British roll dice for 1 submarine in 92 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                British roll dice for 1 fighter in 92 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                Italians roll dice for 1 cruiser in 92 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                1 cruiser owned by the Italians lost in 92 Sea Zone
            British win with 1 fighter and 1 submarine remaining. Battle score for attacker is 12
            Casualties for Italians: 1 cruiser
        Battle in India
            British attack with 2 fighters, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
            Japanese defend with 1 airfield, 1 factory_minor, 1 harbour and 2 infantry
                British roll dice for 2 fighters, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in India, round 2 : 1/6 hits, 2,17 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 2 infantry in India, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Japanese and 1 infantry owned by the British lost in India
                British roll dice for 2 fighters, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in India, round 3 : 2/5 hits, 2,00 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in India, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Japanese lost in India
            British win, taking India from Japanese with 2 fighters, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for British: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Japanese: 2 infantry

    Non Combat Move - British
        1 infantry and 2 mech_infantrys moved from Kweichow to Hunan
        4 infantry moved from Persia to Eastern Persia
        1 transport moved from 76 Sea Zone to 71 Sea Zone
        1 mech_infantry moved from Belgian Congo to Egypt
        1 infantry moved from Rhodesia to Belgian Congo
        1 mech_infantry moved from Union of South Africa to Belgian Congo
        1 carrier, 2 cruisers and 2 destroyers moved from 76 Sea Zone to 98 Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from British Somaliland to 76 Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 76 Sea Zone to 98 Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 98 Sea Zone to Alexandria
        1 battleship moved from 33 Sea Zone to 22 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from 92 Sea Zone to Algeria
        1 armour and 1 infantry moved from Morocco to Algeria
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Gibraltar to 91 Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 2 cruisers, 1 infantry and 2 transports moved from 91 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun, 1 artillery, 2 cruisers, 2 infantry and 2 transports moved from 110 Sea Zone to 112 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun, 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from 112 Sea Zone to Norway
        1 battleship and 1 destroyer moved from 109 Sea Zone to 112 Sea Zone
        2 fighters moved from Karelia to 112 Sea Zone
        2 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber moved from India to Persia
        1 fighter moved from 99 Sea Zone to 98 Sea Zone
        2 artilleries and 4 infantry moved from Egypt to Trans-Jordan
        1 fighter moved from 76 Sea Zone to 98 Sea Zone
        1 tactical_bomber moved from Anglo Egyptian Sudan to Persia
        1 bomber moved from Ukraine to Northwest Persia
        3 fighters moved from Karelia to Norway
        2 infantry moved from Iraq to Northwest Persia
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Iraq to Persia
        1 armour and 1 mech_infantry moved from Iraq to Northwest Persia
        1 armour moved from Iraq to Eastern Persia

    Place Units - British
        1 artillery, 1 fighter and 1 infantry placed in Persia
        3 infantry placed in Egypt
        2 infantry placed in Union of South Africa
        1 infantry placed in United Kingdom
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Changing ownership of Tunisia from Americans to Italians
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

    Turn Complete - British
        British collect 30 PUs; end with 30 PUs

    Turn Complete - UK_Pacific
        Total Cost from Convoy Blockades: 3
            Rolling for Convoy Blockade Damage in 39 Sea Zone. Rolls: 5,3,3,5,5,4
        UK_Pacific collect 3 PUs (3 lost to blockades); end with 3 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

British : -1,00
Italians : -0,50
AA fire in Ukraine : : -0,17
Japanese : 0,00

Savegame

[trulpen]

I think this is pretty good.

Of course the fig should be built in Persia, reaching both Calcutta for attack and Moscow for defence. With 3 fig, 2 tac there, I think it’s pretty powerful. I contemplated having one tac in z98, but prefered to maximize the defence there. Don’t think Moscow is close to go down next turn, so there’s still time to get that air in there.

Actually, now I see that the air in ME should be in E Persia instead. Thereby they can still reach Moscow, but also hit Calcutta without losing position. Will change that.

First I put the sb and 3 figs in Moscow, but then I came to think of the sweet opportunity to gain the basic NO for Russia. 5 IPC is pretty good. Not fully sure this is the way to go, since now there’s only 2 figs in Moscow instead of 5-6 countering SBR. On the other hand, the strategic bombing is prone with risk in itself, so I consider it worth it with only 2 sb at hand.

The upside is that with 3-4 figs in Norway, it’s as secure as the Mountain King’s stony Hall. Or Hitler’s bunker. US will build an ab there next turn, so those planes can reach Moscow when need be.