@FlyingBadger said in L25 PtV FlyingBadger (Axis+8) vs Zarhunter (Allies) #1:
Scotland to 114? No
UK to 113? NO
France to Normandy? YES
L20 Gamerman01 (L) vs AetV (w/o Iwo NO)
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Japan has 5 carriers, 2 destroyers, 4 tactical bombers, 6 fighters, and 2 battleships, one is damaged
7@2 4@3 8@4
[dice 7d6 4d6 8d6]
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7d6: 2, 3, 5, 1, 3, 2, 2
4d6: 1, 2, 2, 6
8d6: 4, 1, 6, 5, 6, 2, 6, 3 -
That’s 4 hits with the 2’s
3 hits with the 3’s
4 hits with the 4’s
11 hits totalI just did the SBR and Egypt took 6 damage but Rome shot down both bombers.
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OK, I think it’s too risky to try and save a fleet here that would hold up against your air counter-attack, so I will scuttle the fleet…
I ding my battleship (1) sink 3 carriers (6) and 4 subs (4) (11)
I have 4 subs, 5 destroyers 9 fighters, 1 tac, 2 bombers, 1 dmgd BB
vs
1 dmg CV, 2 destroyers, 4 tacs, 6 fighters, 2 dmgd BBs[dice 4d6 5d6 9d6 4d6]
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4d6: 2, 3, 5, 1
5d6: 2, 4, 1, 2, 2
9d6: 1, 3, 5, 6, 1, 1, 3, 4, 1
4d6: 5, 2, 3, 5 -
4 subs hit 2X
5 destroyers hit 4X
9 fighters hit 6X
2 bombers, tac, battleship hit 2X14 hits, craziness. Destroyers found their way to the battle now
You lose CV, 2 DD, 4 TAC, 6 fighters, 1 BB
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Japan defense round 2
[dice 3d6 4d6 8d6]
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3d6: 6, 3, 6
4d6: 6, 2, 6, 1
8d6: 5, 5, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 5 -
2 destroyers and 1 carrier hit 0X
4 tacs hit 2X
6 fighters and 2 BB hit 5X7 hits total
I lose 4 subs and 3 fighters
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5 DD, 6 FTR, 1 TAC, 2 BMB, 1 dmgd BB vs 1 dmgd BB
[dice 5d6 6d6 4d6]
vs
[dice 1d6] -
5d6: 2, 5, 5, 6, 5
6d6: 1, 2, 3, 4, 2, 5
4d6: 1, 3, 5, 2
1d6: 6 -
Everything else has been rolled in Triple A. I’ll be back later to finish USA’s turn -
Interesting dice - I got 2 out of 3 bombers shot down by AA but Egypt got hit for max damage, you got 1/3 kamikazes so you ended up 2/6 for the game, I had a lackluster round 1 attack but the 2nd round was blistering and had 4 more hits than the first round?! (in the big fleet battle) and then 2 subs and a destroyer wipe out a sub and fighter?!! The dice have spoken, I guess.
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TripleA Turn Summary: Chinese round 10
TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 3.4
Game History
Round: 10 Purchase Units - Chinese Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed Chinese buy nothing; Remaining resources: 4 PUs; Combat Move - Chinese Combat - Chinese Turn Complete - Chinese Chinese collect 1 PU; end with 5 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
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You got 3 straight AA hits against bombers from Rome!
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TripleA Turn Summary: UK_Pacific round 10
TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 3.4
Game History
Round: 10 Purchase Units - Americans Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Adding units owned by Italians to Tambov: 1 infantry EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Americans buy 1 armour, 1 carrier, 2 destroyers, 1 fighter, 4 infantry, 6 submarines and 1 transport; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Combat Move - Americans 1 bomber moved from Malta to Egypt 1 bomber moved from Eastern United States to Holland Belgium 1 mech_infantry moved from Libya to Alexandria British take Alexandria from Italians 1 infantry moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Holland Belgium 2 bombers moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Southern Italy 2 fighters moved from United Kingdom to Holland Belgium 3 fighters moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Holland Belgium 1 destroyer moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 37 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 44 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 43 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 2 submarines moved from 19 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 1 destroyer and 1 submarine moved from 21 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 4 fighters moved from Guam to 35 Sea Zone 1 bomber moved from Paulau Island to 35 Sea Zone 2 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Caroline Islands to 35 Sea Zone 1 fighter moved from Java to 35 Sea Zone 1 bomber and 1 fighter moved from India to 35 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 33 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone 1 battleship, 3 carriers, 5 destroyers, 1 fighter and 1 submarine moved from 33 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone Combat - Americans Italians scrambles 1 units out of Southern Italy to defend against the attack in 97 Sea Zone Kamikaze Suicide Attack attacks 1 destroyer owned by the Americans scoring 0 hits. Rolls: 5 Kamikaze Suicide Attack attacks 1 destroyer owned by the Americans scoring 0 hits. Rolls: 4 Kamikaze Suicide Attack attacks 1 destroyer owned by the Americans scoring 0 hits. Rolls: 4 Strategic bombing raid in Egypt AA fire in Egypt : 0/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits Bombing raid in Egypt rolls: 7 and causes: 6 damage to unit: factory_minor Bombing raid in Egypt causes 6 damage total. Strategic bombing raid in Southern Italy AA fire in Southern Italy : 1/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits 1 bomber killed by AA AA fire in Southern Italy : 1/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits 1 bomber killed by AA Bombing raid in Southern Italy causes 0 damage total. Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Americans from 35 Sea Zone: 1 destroyer EDIT: Removing units owned by Japanese from 35 Sea Zone: 4 carriers EDIT: Changing unit hit damage for these Japanese owned units to: battleship = 1 EDIT: Changing unit hit damage for these Japanese owned units to: carrier = 1 EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Americans from 35 Sea Zone: 3 carriers and 4 submarines EDIT: Changing unit hit damage for these Americans owned units to: battleship = 1 EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Americans from 35 Sea Zone: 3 fighters and 4 submarines EDIT: Removing units owned by Japanese from 35 Sea Zone: 1 battleship, 1 carrier, 2 destroyers, 6 fighters and 4 tactical_bombers EDIT: Removing units owned by Japanese from 35 Sea Zone: 1 battleship and 2 transports EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Battle in 35 Sea Zone Americans attack with 1 battleship, 2 bombers, 5 destroyers, 6 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber Battle in Holland Belgium Americans attack with 1 bomber, 5 fighters and 1 infantry Germans defend with 1 artillery Americans roll dice for 1 bomber, 5 fighters and 1 infantry in Holland Belgium, round 2 : 3/7 hits, 3.33 expected hits Germans roll dice for 1 artillery in Holland Belgium, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits 1 artillery owned by the Germans lost in Holland Belgium Americans winAmericans win, taking 35 Sea Zone from Japanese with 1 battleship, 2 bombers, 5 destroyers, 6 fighters and 1 tactical_bomber remaining, taking Holland Belgium from Germans with 1 bomber, 5 fighters and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 4 Casualties for Germans: 1 artillery Battle in 97 Sea Zone British loiter and taunt; Americans attack with 1 destroyer and 2 submarines Italians defend with 1 fighter and 1 submarine Americans roll dice for 2 submarines in 97 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits 1 submarine owned by the Italians lost in 97 Sea Zone Americans roll dice for 1 destroyer in 97 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits Italians roll dice for 1 fighter in 97 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.67 expected hits 2 submarines owned by the Americans Submerged Americans roll dice for 1 destroyer in 97 Sea Zone, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits Italians roll dice for 1 fighter in 97 Sea Zone, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0.67 expected hits Americans roll dice for 1 destroyer in 97 Sea Zone, round 4 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits Italians roll dice for 1 fighter in 97 Sea Zone, round 4 : 0/1 hits, 0.67 expected hits 1 fighter owned by the Italians lost in 97 Sea Zone Americans win, taking 97 Sea Zone from Italians with 1 destroyer remaining. Battle score for attacker is 16 Casualties for Italians: 1 fighter and 1 submarine Non Combat Move - Americans COMMENT: 1 USA infantry on each of two transports in Z26 Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode COMMENT: Disregard previous comment 1 armour and 3 infantry moved from Hawaiian Islands to 26 Sea Zone 1 armour, 1 carrier, 3 infantry and 2 transports moved from 26 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone 1 armour and 3 infantry moved from 33 Sea Zone to Caroline Islands 2 armour, 2 infantry and 1 marine moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone 2 armour, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 2 infantry, 1 marine and 2 transports moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone 1 tactical_bomber moved from 35 Sea Zone to Guam 2 bombers moved from 35 Sea Zone to Guam 2 fighters moved from 35 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone 1 fighter moved from 35 Sea Zone to Java EDIT: 1 fighter moved from 35 Sea Zone to Java 1 fighter moved from 35 Sea Zone to Guam EDIT: 1 fighter moved from 35 Sea Zone to Guam 2 infantry and 1 marine moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands 1 submarine moved from 6 Sea Zone to 20 Sea Zone 1 submarine moved from 6 Sea Zone to 19 Sea Zone 1 bomber moved from Holland Belgium to Normandy Bordeaux 1 mech_infantry moved from Algeria to Libya 1 armour moved from Morocco to Tunisia 1 bomber moved from Egypt to Crete 1 fighter moved from Eastern United States to Gibraltar 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Central United States to 101 Sea Zone 1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 101 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone 1 transport moved from 88 Sea Zone to 89 Sea Zone 2 infantry moved from Southeast Mexico to 89 Sea Zone 2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 89 Sea Zone to 88 Sea Zone 1 artillery moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Southern France 1 infantry moved from Central United States to Southeast Mexico 5 fighters moved from Holland Belgium to Southern France 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 91 Sea Zone to Morocco 1 transport moved from 92 Sea Zone to 88 Sea Zone 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from British Guiana to 88 Sea Zone 1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 88 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 91 Sea Zone to Morocco 2 infantry moved from 88 Sea Zone to British Guiana 1 carrier and 2 fighters moved from 92 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone 1 destroyer moved from 110 Sea Zone to 92 Sea Zone 1 marine moved from Normandy Bordeaux to 110 Sea Zone 1 cruiser and 1 marine moved from 110 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone 1 marine moved from 91 Sea Zone to Morocco 1 transport moved from 110 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone 1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from Morocco to 91 Sea Zone 1 aaGun, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 91 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone 1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux 1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from Algeria to Morocco Place Units - Americans 1 destroyer, 1 submarine and 1 transport placed in 101 Sea Zone 1 armour and 4 infantry placed in Central United States 1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 5 submarines placed in 10 Sea Zone 1 fighter placed in Eastern United States Turn Complete - Americans Americans collect 55 PUs; end with 55 PUs Trigger Americans 7 North Africa Beach Head: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 60 PUs Trigger Americans 6 Western Europe Beach Head: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 65 PUs Objective Americans 1 Homeland: Americans met a national objective for an additional 10 PUs; end with 75 PUs Objective Americans 9 Vital Forward Bases: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 80 PUs Objective Americans 8 Pacific Airfields: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 85 PUs Objective Americans 3 Defense Obligations: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 90 PUs Objective Americans 2 Outer Territories: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 95 PUs Purchase Units - Chinese Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed Chinese buy nothing; Remaining resources: 4 PUs; Combat Move - Chinese Combat - Chinese Turn Complete - Chinese Chinese collect 1 PU; end with 5 PUs Purchase Units - British Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Americans from Southern France: 1 fighter EDIT: Adding units owned by Americans to United Kingdom: 1 fighter EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode British buy 3 armour, 1 carrier and 1 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Purchase Units - UK_Pacific UK_Pacific buy 2 armour; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; Combat Move - British 1 armour moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Northern Italy British take Northern Italy from Italians 1 bomber moved from Scotland to Southern Italy 1 armour moved from Tanganyika Territory to 72 Sea Zone 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Kenya to 72 Sea Zone 1 armour and 1 infantry moved from India to 39 Sea Zone 1 armour, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 39 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone 1 armour, 1 artillery, 2 infantry and 2 transports moved from 72 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone 1 bomber and 2 fighters moved from India to Iraq 2 armour, 1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from 80 Sea Zone to Iraq 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from India to Burma Combat - British Strategic bombing raid in Southern Italy AA fire in Southern Italy : 1/1 hits, 0.17 expected hits 1 bomber killed by AA Bombing raid in Southern Italy causes 0 damage total. Battle in Iraq British attack with 2 armour, 1 artillery, 1 bomber, 2 fighters and 3 infantry Italians defend with 2 armour, 3 infantry and 2 mech_infantrys British roll dice for 2 cruisers in Iraq, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 1.00 expected hits British roll dice for 2 armour, 1 artillery, 1 bomber, 2 fighters and 3 infantry in Iraq, round 2 : 5/9 hits, 3.67 expected hits Italians roll dice for 2 armour, 3 infantry and 2 mech_infantrys in Iraq, round 2 : 4/7 hits, 2.67 expected hits 2 mech_infantrys owned by the Italians, 1 artillery owned by the British, 3 infantry owned by the Italians, 3 infantry owned by the British and 1 armour owned by the Italians lost in Iraq British roll dice for 2 armour, 1 bomber and 2 fighters in Iraq, round 3 : 2/5 hits, 2.67 expected hits Italians roll dice for 1 armour in Iraq, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0.50 expected hits 1 armour owned by the British and 1 armour owned by the Italians lost in Iraq British win, taking Iraq from Italians with 1 armour, 1 bomber and 2 fighters remaining. Battle score for attacker is 10 Casualties for British: 1 armour, 1 artillery and 3 infantry Casualties for Italians: 2 armour, 3 infantry and 2 mech_infantrys Battle in Burma British attack with 1 artillery and 2 infantry Japanese defend with 1 infantry British roll dice for 1 artillery and 2 infantry in Burma, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 0.83 expected hits Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Burma, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Japanese and 1 infantry owned by the British lost in Burma British win, taking Burma from Japanese with 1 artillery and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0 Casualties for British: 1 infantry Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry Non Combat Move - British 1 aaGun moved from India to Burma 2 fighters moved from Iraq to Persia 1 bomber moved from Iraq to West India 1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from Kenya to Italian Somaliland 2 infantry moved from Rhodesia to Belgian Congo 2 infantry moved from Union of South Africa to Rhodesia 1 mech_infantry moved from West India to Persia 1 armour moved from West India to Persia 1 infantry moved from West India to Eastern Persia 1 infantry moved from West India to India 1 destroyer moved from 80 Sea Zone to 39 Sea Zone 1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Holland Belgium 1 fighter moved from Normandy Bordeaux to United Kingdom 2 fighters moved from 91 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone 1 transport moved from 110 Sea Zone to 111 Sea Zone 1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from Scotland to 111 Sea Zone 1 aaGun, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 111 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone 1 artillery moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone 1 artillery and 1 transport moved from 110 Sea Zone to 92 Sea Zone 1 artillery moved from 92 Sea Zone to Algeria 2 infantry moved from Tunisia to Libya 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Normandy Bordeaux to Southern France 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone 1 aaGun, 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux Place Units - British 1 carrier placed in 110 Sea Zone 1 armour and 1 infantry placed in United Kingdom 2 armour placed in Union of South Africa Turn Complete - British British collect 33 PUs; end with 33 PUs Trigger British 3 No Enemy Submarines: British met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 36 PUs Objective British 4 Control Convoy Lanes: British met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 39 PUs Objective British 2 Southern Europe Beach Head: British met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 42 PUs Place Units - UK_Pacific 2 armour placed in India Turn Complete - UK_Pacific UK_Pacific collect 10 PUs; end with 11 PUs Trigger UK Pacific 4 No Enemy Submarines: UK_Pacific met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 14 PUs Some Units in India change ownership: 2 armourCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Germans : -0.33 Italians : -0.17 British : 0.83 AA fire in Southern Italy : : 2.50 Americans : 0.00 AA fire in Egypt : : -0.17 Japanese : 0.67 -
Wow, that was a lot of work and a lot of units on both sides destroyed. Italy’s turn! They will need to spend 1 IPC to cool down the AA barrels. ;)
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TripleA Turn Summary: Italians round 10
TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 3.4
Game History
Round: 10 Purchase Units - Italians Italians repair damage of 4x factory_minor; Remaining resources: 12 PUs; Italians buy 4 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Combat Move - Italians 1 infantry moved from Ethiopia to Kenya Italians take Kenya from British 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Bryansk to Smolensk 2 mech_infantrys moved from Egypt to Iraq 1 bomber moved from Egypt to Iraq 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Egypt to Alexandria 1 infantry moved from Tambov to Samara Combat - Italians Battle in Iraq Italians attack with 1 bomber and 2 mech_infantrys British defend with 1 armour Italians roll dice for 1 bomber and 2 mech_infantrys in Iraq, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1,00 expected hits British roll dice for 1 armour in Iraq, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits 1 mech_infantry owned by the Italians and 1 armour owned by the British lost in Iraq Italians win, taking Iraq from British with 1 bomber and 1 mech_infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 2 Casualties for Italians: 1 mech_infantry Casualties for British: 1 armour Battle in Alexandria Italians attack with 1 artillery and 1 infantry Americans defend with 1 mech_infantry Italians roll dice for 1 artillery and 1 infantry in Alexandria, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits British roll dice for 1 mech_infantry in Alexandria, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits 1 mech_infantry owned by the Americans lost in Alexandria Italians win, taking Alexandria from British with 1 artillery and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 4 Casualties for Americans: 1 mech_infantry Battle in Smolensk Italians attack with 1 artillery and 1 infantry Russians defend with 1 infantry Italians roll dice for 1 artillery and 1 infantry in Smolensk, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Smolensk, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Smolensk Italians win, taking Smolensk from Russians with 1 artillery and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry Battle in Samara Italians attack with 1 infantry Russians defend with 1 infantry Italians roll dice for 1 infantry in Samara, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,17 expected hits Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Samara, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Italians lost in Samara Russians win with 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is -3 Casualties for Italians: 1 infantry Non Combat Move - Italians 2 infantry moved from Ukraine to Bryansk 1 infantry moved from Bryansk to Tambov 1 bomber moved from Iraq to Egypt Place Units - Italians 1 infantry placed in Egypt 2 infantry placed in Southern Italy 1 infantry placed in Southern Italy Turn Complete - Italians Total Cost from Convoy Blockades: 6 Rolling for Convoy Blockade Damage in 80 Sea Zone. Rolls: 2,3 Rolling for Convoy Blockade Damage in 97 Sea Zone. Rolls: 5,3,2,4,3,1,1 Italians collect 13 PUs (6 lost to blockades); end with 13 PUs Objective Italians 4 Control Iraq Or Persia Or Northwest Persia: Italians met a national objective for an additional 2 PUs; end with 15 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Italians : 0,50 British : 0,17 Russians : 0,33 -
@gamerman01 said in L20 Gamerman01 (L) vs AetV (w/o Iwo NO):
OK, I’m going to roll the Philippines battle on the forum because if I recall correctly, Triple A will roll subs separately - to be sure it’s done properly it needs to be rolled here…
Yes Triple a does that. But you made me curios now how it should be rolled? Is there something we can change?
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Yes, are you on the triple A team??? That would be amazing.
All attacking naval and air units should be rolled together, but you need to also know how many sub hits there are since they can’t hit planes. If I recall correctly, Triple A requires a casualty choice from the defender for the sub hits, without knowing how many hits are from everything else. This is incorrect, and in some instances is actually a big problem, which is why I roll them on the forum.
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Again, to be clear, the defender should know the total number of hits against him from all naval and air units before having to choose any casualties, which is how I conducted that Z35 battle - asking you for casualties from the sum total of round 1, but noting how many hits were from submarines.
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