When can subs be used as fodder?

Not to mention that a victory city, Shanghai, is put at risk.

My last russian sub attacked a Jap. DD in the pacific with the help of a bomber.

This allowed the USA fleet to be unblocked and destroy the Jap. fleet.    :evil:

makes sense, thanks kreig.

and with a detroyer present, the sub cannot submerge.  makes sense.  thank you so much.

Oh, I’m not saying I proposed the perfect attack force.  Certainly if you ONLY care about the BBs and not the subs, an ALL airforce attack force would be best.  I just took the OP’s germany attack force and modulated it as he suggested - first removing the DDs (which as I expected gave him a slight improvement) and then replacing them with additional subs as he described.

when you say ‘5 bom, 1 CA, 4 sub, 0 DD against 4 BB and 4 sub is less then 7%.’ I’m not sure what you’re saying or where you get that from.  The sim I used said it would be about 9% to clear the zone completely and only about 4% possiblity that any of the BB’s survive.  Maybe I’m doing something wrong, or the Sim I’m using is buggy with its order of loss.  :?  Any hits from the fodder boats (CA, 4 Sub) would be taken first against the subs, but once those fodder boats are gone, or the subs are gone, it’s bombers against BBs. and most times it seems the Bombers should win out.

Now that I think about it, the one thing that may not be factored into the sim is that it would make sense for the defender to take any boat hit against the defending subs.  The sim probably automatically assigns the first 4 hits to damage the BBs even if they come from other boats, which would be sub-optimal, given the bombers can ONLY hit the BBs, so you want to direct any non-Bomber hits to the subs.  I guess it would take a pretty clever sim to really get good numbers on this.  :|

@Romulus:

But subs, as TRNs, can not stall because they may be ignored by other surface ships that may treat the sea zone with subs within as friendly or am I wrong?

You’re not wrong.

@Krieghund:

@Gallo:

We both agree that the movement is legal, since it’s not specifically forbidden by the rule book… but his complain is very soundable: all those zeros should be able to intercept my bombers (or other fighters if I had them)

Fighters in territories or sea zones being flown over cannot intercept planes.  Only planes in the territory or sea zone actually being attacked may defend.

@Cowboybob:

On another note i have alwase wonderd….when Fighters attack a territory that does not have any Fighters or AA guns in it and just Ground forces,do the Fighters attacking get to just keep rollin tell they have killed all the Infintry/Tanks?.I can not tell you how maney times me and my fellow A&A freaks have run into a situation where the Germans have these air forces attack a USSR territory with no AA or Fighters.So my queation is do they get to kill all the Reds or do they have to turn back after one round?

Ground units defend normally when attacked by fighters and/or bombers.  The attacking air units can stick around for as many rounds as they like, or until they’re shot down, whichever comes first.

Thanks