Questions about varient

Finally found some interest in the series YG? :p  If so, that’s great :)

The first one from HBG came out in 2011 as Global War 1939.  A reprint came out in 2012 that changed the map a fair bit.  This is the version currently being sold instead of the one from 2011.  Current revision of the rules is at 7.2, which you can get in a .pdf file for free.  Global War 1936, a.k.a. Global War 2nd Edition, came out in early November 2015.  Rules are still being refined I think, they’re at version 1 (in a free .pdf file).

Global War 1936 is supposed to be the biggest and baddest of them all because of how much it encompasses, and how much it potentially encompasses.  If you can look passed the cost, it brings everything to the currently highest possible level of detail.  Units, rules, expansions, compatibility, level of thought and skill, etc…  As far as the best one goes, that’s entirely a matter of preference.  Some people will say that 1942.2 is the best version of any A&A ever.  I don’t own GW36 because of the overall cost, but in my personal opinion I think it’s the best one, although I’m an enthusiast.

The rules for '36 were tested for about 2 years before release.  The devs did put quite some time into the refining process it seems.  Like any product (like a computer program) that comes out however, it becomes subject to a much wider range of scrutiny and set of variables.  I think the refining process for '36 is well on the right side of the bell curve, but since I haven’t played it I can’t tell you exactly where on the bell curve it sits.  I think it’s very safe to say that the core of the game is rock solid.  The new elements that were introduced in '36 appear to be refined enough that there won’t be any fundamental changes, except when there are expansions added (which are entirely optional).  On the other hand, there’s nothing house rules can’t fix haha.

I agree. I’m waiting for the 39 rules to come out and then see if group wants to play with the least amount of rules and expansion sets.

Will also look at putting more money into game.

Having owned/played the orig GW1939, I bought the new 36 global war game/map just before X-mas. We set it up and played a couple rounds, but haven’t jumped back into it as of yet. I thought I was getting both 36 and 39 set-ups when I bought the game, only to find that the 39 set-up was delayed six months until later this spring (which kinda pissed me off). It seems to me that in the early start date you get a lot of weird things going on. The allied navies (w/exception of the USA) are allowed freedom of movement in these first three years (6 turns). Anz/Indian navies have started heading to Europe to join the UK/French etc…so the Atlantic and Med is just overflowing with allied ships. Now this may prove to remedy itself once the Germans start sub warfare, and when the French navy is parted out (Vichy rule) or Japan decides to strike really early (like 1939?)

I’m with the others as far as waiting for the 39 set-up to dive into it (fewer variables), and will also be playing the base game w/o a bunch of bells and whistles (this game already has a lot going on). They seem to really be pushing expansions sets and unit upgrade purchases for all powers etc…but I just want a base game w/1939 start time that works. At some point I will look at some other stuff (they seem to be putting the cart before the horse IMO). I’m also hoping the rules (63 pages) will have an official tweak at the same time the 39 is ready. FYI the rules, set-ups, player aids and power reference sheets are like 120 pages altogether. There will be a free download when you purchase the game, but ink isn’t free lol. Plus the power ref sheets have already had an update (33 pages), and like I said I believe the rules will be revisited at some point.

I have to say that I’m impressed with the map, and like the mountains and rivers aspect. The rules (clarifications) seem a work in progress, but I believe the game to be playable. You should expect your first run through to be rather exhausting though. They have a site up for GW1936 that gives details about the game with a FAQ for Q&A  etc…and they are pretty quick about responding.

here is a link: http://www.globalwargame.com/www/dwqa-questions/

YG, you Can but the map incl. a few extra items for 159$.
Then you need the extra pieces.

http://www.historicalboardgaming.com/Global-War-1936-1945-Variant-Map_p_2029.html

Hello,
Getting in late to this convo, heh.

I’ve been a long time fan of A&A, and have put in a lot of hours into the game, both in the original A&A boards and HBG’s G1939 and G1936 boards.

I enjoy playing on the HBG boards immensely more then on the originals. The originals made me feel constrained in a way, experienced players had a short list of opening moves they would commit, kingpin areas that needed to be held, and tactics that became a little too predictable for my taste.
I found that on the larger HBG maps, especially the well designed 1936 map with its mountains and cities and rivers and the way they impacted combat, things became much more grand in scale.

The first six turns on the HBG 1936 start go by fairly quickly, the only combat present is the Sino-Japanese War, the Spanish Civil War, and Russo-Japanese Border Clashes, all of which sees little or no territory change hands. If a player is familiar with the game, the first six turns take about as much time as a single turn after 1939.

Then we come across an issue. The setup map may need tweaks.
In my last game as Axis, poised on the brink of war, the French have their troops in Picardy, with only a little presence behind the fortifications bonuses at the Maginot Line, sufficient to defeat me. The French buildup was such that the whole German Army was only a little better then the French. And because the Germans had to divert troops to Poland in order to defeat both France and Poland in one turn, July 1939, on the Sitzkrieg Front, the French and Germans where at a force parity. They knew I had to attack Picardy via Holland, the Maginot was too strong, so they put everything in Picardy.

So, I did the Schlieffen Plan through Switzerland. Germany gets a special “Lightning War” move where it can do combat move twice on its first turn when at war with a Major Power. This is necessary so that the Germans would be capable of defeating Poland, and then sprinting across to guard the border against France.
So, I annexed Switzerland, and ended my first phase of the Lightning War. (because tanks forgo their 2 space move when crossing or in mountains) and on the second phase of the “Lightning War” I blitzed into Lorraine, bypassing the Maginot Line bonuses, and then blitzed on to Paris. I defeated the French and the Polish on turn one.
If I dare say so, a brilliant move. It shouldn’t have been possible, but it was if you follow the letter of the rules.

I say all this to illustrate a point. The map is amazing, I love it and now I kinda dislike playing on the originals, but certain neutrals need to be buffed, maybe a rule or two tweaked.
All it would take is to make a house rule and put a fortress in Switzerland, representing “Swiss National Redoubt” to intimidate the German player into taking the Lowlands into France, or to take enough casualties that any further attack could fail.

Aside from this, another feature I quite enjoy about the HBG, is that there are rules in place for actually winning the game.
To date, the only A&A game I have ever won going by the rulebook definition is probably 1914. Every other A&A game ends when people generally agree that there would be a winner if the game had progressed another 8 turns. But its never clear cut, usually it ends with “Well the Axis probably won in the west, but the Axis lost in the east.”. These always frustrated me because I think that now that the Axis won in the west/east but lost the other theater, they technically still have the world in a balance!
This game makes it quite clear cut who the winner is, and allows players to come to an agreement to cleanly end the war with some kind of peace conference. Players tally up the points they acquired, and the one with most points wins. Easy peasy. A&A just gave very broad victory terms that where rarely achieved, but only brought the game to a point where the players ran out of time and made an educated guess at the winner.

I like the HBG 1936 map, it expands the world, allows for more strategic complications, introduces map variables like rivers, canals, mountains, and cities. It introduces new units like Militia, Cavalry, Fortifications, Light Tank, Tanks and Heavy Tanks, Marines, Mountaineer and Airborne Infantry. Each has found a niche that makes them very useful in attaining victory, nothing feels superfluous.
The convoy raiding system, the lend lease, the diplomatic options with neutral nations. All make for an exceptional game.
The only downside is working out the rare bug, and coming up with a house rule that everyone feels content with.
I highly recommend this map to everyone.

I realize this post is slightly off topic, but I really enjoy this game and I wish to get others interested in it as well. Especially when in the future HBG will be coming up with different variant maps on a global scale.

Cheers!

I agree with you.

It does seem that the Germans purposely delay the strike on Poland, because they want to use the one time double move on both Poland and France at the same time (messes up the time line IMO). I can see the problem at the French border as well, and circumventing through Switzerland just seems wrong.

Can’t the Germans defeat the Polish w/o using the double move though?

Maybe the Germans should be able to buy mech and medium tanks a turn earlier?

Haven’t played enough to come up with a real solution, but maybe expanding the double move?

It seems to me that the Germans used a blitzing technique more then just one time lol. Maybe allow for another double move or “precursor double move” to be used only on Poland. That way you could take down Poland in say beginning 39, then rail those units to the Western front second half of 39. Then you’re ready to hit the French in 1940.

I also think that the Swiss should get a blockhouse w/o question to bolster their defense. I also think that the Germans maybe should get an economic incentive for not attacking the Swiss. Say 1 IPCs every round that the Swiss stay neutral starting in 1939, call it a trading partner NO or something.

I’m hoping that the 1939 set-up will address these issues. I would imagine that the Germans will be set to squash the Poles on the first (maybe second) turn, then shift focus to France a couple turns later.

@WILD:

I agree with you.

It does seem that the Germans purposely delay the strike on Poland, because they want to use the one time double move on both Poland and France at the same time (messes up the time line IMO). I can see the problem at the French border as well, and circumventing through Switzerland just seems wrong.

It’s always a risk, if Germany wants to take out both France and Poland in a single turn (6 month time frame), they stretch themselves on both fronts to the point where victory can not be completely assured. But if Germany takes out Poland first without managing to secure France on the same turn, then a U.K who focuses on Army buildup could theoretically throw everything they have into France on its subsequent turn, making it just as hard as the initial German two front attack.

If Germany takes out France first, Poland becomes controlled by the U.K, they can pull everything into Warsaw with its +1 bonus, fly in air support, build three units there, and that is only T1 (after DOW), the German Forces in France would be out of position to attack until T3(DOW). Of course Germany may have built a spare force by then to attack, but it might not be enough.

I think Germany must attack on both fronts on its first wartime move, it shouldn’t be hard, but against a skillful Allies player, it could lose you the war if played wrong.

@WILD:

Can’t the Germans defeat the Polish w/o using the double move though?

Yep I think so, Warsaw is only two territories away, into it with a few Tanks, Mechs and a couple Cavalry to absorb hits on the first territory would work fine.
If I remember the rules correctly, those units can use the second phase of the lightning war to rail some units to the West Front, to participate in a T2W (Turn 2 Wartime) attack into France if the German forces there where just too weak to do the job.
The issue there that I found, is that the railways go from West Germany to Netherlands to Belgium, there are no railways between West Germany to Belgium, so Germany has to take out Netherlands to get the Polish forces all the way to Belgium. I wanted to avoid this so that the Far East Command couldn’t get the DEI (I really exploited all that I could in my game, several house rules came into play after that).

So that would have left my German Forces faced off against everything the French had in Picardy, and it was too much of a risk to lose my precious tanks to them. Hence I exploited the Switzerland plan.

@WILD:

Maybe the Germans should be able to buy mech and medium tanks a turn earlier?

Mmm, I just saved my IPP’s for a couple pre-war turns, and then when I was able to purchase my Mech and M-Arm I maxed out my factories producing them for one round, and then in the last pre-war round I built a few more in West Germany to be ready for the Jump Off.

@WILD:

Haven’t played enough to come up with a real solution, but maybe expanding the double move?

It seems to me that the Germans used a blitzing technique more then just one time lol. Maybe allow for another double move or “precursor double move” to be used only on Poland. That way you could take down Poland in say beginning 39, then rail those units to the Western front second half of 39. Then you’re ready to hit the French in 1940.

Perhaps they could, but I found that the French get strong very quickly.

I can’t remember what the rules say about it, but was it that the Lightning War allowed for either a Combat move or a Strategic move but not both? As in, the German East Force takes out Poland in phase one, then rails to the west in phase two. The alternative is the German East Force takes out Poland, rails, and joins for a phase two assault on France.
I think it was the former.

Either way I like it where its at, it presents a nice challenge and a risk, if the dice are against Germany in its initial French assaults, the war could very well be over before it ever began.

@WILD:

I also think that the Swiss should get a blockhouse w/o question to bolster their defense. I also think that the Germans maybe should get an economic incentive for not attacking the Swiss. Say 1 IPCs every round that the Swiss stay neutral starting in 1939, call it a trading partner NO or something.

That’s actually a fantastic idea, make it not worth the costs of invading. Sort of like the situation with Sweden.
There is a tiny bit of historical evidence for economic trading.

@Wikipedia:

Financial relationships with Nazi Germany
Switzerland’s trade was blockaded by both the Allies and by the Axis. Each side openly exerted pressure on Switzerland not to trade with the other. Economic cooperation and extension of credit to the Third Reich varied according to the perceived likelihood of invasion, and the availability of other trading partners. Concessions reached their zenith after a crucial rail link through Vichy France was severed in 1942, leaving Switzerland completely surrounded by the Axis. Switzerland relied on trade for half of its food and essentially all of its fuel, but controlled vital trans-alpine rail tunnels between Germany and Italy. Switzerland’s most important exports during the war were precision machine tools, watches, jewel bearings (used in bomb sights), electricity, and dairy products. Until 1936, the Swiss franc was the only remaining major freely convertible currency in the world,[31] and both the Allies and the Germans sold large amounts of gold to the Swiss National Bank. Between 1940 and 1945, the German Reichsbank sold 1.3 billion francs worth of gold to Swiss Banks in exchange for Swiss francs and other foreign currency, which were used to buy strategically important raw materials like tungsten and oil from neutral countries.[26] Hundreds of millions of francs worth of this gold was monetary gold plundered from the central banks of occupied countries. A total of 581,000 francs’ worth of “Melmer” gold taken from Holocaust victims in eastern Europe was sold to Swiss banks.[26] In total, trade between Germany and Switzerland contributed about 0.5% to the German war effort and did not significantly lengthen the war.

Unfortunately not quite enough evidence I think. Perhaps the bonus would only come into play if the whole of Switzerland is surrounded by Axis and Vichy.
At the very least, like you say, the Swiss should have a bunker. How do you employ bunker systems? What bonuses do they give?

@WILD:

I’m hoping that the 1939 set-up will address these issues. I would imagine that the Germans will be set to squash the Poles on the first (maybe second) turn, then shift focus to France a couple turns later.

Yeah that would be great! Its better if the Company makes the rules rather then House rules patching things up, it makes it easier to play with random people.

I personally will still want to play with the 1936 set up, I really like the versatility and the ability to fight out the Sino-Japanese War, sometimes it gets botched up China just keeps getting stronger and Japan has to finally give up taking ground. Or the Spanish Civil War, sometimes the players lend-lease everything into it to win it, other times it stagnates, its a fantastic diversion of resources and the Allied player really takes a secret glee whenever the Comintern and the Axis players lose units in those mountains.

Also, I should state that in my circle of players, we do have a few major house rules that change the game, so the issues we have may not be the same for other players.
The biggest one being the Air-force, we didn’t like how the Air-force was always seemed like the most powerful unit in the game, so we majorly tweaked it. Air-force can only roll once per battle, fighters can only hit aircraft in a pre-battle dogfight, and the Air-force generally has become cheaper. Aircraft can also scramble to adjacent territories. We found this works really well. The Air War is vicious and bloody, Boots and Tanks matter more, and it allows more of historical feel to the game. Its great.  :-)

Anyways! Your suggestion for Switzerland was awesome, I’m going to look into it further, it still might not be enough to stop a Schlieffen via Switzerland, that Nation is worth at least 1 IPP, and it presents Germany with a third option of attack. I think it needs something a little stronger. Like…the Swiss where talking about avalanches and rock slides and locking up the whole nation, perhaps any forces in Switzerland get stuck there for an additional turn?

At the very least, when moving out of mountains moves should be reduced to one. The current rule is that when crossing into mountains or across a mountain border, move must end. Perhaps by extending this rule so that units must end their turn AFTER leaving a mountain area would prevent an attack on Paris. On thinking about this, it seems so obvious that perhaps its implied in the rules without stating it.