Is it possible to win as the allies after sealion?

@theROCmonster:

Game must be broken if it takes the allies to win two 97% battles to have the advantage…

In my mind, if you say the game is broken, then you are saying that more than 80% of the time one side loses.  That’s why I tend not to use the term broken.

Can the allies win after sea lion?  Yes.  Hell yes even.  The trick is giving the DEI to India so they can reinforce Russia.
Can the allies win after double sea lion?  Yes, but it’s a lot harder.  You cannot leave anything to chance, engage in battles you are certain to win, and avoid those where the issue is in doubt, grab anything you can to increase your income (hence why I advise the axis to avoid taking anything they dont need) so that your financial power can beat the Axis powers, despite being an ally down.

who hasn’t gotten diced? I can’t tell you how many times I lost germany with above 90% odds to defend it in all versions and same with moscow, but that comes from playing more than a thousand games. Then there are countless times you do the same opener you always do and end up losing half your battles. Or lose your entire fleet with UK twice to 2 subs. 5 naval defending with a destroyer against 2 subs… kept destroyer all the way and still lose. then usa goes to attack it with destroyer 2 bomber fighter… all miss sub hit. uk has a destroyer with carrier 2 fighter cruiser… the same 5 naval earlier… 2 subs kill it all 1 sub survived.

Or 1 fighter attacking carrier 2 fighters and flying off… wow japan out 3 transports. That’s great. even lost carrier first. lol.

I am sure you have all been traumatized by dice. I did most of the traumatizing in the past though. 5 heavy bombers, 5 aa gun hits. ahh… or my 2 heavy bombers guarded by 1 aa gun. 3 bombers come to attack. 3 aa gun hits.  yes traumatic events do occur.

@jim010:

FYI, currently losing my Sealion Global game.  First time I’ll be losing after a successful Sealion.

Surendered that one.  First Sealion of Global I lost.  My tournament game doesn’t count, as I lost Paris on G1 and couldn’t even try it.

Good luck next time, it will be different…… The way I look at it is,  that I cant roll that bad again, not for a long time anyway. It was just what Russia needed or it would have been game over… I should have played Yatzee after round 3

@suprise:

Good luck next time, it will be different…… The way I look at it is,  that I cant roll that bad again, not for a long time anyway. It was just what Russia needed or it would have been game over… I should have played Yatzee after round 3

Credit should be given where credit is due.  He took my misfortune and shoved it down my throat.

I’m going to play some yatzee now …

My experience is this:

If you get sealioned, and cannot counter to sink the German navy, then you’re screwed.

If you can force germany to pay for that obscene transport buy on G2, then you have hope.

For what it’s worth…

wow your attack on paris G1 failed? That’s why I send all ground forces that can reach Paris go in paris and don’t try the other french crap states.

I even skip 1 of UK’s transports for battling. Just to seal the deal on the rest of em. I don’t like 70% naval battles round 1, I need to get that to 85%+ to have a more consistent game plan.

I find that if Germany goes for sealion on 3, then you got to be aggressive with USSR, taking out Finland, Norway, even getting down into the Balkans.  Germany can usually push you back, but a couple turns making 55+ for the USSR adds up quick. And if the US can get back UK on US 5 or US 6, with Germany just starting to make inroads into the USSR, then its all over for Germany.

@Cmdr:

@theROCmonster:

Game must be broken if it takes the allies to win two 97% battles to have the advantage…

In my mind, if you say the game is broken, then you are saying that more than 80% of the time one side loses.  That’s why I tend not to use the term broken.

Can the allies win after sea lion?  Yes.  Hell yes even.  The trick is giving the DEI to India so they can reinforce Russia.
Can the allies win after double sea lion?  Yes, but it’s a lot harder.  You cannot leave anything to chance, engage in battles you are certain to win, and avoid those where the issue is in doubt, grab anything you can to increase your income (hence why I advise the axis to avoid taking anything they dont need) so that your financial power can beat the Axis powers, despite being an ally down.

Jen I’m being serious and i am not trying to bash or insult you, so don’t take it that way but:

Wait a second here?  If Japan is such a huge power that can take India on 3 every game how is India sending units to Russia?

I said the same thing in a post about India sending units to help Russia and/or go take back Egypt and you were one of a few who said it was hogwash and it couldn’t happen and wouldn’t help. You also state that India falls by 5 for sure every single game.

I’m a little confused here!?!!  Which is it? India falls or India can survive?  Or are you just saying if Japan doesn’t go for India? Then I understand.

On the topic:

I believe that if the allies take out the german fleet after the sack of London it is 60/40 allies.  If the allies don’t take out the German fleet after London falls then I would agree it may give the axis a slight edge but victory is still not guaranteed.

Every game I have played F2F India has a slim chance of falling but the Japanese lose a lot of units in te process. In the rounds leading up to the attack on India, Hawaii, Philippines, and sydney are all being stacked. Then there is the two rounds Japan has to take to get to Sydney or Hawaii giving two more rounds of stacking. I haven’t seen the pacific fall as easily as people tend to say.

It’s next to impossible to stop the German sea lion on 3, but there is that slight chance that it can be stopped.  I believe that the allies in a joint effort can take out the German fleet after it happens though.

I have also seen the Americans come in and take Rome and Paris back ignoring London. In that same game I saw India UK take back Egypt. The VCs in Europe kept going tit for tat but once America had the foothold in Europe it was over for the axis.

So I do believe the allies can win after sealion.

Personally as russia I don’t bother with the north side as germany has transports. I try to push mouth with all my units.

India can be saved by the allies in the following manner:

Round 1:  2 Fighters, 1 Tactical Bomber move into position from Russia
Round 2:  2 Fighters, Tactical Bomber move to India, 3 fighters from last round’s build move into position
Round 3:  3 new fighters from round 1’s builds move to India

Successfully saved India

That’s an extreme case, but it demonstrates that India can, at least on paper, be saved.  What else can the allies do to save India?  I leave that up to the community to discover (I can’t give away ALL my trade secrets!  I am in the league, you know!!!)

On any given Sunday, it’s highly plausible that Japan, dedicating all their resources, can take India before America can get in the war and highly unlikely that India will fall if it does not fall prior to round 5, saving the case where the Indian player makes a huge tactical mistake.  In my opinion - of course.

I only take the ftr and tac from Moscow. The rest of my strat is all from the PAC and Africa.

Are you buying more planes with Russia for the help?

@TheOne:

I only take the ftr and tac from Moscow. The rest of my strat is all from the PAC and Africa.

Are you buying more planes with Russia for the help?Â

Personally?  no.  The Indians are on their bloody own, it’s their own darn fault for not preparing right, I want my Russians in infantry form, thank you very much.  However, the outline WOULD effectively stop Crush Calcutta, right?

It’s the only way I’ve seen that actually STOPs Crush Calcutta, all the rest can divert Crush Calcutta into devastating attacks on other Allied units.  I’ve bagged the entire Australian fleet and the entire Australian airforce in exchange for not doing Calcutta before because the moron placed the fighters on Java - well DUH!  Of course I’m killing your 3 undefended fighters, be glad to use 4 shore bombardments and 4 infantry to kill them, thank you very much!  Oh, and you have nothing to defend Australia with?  Oh well, guess I’ll take that too.

The cure should NOT be worse than the disease!

The worst thing you can do as Russia on a sealion game is to push into Germany.  This takes away Russias greatest advantage which is distance to Moscow.  What I do with Russia is build inf and art at a ratio of 2 to 1 with a tank or fighter each round and pull my troops off the coasts.  By time Germany is heading toward Moscow I have 50-60 inf with art, tanks and fighters which ensures they don’t get far.

Cond that really doesn’t make any sense.
Pushing into German territory only ensures that once Germany finally pushes you back to Moscow, you’ll have more infantry defending than you would otherwise.

I would think that you’d want to push in as Russia if you could. That way it takes longer for Germany to get to Moscow. PLUS, the NO of 3 ipcs per German territory.

In your experience (this is a question for everyone), when Germany does Sealion, how often does Russia steamroll (or eventually) steamroll Germany? ever? sometimes?

Well unless Germany screws up in a big way, Russia won’t be able to actually defeat Germany.
But good Russian play can keep you in German territories for around 3 turns, which is huge for the Allies.

think of it this way. Germans can’t jack UK whatever russians are on the front lines in the same turn.

He already invested so heavily in boats so you frontloading all your men is super gosu.

Even if he turns around and tries to jack russia up. 1) you saved UK 2) UK can send stuff to you to save your butt.

I mean the guy just bought how many transports to not go through with UK takedown? I garauntee he won’t get a +TUV value as high as that killing the ground you frontload.

So yeah trading german territories is big for russia. You got to push.

Again I just feel that the germans are walking out of UK with too much stuff.

@Alsch91:

Cond that really doesn’t make any sense.
Pushing into German territory only ensures that once Germany finally pushes you back to Moscow, you’ll have more infantry defending than you would otherwise.

Your right, Russia does need to push into the German boarder territories to get the IPC bonus, but I never commit my main force into Germany because it makes it easier for Germany to destroy.