Scorched Earth
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@trig said in Scorched Earth:
@gen-manstein
“Once at war with a Major Power, U.S.S.R. may use 1 rail move to move a Minor or Medium Factory and 2 rail moves to move a Major Factory. The factory cannot produce any units/tech the turn it moves. It moves in whatever state of damage it has suffered. It must be in – and remain inside - Soviet Home Country”
From: https://www.historicalboardgaming.com/assets/images/HBG/GW1936v3/Ref Sheets/USSR v33.pdf
Please look at the reference sheets next time.OK So how do u guys feel about being able to move a damaged factory ? So they basically saying there is still salvage able tooling and some equipment to allow a damaged factory to move ?
The reason why I ask is all games that I’ve played u cannot move a damaged factory until repaired. -
@gen-manstein I think that’s how I look at it, yeah. That there’s salvageable stuff, etc. I definitely get what you’re saying about not moving them, but I’m generally okay with the rule. It’s still going to be damages when you move it, so if it’s worth it to you to expend rail movement points to get a damaged factory moved then your call to make.
I think we’d see a lot of fun with strategic bombing if this wasn’t allowed though. I know I’d make sure to bomb factories as I got close so that they couldn’t be moved if that was the case!
But I don’t think it ruins gameplay or anything by allowing it to happen.
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@chris_henry said in Scorched Earth:
@gen-manstein I think that’s how I look at it, yeah. That there’s salvageable stuff, etc. I definitely get what you’re saying about not moving them, but I’m generally okay with the rule. It’s still going to be damages when you move it, so if it’s worth it to you to expend rail movement points to get a damaged factory moved then your call to make.
I think we’d see a lot of fun with strategic bombing if this wasn’t allowed though. I know I’d make sure to bomb factories as I got close so that they couldn’t be moved if that was the case!
But I don’t think it ruins gameplay or anything by allowing it to happen.
Right. 1 key is to bomb a factory or 2 based on draining some of Russia’s income and delaying the factory moves to urals to help build up the force to hold Stalingrad if Moscow falls.
Ya plus u still have to repair so
Much of factory before u could even build.Not to get off topic but I may have to change this rule in my game. Have live stream game on Saturday
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@gen-manstein
Ya plus u still have to repair so
Much of factory before u could even build.This is why I’m not too concerned about allowing them to be moved. If it’s really worth it to you to move a damaged factory, using your rail movements, and to still have to repair it later? More power to you I suppose.
But I like your rule/idea/concept of realizing that keeping factories damaged and thus unable to move will weaken Soviet abilities to defend Stalingrad, or another stronghold, later on if Moscow were to fall. It certainly adds a different dynamic to the strategies both sides would take!
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I’ll probably keep it the same rule. Also based on what u have in game as far as income for Russia and right balance
Thanks Chris and Trig -
@gen-manstein I’d love to see your rules sometime if you have them available and don’t mind showing. Sounds like you have quite the game you’ve made!
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@chris_henry said in Scorched Earth:
@gen-manstein I’d love to see your rules sometime if you have them available and don’t mind showing. Sounds like you have quite the game you’ve made!
Pm me your e mail
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@chris_henry said in Scorched Earth:
@noneshallpass I agree with all you said. I think that’s the proper reading of the rules as well. And I agree about the ability to essentially snipe facilities!
Thank you for your support, but the FAQ decided that I did not have everything right. At least the need to have the territory in Soviet possession since the beginning of the turn stops surprise airborne demolition operations…
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@chris_henry said in Scorched Earth:
@gen-manstein
Ya plus u still have to repair so
Much of factory before u could even build.This is why I’m not too concerned about allowing them to be moved. If it’s really worth it to you to move a damaged factory, using your rail movements, and to still have to repair it later? More power to you I suppose.
But I like your rule/idea/concept of realizing that keeping factories damaged and thus unable to move will weaken Soviet abilities to defend Stalingrad, or another stronghold, later on if Moscow were to fall. It certainly adds a different dynamic to the strategies both sides would take!
Well keep in mind Hitler did not want the oil fields damaged in Caucasus but if you damage the 3 oil derricks it also lowers Russia’s income but then Germany has to repair them in order to get a Middle East oil bonus point.
Ok enough. Going off topic -
Hey!
Sorry to ask that on this old topic, but I have questions about scorched earth.
-How many times can we use scorched earth ability per turn, I believe it’s only one territory per turn?
-Are the facilities remove from the board? Or just taking the maximum damage they can? When you use this ability on a territory.
-Can we move a factory (with the other USSR special ability) and then destroy the other facilities in that area?
The correct question should be: “when the factory movement ability is decide? Before or after the combat movement" (witch is the phase where you can use scorched earth). -
@didier_de_dax said in Scorched Earth:
Hey!
Sorry to ask that on this old topic, but I have questions about scorched earth.
-How many times can we use scorched earth ability per turn, I believe it’s only one territory per turn?
-Are the facilities remove from the board? Or just taking the maximum damage they can? When you use this ability on a territory.
-Can we move a factory (with the other USSR special ability) and then destroy the other facilities in that area?
The correct question should be: “when the factory movement ability is decide? Before or after the combat movement" (witch is the phase where you can use scorched earth).Hey, Didier! NP bringing up old topics. 8 )
You can use Scorched Earth an unlimited number of times in a turn! Go to town, my friend!
If you use sculpts for your facilities, they can be removed. If you want to use damage markers, you can. Think about it this way: You are the one doing the sabotage, so you get decide how you want to damage the facilities. A minor port would cost 3/3 to produce, but only 2/2 with improved construction. If your enemy had improved construction, he could repair a fully damaged minor port for 8 (one turn), or build a new one for 2/2.
You can’t move a factory if you destroy the rail out of that territory via Scorched Earth that same turn, because the factory moves during non-combat movement using strategic rail movement. However, you could do Scorched Earth that same turn in the same territory on other facilities like rail leading to other places.
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@hbg-gw-enthusiast Ok ! thanks for the answer !
So, I’m able to put facilities out of the map using the scorched earth tactic.
Also, if I use scorched earth tactic on a territory with railroads, these railroads are considered “remove from the map” even if I can’t put them out, because they are printed on the map?
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Yes, you can use the damaged railroad tokens.
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@hbg-gw-enthusiast Are you sure you get to choose if the facilities are removed from the board (being destroyed) or if the facilities take full damage but remain on the board ? It seems to me a bit odd that the rule isn’t clearer about that.
If I get you, you can remove all the rails of a region and each rail will be needed to be built again if you want to use them ? So in eastern Ukraine for example you will need to build 5 new rails in order to put back what’s on the printed map ? And last question if Germany rebuild railroads in completely scorch earthed region it must still build in Russian gauge ? If they are removed I don’t see why you should but I still ask because we never know.
Thanks in advance for you answers and I am sorry if I misunderstood something but I am a bit lost !
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@spartantom No problem!
You do destroy the facility (it is removed and must be built again. Thus, all the rail comes off the map and must be rebuilt.
As for the gauge, I do not know. I would figure it out with your group. -
@spartantom I’m positive you can destroy the rail. From Page 2 of the USSR National Reference Sheet, Scorched Earth, “Can destroy its own facilities during the Combat Phase of its turn.” A more interesting question is could you just damage it?
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@Trig Ha! You responded literally seconds before I did!
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I think it would be up to the building player what gauge they decide to build with.
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