General 6 Stars 1941 WW2 Game

[General 6 Stars]

Yes with 2 hits

[baron Münchhausen]

@SS-GEN

How UK not buying such BB in London or Cairo?

[General 6 Stars]

Non. To much other stuff going on.

[General 6 Stars]

Can’t build BB CR or AC at any minor ic

[baron Münchhausen]

@SS-GEN

When trying to build up a fleet core and near a Naval Base, it seems the obvious choice at 14 PU for US or UK.

What is price of Carrier?

[General 6 Stars]

AC cost 12

[baron Münchhausen]

@SS-GEN

I pretty much like your roster cost structure.

C6, C9 A6 D6, 12.
14 A9 D9, 2 hits IMO will prove to be pretty worth the bang for the bucks.

Play test might reveal the flaw or it is still limited because of being a sea unit, less useful on land.

[General 6 Stars]

Ya looked at AD@9 to. Will see once we get back to playing. Been some good games with all the stuff. Just tweakin a piece or 2 and Moscow has a chance to defend with no allies help if Germany goes all out and if Moscow falls should be enough stuff to retake Moscow while Paris is being liberated.

[baron Münchhausen]

@SS-GEN
Maybe it was because Cruiser sometimes get a second attack roll on aircraft.

But, now if it is just one roll per unit. It might be seen differently.

[General 6 Stars]

Ya. Will see by leaving BB same and giving Cruiser 1 less on AD but +1 on plane bonus kill will be interesting. It should work. It was the plane killer make them help defend a Destroyer or 2 and small fleets from air

[General 6 Stars]

We haven’t played with 2 dice roll for each ship. Went to what I have awhile ago.

[baron Münchhausen]

@SS-GEN
I forgot to mention I like the first time Tac/Dive @6 then @4.
Interesting way to balance them with Fighter.

Do you still use the movement (range) bonus for land vs naval Fighter?

[General 6 Stars]

Yes. Land move 5 naval planes move 4

[ghr2]

@baron-Münchhausen One of the main reasons why people have not been buying battleships is that cruisers are just better for the price. The fact that they move one more space than any other naval unit is huge. They are much better economically since you get more dice power per IPC spent than you do on a battleship. Yes a battleship can take two hits, but you have to pay to repair. I would much rather have two cruisers and pay a small amount extra than 1 battleship.

Historically, this makes sense. Battleships were on the way out in terms of being the central feature of the modern battlefleet. Carriers were taking over.

[General 6 Stars]

I agree with ghr2. This is what’s in the last game. Now Baron I’ve been crunching numbers and looking at game play and it comes down to the Cruiser. I don’t know how many times I’ve crunched numbers in the last year on this. It’s either to strong in game a bit or it’s to weak against destroyers based on cost for the bang. So just like a fig and Inf something has to give even if the 1 piece is a bit weaker. So in last game
BB C14 AD8 AD1 aa
1.28 .16 = 1.44
CR C9 AD7 AD1 aa
1.04 .15 = 1.19
DD C6 AD3 AD1 aa
1.00 .30 = 1.30
So as you see DD is to strong. They shouldn’t be the aa defend killer. So take away DD aa and give to CR but now you need to lower CR AD value so it’s not to strong. Here’s where no matter the numbers u have either the DD or CR gonna be to weak or strong. DD C6 is great in game. Every country benefits. The Cruiser should lose a turret of big guns for the aa defense. So now it’s a bit weaker on ship kills compared to a DD. The CR does gain half of the DD aa shot by going from .15 to .30 AD@2.
So here’s the 2 options that are best I believe.
Option 1
BB C 14 AD8 AD1 aa 2 hits Dam AD6
CR C9 AD6 AD2 aa
DD C6 AD3 only.
Option 2
BB C14 AD9 AD1 aa 2 hits Dam AD6
CR C9 AD6 AD2 aa
DD C6 AD3 only
Option 2 of course is better when BB have to repair 1d6 based on AD@9
Option 1 is kinda being tested now in above pics with Tac/Dive AD@6 first round only AD@4 rest of rounds and still getting AD@1 DF kill.
If u want to be an ass make BB have to stay in port for a turn if being repaired. Lol

[baron Münchhausen]

@SS-GEN

Cruiser being M3 can be a bit weaker per cost ratio compared to DD or BB.

And I believe making the main AA warship is good.

DD as is now seems cool.

Maybe BB repair cost might be the issue.
To provide more versatility and ease of deployment, I would try something like:
NB repairs BB for 2 IPCs AND allows repair in a given SZ with Island or land TT without NB for twice the cost (4 IPCs).

[General 6 Stars]

@baron-Münchhausen said in SS GEN's 1941 Global War Game:

@SS-GEN

Cruiser being M3 can be a bit weaker per cost ratio compared to DD or BB.

And I believe making the main AA warship is good.

DD as is now seems cool.

Maybe BB repair cost might be the issue.
To provide more versatility and ease of deployment, I would try something like:
NB repairs BB for 2 IPCs AND allows repair in a given SZ with Island or land TT without NB for twice the cost (4 IPCs).

A possibility there but no repair without a naval base. That always kills me when Japan can attack a nice US fleet then next turn repair BB AC for no cost out in the open water and then kill all of Anzac Fec navy if u don’t know the repair rule. That’s BS.
I like BB AD@9 and need a naval base for repair.
Game is based on some risk reward. You take the chance to repair at 1 icp or 6 icps. Look at it as more damaged the ship was the higher the cost.
Other option give BB no reduced value when damaged. But that’s a cop out.

[General 6 Stars]

After some major test rolling and ave odds were gonna go with
option 1 mentioned above that is being tested now.
BB C14 AD@8 AD@1aa. 2 hits. Dam AD@6 AD@1aa. Repair 1d6.
CR C9 AD@6 AD@2aa
This makes the Cruiser a all round ship you need for air defense.
So in game if nobody knows you roll 1 dice per piece but have chance for a double hit. Lets say if you roll for
a BB and roll is a 2 you get 1 normal hit other sides casualty choice.
Roll for a CR and roll is a 2 you get a normal hit other sides casualty choice &
you get a bonus plane kill from ship aa and now you force the other side to have to
pick a plane also as a casualty. For now still there choice.
Also figs get a DF @2 bonus plane kill too.
So now in naval battles you have all the possible combinations going on.
same thing in land battles where land figs and tacs are doing the same thing.
Yes there is some air superiority going on too in these battles.
So figs AD@5 AD@2 DF So if a fig rolls a 2 or less they get a bonus DF plane kill too and a Normal hit other sides choice but now you force them to have to take a plane
casualty. This has been working out great in game. This way not all planes get bank or saved till the last 2 rounds of combat and planes win the battles. I disagree with this. Planes helped yes won a few small battles but over all just helped in battles.
Only problem is still Ger buying a ton of planes the round right before they attack Moscow. Well I’ve seen this go both ways for Moscow in game. One time more tanks than planes. So Ger has 9 figs and Moscow has 8 figs. In first round Ger got 3 bonus fig
DF kills and Russia on defense roll got 0 DF plane kills. So now next round Ger has 9 figs and Russia 5 figs. Ger got 2 more fig kills and again Russia got 0.
So Russia retreated there last 3 fig planes for future support. Either side can retreat planes after any round of combat.
Other time Ger went with more mechs and art and planes and got Moscow but Russia did take Moscow back but some allies Europe landings got delayed a turn or 2 and a few wrong moves was just enough for Ger to hold Paris with some planes leaving Moscow.
Anyway that’s that.

[baron Münchhausen]

@SS-GEN

“Don’t forget planes are dog fighting same time as combat.
Figs C8 AD@5 2 or less bonus DF plane kill
Tac/Dive roll a 1 after first round get a bonus DF plane kill too
Stg Bomber rolls a 1 get a bonus DF plane kill too.
May drop this based on there focus is dropping payload first round only so can’t DF on first round like Tac dive”

I see how you play the bonus dogfight.

Cruiser and Fighter are pretty close in cost: 9 vs 8.

Just my two cents,
Keeping the bonus planes kill for Cruiser (2), Battleship (1), Tac and Strat bombers (1).

But what about making Fighter just killing plane if there is any?
With no double hit bonus.
Figs C8 AD@5, 5 or less bonus plane kill if there is any.

All have more bomb shells (turrets for warships) and AA guns than Fighter while Fighter were built first against other planes.
My question is mostly about impact of this idea on your game flow and mechanic playability.

If this can work, then Fighter cost can be drop to 7 IPCs because of higher casualty rate (as they become the Artillery of air vs TcB, being AirTank).

[General 6 Stars]

So you want the or saying fig should be
AD@5 and can kill a plane with no bonus ?
Who determines the hit ? I maybe gettin this confused.
Yes I can make Stg bomber also have to wait after first round for DF @1. Makes sense.