The Flying Tigers but in India. Can US bombers stop Calcutta attack?

[KGrimB]

This plan that I am suggesting is an allied response to a J1 declaration of war with Japan pursuing an India capture around J4-J6.

An issue I’m having in my games recently is that India is captured by Japan before the US can get significantly involved. This makes operations around Australia and Hawaii precarious because one slip and the axis win in the Pacific. Bombers have the greatest range and if you build 3-4 on US turn 1 they can arrive in Queensland US2 and then proceed to India on US3.

The bombers can threaten Japanese transports around the DEI on US3 while still arriving in India before J4. They can strike factories built on the mainland too if the attack is delayed. 5 bombers can also reasonably strike smaller Japanese positions buying more time for China and India, both of which seem to struggle to find opportunities to counterattack. In the same way that a stack of US bombers can limit the effectiveness of Sea Lion, I would suggest that the same amount can do work in the Pacific.

The bombers can provide enough units that would hinder the Japanese assault, but ultimately you would want to prevent it entirely. This plan requires very little commitment from the US player because it is all from starting units and turn 1 purchases. Against SBR and convoy raids, UK Pacific is going to lose attrition battles because it can’t muster the piece count necessary to win against a massive assault. The US cannot feasibly transport land units into this area due to existing Japanese airpower, but what it can do is safely funnel in units that can take hits while being moderately useful before the assault. If you were to hypothetically continue to build bombers on turn 2 then you could have 11 US bombers in Calcutta on J5, potentially fighters at that point too.

If the axis are rushing towards victory with a very formulaic assault than getting more units to those crucial battles seems like a good plan.

What do you think? I don’t think there is a big cost to this maneuver for the US and its ability to get involved in other areas of the board. These bombers in India can even reach Moscow if you feel they are needed somewhere else. The other allies seem to fall too quickly to all in attacks from the axis. Maybe the US should go all in on getting any kind of support directly to those areas.

[simon33]

This is a pretty interesting idea. The bomber(s) could SBR FIC so Japan would need to station 2 fighters there.

It would work even better in Balanced Mod where the bombers would require the Japanese to stay together to prevent guerilla fighters being spawned all the time.

They could also bomb Stalingrad if that is in German hands.

I guess the main question is what do you do if it becomes clear Calcutta will fall regardless of the bombers?

[KGrimB]

@simon33:

This is a pretty interesting idea. The bomber(s) could SBR FIC so Japan would need to station 2 fighters there.

It would work even better in Balanced Mod where the bombers would require the Japanese to stay together to prevent guerilla fighters being spawned all the time.

They could also bomb Stalingrad if that is in German hands.

I guess the main question is what do you do if it becomes clear Calcutta will fall regardless of the bombers?

If Calcutta will still fall then you can fly to either Queensland or Moscow or Egypt. India is the center of the board so you can really go wherever you’re needed from there.

[Argothair]

I like this idea a lot and I think a US1 purchase of all bombers in San Grancisco is often a good idea. I’m much less convinced about a second turn of Pacific aircraft. If you buy more bombers, then you are getting a very low rate of return on your defensive punch in India – it sounds plausible to me that Japan could take India on J5 even if it does have an extra 11 us bombers sitting on it. If you don’t land the second wave of bombers in India, where do they land? Yunnan? Can they reach Madagascar? And what do they do next, kill the Baltic fleet on US6? I think at some point you are just not getting enough value for the opportunity cost of not having a us fleet that can put pressure on Japan or Italy in the early middlegame.

If you build fighters on us2, then the fighters can’t reach India before us5, so India definitely falls on j5.

I would almost prefer fighters on us1 and bombers on us1, so they both arrive in India us4. If Japan wants to take India on j3 they have to commit to that so hard that you’ll have ample compensation in China, anzac, and early us income.

[Caesar-Seriona]

How does this help stop the Japanese from taking Hawaii?

[simon33]

@Caesar:

How does this help stop the Japanese from taking Hawaii?

The Japanese can’t do that very easily if you don’t take the infantry which start on it off to somewhere else. Or at least it is likely to sacrifice other goals.

I agree with Argothair about more than 5 bombers being quite wasteful - even that number is probably excessive.

[aequitas-et-veritas]

Bmbrs for Allies are never a waste!
The more the better. You don’t have to kill each round something with them, but positioned right they project an immense threat.
Axis will have difficulties to grab MI’s, Blitz with CO’s or trying to block CM’s.
And if opportunity presents itself bmb the IPC’s out the IC’s.

Example: six Bmbrs on WUS threatening sz 106,91,92,16,32 and 54 at the same time.
If you bring 'em over to Cairo you do as well threaten both theatres at same time.
When you are able to shut down or restrict enemy movements gets you way far in a better position. That means your Opponent will likely loose momentum.
This is poison for the Axis.

MI=Money Islands, CO=Can Opener

[taamvan]

Sadly the only true fighting tiger piece can’t hang out in India.

One downside here is that the fighters in India are 1 move short of being able to make Moscow in 1 turn, during the culminating battles they are pretty vulnerable if they don’t land with that stack.    If the ANZAC fighters defend java or India, Sydney is left vulnerable–the fighters lose their ability to cross back once Japan is between the two Brit powers.

Bombers are always fun to play with and this is a creative idea.  It does rely on reacting to your opponent’s J1, which means that if he waits to attack and you are still going with this plan the bombers pile up until they are allowed to move, and you get fewer of them.

If they do J1, I still prefer 10 subs to 5 bombers to try and push them off SZ 6; let them take India while you cripple Japan.

I do see some merit to having two builds worth of bombers at the start of US 4 (5+6?) because that, combined with all the misc ships in the area, gives you the power to strike everywhere but SZ 36 (and you can even strike SZ 36 with just bombers, if they crash in a vulnerable area).  The effect of this may be that Japan sees how difficult it could be to take India (with the bombers) and that his fleet is vulnerable to destruction before or after he makes his invasion attempt;  this makes the stakes ultra high because Japan has to go to the odds–he may take India but lose his fleet (a win) or decline to press india in the face of the US follow through (a win win).  If all the bombers can make India, then his chance to take it may be lost, or seriously impeded.  And the point about BM–trading US bomber hits for Chinese partisans is a great idea too.

A certain bovine member of the forum mentioned using the same bomber stream to Moscow, just to create free casualties.  Both of these ideas have merit, but the 5 bombers without more can’t threaten the Japanese fleet when its all together, and using them as 5 meager casualties to defend Bombay isn’t inviting either.

[aequitas-et-veritas]

You can allways combine them with your 10 Subs you bought, Taamvan.  :wink:

[simon33]

The 10 subs (really 8 ) US1 are only possible if there’s a J1 DOW.

If you’re confident of a J3 DOW, you still can’t get subs from the Atlantic to Hawaii until US3 so some bombers are probably a better idea.

[aequitas-et-veritas]

The way I understood his post was on the long run disregarding wether a J1 DOW happend or not.
But you are absolutely correct simon33, eight subs will it be.
Bmbrs give you more flexibility.

[Ichabod]

You might be able to fly some US fighters to India via sub-Sahara Africa to India. If Japan cannot get India until J5, they may get there in time to save India.

Also, on turn 2 maybe the French fighter can start flying to Moscow from Scotland, than maybe get to India in time to help defend it. Or have it fly on turn 1 to sub-Sahara Africa route.

This is not a winning solution but it might buy some time.