War bonds: A better way for technology and turn order.

[DessertFox599]

Hey so after reading the War Room rule book, i came up with an idea to  add some elements to axis and allies: Bonds.

A nation collects bonds at the end of the round. You collect 1 bond for every 10 ipcs you collect. HOWEVER, you only count your basic income, without nationl objectives, leftover money, or money gain by capturing a capital. For example, lets say Germany is earning 40 dollars per turn. But this is turn two. They captured Paris last turn, so they actually have around 70-ish dollars. They still only get 4 bonds, because thats how much they earn per turn

You can use bonds in two ways, and the third way is going to need some testing.

1. Turn order
2. Technology
3.Recovery

1. Turn order.

Every player at the begining of the round writes down their bid. After everybody  writes their bond bids, they reveal them and pay for them. (Sounds Familar?)

2. Technology

You may invest in technology. During the technology  phase, you may spend as many bonds on technology  as you want. You pick a technology,  then invest in as many bonds you want. You may invest in mutiple technologies. If you want to change any previous, investments, you may pay 1 bond, then you may change whatever you want. Ottherwise, everything else is the same. Roll for what every bonds you have have in each investment, so on.

The tech War Bonds, is the same with a twist, now you will gain an additional bond every turn.

3. Recover

This is the one that could be op and needs testing. After you win a battle, you may spend bonds to recover casualties. You may recover up to 10 ipcs of one unit type. However, they are not cumilative.  For example, if i wanted to recover tanks, i can only recover 1 tank with 1 war bond. However i cant spend 2 war bonds and recover 3. I think it needs alot of work and should be tested throughly.

[General 6 Stars]

For me it seems to be going away from the KISS method.

I rather have where you pay for tech token and one of the techs is War Bonds = all pieces cost 1 less icp or roll 1 d6 and your roll of 1-2  ground only, 3-4 ships only  and 5-6 only planes cost 1 less icp or roll 1 d6 at end of turn and collect that die roll in icp’s.

[CWO Marc]

I guess the concern I have is over the “You collect 1 bond for every 10 ipcs you collect” part, which may be too powerful.

In the OOB rules, war bonds operate as follows: “5. War Bonds. During your Collect Income phase, roll a die and collect that many additional IPCs.”  There are three elements to this rule which limit its power.  First, there’s a randomness element, which correctly reflects the fact that, in real life, a nation can’t predict how many people will respond to a war bond appeal.  Second, there’s a strict limit to how much money can be pulled in: it can’t be higher than 6 IPCs.  Third, the money collected in this way depends on nothing other than the single die roll.

The “You collect 1 bond for every 10 ipcs you collect” method would go against all three of those elements.  Moreover, it would also add a self-reinforcing “nothing succeeds like success” element to the income of the game, similar to the concept of compound interest: a player with a high IPC income would get more out of war bonds than a player with a low IPC income, so the income disparity between the two sides could very quickly become overwhelming.

I’m also a bit perplexed about the “you may spend bonds to recover casualties” concept.  In terms of the real world, how does one “recover casualties”, and how does “spending bonds” allow one to do that?  Dead people can’t be brought back to life, and military equipment destroyed on the battlefield – even assuming that you’re still in control of the battlefield, rather than it having gone over to the enemy – can often be unrecoverable and unrepairable.  And sunken ships are usually lost forever, unless they sank in very shallow water and if on eif prepared to spend months or years refloating them.  My suggestion here would be to limit the “recover casualties” concept to something very narrow and specific, like a tech to develop a tank-recovery vehicle (such devices do exist; typically, they’re modified tank hulls).

[baron Münchhausen]

A simpler way to test all 3 points.
Very original idea, I like it DessertFox599. (Is it really Dessert not Desert?)

Each power get 1 dice to choose amongst 3 options.
Before each game Round (beginning on 2nd round), all Powers have to chose if they roll for Turn Order, or prefer either 2 or 3. They can decide on their turn between 2-Tech or 3-Recovery. On the first round, each Power can only select between Tech or Recovery.

1. Roll for turn order. If you’re alone in this, you still roll. If below your usual turn order, you play on that rank. If above, no change. If there is a draw between player’s roll, priority according to turn order sequence of play. If playing global, find a 10 or 12 sides dice.

2. Tech, as usual. It is a free roll, all others cost 5 IPCs.

Recovery : roll dice, if you get 3, one lost Inf is immediately mobilized. 4, you choose 1 MI, Art or Inf lost during previous round. 5, It includes AAA lost and anything below. 6, a Tank or 2 Infs or any 1 ground unit of your choice lost previously.
1 or 2, nothing happen.

I tend to see recovery as not all units are totally obliterated, you don’t start from scratch. You collect many remnants of lost units which were disorganized, unfeed, badly supported or repaired.

Thanks both SS and Marc for to the point comments.

[DessertFox599]

1. War bonds is a place holder name…… i couldnt come up with a better one. They have nothing to do with like actually  money. Maybe sr ( strategic resource)?

2. My name is DessertFox. ( its like a joke)

3. The recover casualties  thing is a bit questionable. The reason behind it is that they are not dead, but are hurt or wounded or damaged. Being able to repair them or fix them would be a neat concept. Also i think that having only two uses for war bonds is a little silly. Having more option is better.

4. Baron, i dont mean to be rude, but could you explain that in simpler terms? Im alittle confused.

[baron Münchhausen]

As a matter of proof of concept and before going deeper with Warbonds as you intented: 1 wbonds per 10 IPCs income.

Play warbonds as a single  bonus dice roll for either:
1-order of play,
2-Tech roll,
3-Recover lost unit(s)
Simply use 1 dice, D6 (for 1942 or AA50) D10 (for G40), to try the option about order of play.

Before a given round begin, all powers decide if they invest their single dice in either option 1, option 2 or option 3.

The only exception is the first round of play, because a lot of balance of game and opening strategies are based on turn order OOB sequence.

Suppose it is G40, you have three Allies who want to play before Germany and Italian too. All three allies and Italy rolls, and are put in order of sequence according to the roll.  If an Allies roll above its OOB order, nothing happen. If he rolls below, for instance rolling a “2” means playing before Russia. If Italy rolls a “2” or “1”, he would play before Russia.

2- As OOB D6 Tech roll, 1 to 5, nothing happen. “6” means a Tech has been developed.
Of course, you can roll more dice if you pay 5 IPCs each, as OOB rule.

3- Roll D6 for recovery: you can replace lost unit(s) according to the value on the dice.
A given unit have to be taken as casualty in the preceding game round.
   1 or 2, there is no unit at 1 or 2 IPCs, so no recovery.
   3: 1 Infantry
   4: 1 MI, 1 Art or 1 Infantry
   5: 1 AAA, 1 MI, 1 Art or 1 Infantry
   6: Tank, AAA, MI, Art or 2 Infantries
And any recovered unit can immediately be placed on board in IC during repair phase (if a given IC is too damaged, you can repaired it before placing this unit).

[Imperious Leader]

War Bonds are stupid. Scraps of paper that say the money you loaned the government will be repaid after the war is not TECHNOLOGY. Half the people who bought this nonsense will be on the losing side and get nothing!

[General 6 Stars]

No Common Sense Formulas and NO KISS Formulas ever again. Its a sad day. :-( :-( :-( :-(

[DessertFox599]

Ok, but why not play with the highest bidder goes first?

Also if you want this would be a house rule. You could have certain territories have bonds in them, say iraq starts with 1 bond in addition to its income. You can balence it.

Also, like i said earlier, these are not actually bonds from the government. Its a placeholder name. It was the best i could come up with. If you would like to create a better one, feel free. Im not attached  to the name.

And btw, i didnt know germany spent oil before marching their tanks into barbarosa to get the initiative on russia.

[DessertFox599]

I was also thinking for the allies, that sonce they get shafted in the NO department, then we could make NO that rewards them with bonds, or whatever you want to call them.

[baron Münchhausen]

@DessertFox599:

Ok, but why not play with the highest bidder goes first?

In my light version, there is no bid at all, simply using its only dice to get a better initiative.

No need for giving more warbonds according to income.

See it as a pre-test before going all-out as you suggested in your opening post.

[Young Grasshopper]

I love how WAR ROOM mechanics are already manifesting into A&A house rule ideas. Great job!