I don't get it… Can someone help me out here?

Subtract from that what the natives could have earned on their land had it not been taken.

Again, no doubt lots of room for improvement.  But if we want people to fend for themselves, we cannot allow them to be held hostage to tyrants that government policies have empowered.

Hey Garg, remember that genocide thingee that was mentioned?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ormOIlOi4Vc&feature=share

I had to google “International Common Law Court of Justice” to make sure it wasn’t some tambourine banging pot smoking fringe group of hippies.  Seems it carries a bit more weight then some hippies, not by much…we are talking about the UN…

Just had another update and link sent to me…

http://itccs.org/2013/02/25/guilty/

If it was their land they could go to a bank and get loans against it in order to develop it, but they cannot, so it is not really their land the same way the land is owned by non-nativeland holders.  My buddy cannot get a mortgage on his house on native land in order to expand his business as he really does not own the land, the band does.  There is no way for him to get a mortgage.

The money that is being paid goes to corrupt band leaders while kids live in third world conditions.  It is only the fault of non-natives in that we don’t have performance metrics published for all to see.  Its hard enough to reveal financial dealings of the band leaders personal finances and many and varied connections to band business.

Just saying if we expect natives on reserves to generate wealth, we ought to encourage changes in laws to give them the tools to do so whilst putting an end to the cronyism that occurs now.

give them the tools to do so whilst putting an end to the cronyism

No Casino’s without cronyism ….on Indian lands. We got a number of these “operations” and needless to say they are entirely run by the tribes down to the dishwasher.

Major banks don’t really do business on Indian reservations due to laws that do not apply that protect these institutions. Of course, the tribes could form their own bank or lending institution but it won’t make more money than those casinos…

banks are casinos

Hear, hear!

Thanks for being the voice of reason in my absence Malachi, some very good points brought up.

My two cents:

Never-mind,  the residential schools and avoid any debates about “cultural genocide” Garg.

Instead, do all of your calculations, then decide how much the government has paid on average every year. Then divide that number by the total Canadian population in that year (exclude Status Indians if you wish). By this you will obtain the imputed “rent” that immigrants pay to the original occupants of “Canada” each year.

Lets do 2011 just for fun (its the last year for which we have population statistics and the last fiscal year 2011/2012 to be officially “in the books”)

Budget for Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development Canada, 2011/2012: $7.4 Billion

Source: http://www.aadnc-aandc.gc.ca/eng/1315184396556/1315184508951#chp1

Canadian population, 2011: 34,484,000

Source: http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/demo02a-eng.htm

Divide $7.4 Billion by 34 484 000 = $214.59

Divide $214.59 by 12 = $17.88

Thus in 2011 you, me all of us descendant-of-immigrant" folks. Effectively paid $17.88 a month for the right to live, work, and own property anywhere in the second largest country in the world. This amount was then transferred to the indigenous people who originally inhabited this land and willingly surrendered its use and ownership to immigrants in exchange for, effectively, a rent of $17.88 a month each.

Doesn’t sound like such a bad deal to me.

Canuck12, it took less than two hours to get a down vote for your last post I see.  And with my vote it goes back to zero for the time being.

That is gross rent.  If you factor in the taxes that natives do end up paying the ‘rent’ becomes even less.

@MrMalachiCrunch:

That is gross rent.  If you factor in the taxes that natives do end up paying the ‘rent’ becomes even less.

I suppose, but that is difficult to calculate. Perhaps compensated for by the fact that I didn’t subtract all Status Indians from the gross Canadian population.

We paid compensation to the Japanese who were in internment camps during WW II.  That was racist, you had to be Japanese to get that money!  I protest!   :wink:

Democracy for ya.  I have to pay for welfare moms because they keep popping out bambinos.  That is so unfair because as a man I can never get in on the action……

We don’t always get to pick and choose where our tax dollars get spent.

Many Canadians don’t like that French is forced upon us.  Price we had to pay for not having a continuous war with the French, a compromise for confederation.  The BNA was also a compromise that we cannot completely do away with, so lets change what we can change and accept some imperfections.

Garg, just marry a native chick…

The treaties are legal documents of contract law between the Crown and the First Nations.

The first British settlers didn’t “buy” Canada from the First Nations, which is why the bill is never “paid.” They came to terms by-which new immigrants could use the land in exchange for sharing a very minuscule portion of the wealth they generated on that land in the form of housing, healthcare, education for them and their descendants. It has no more to do with race then the fact that you’re father inherited his father’s wealth when he died and you will inherit your father’s. It’s not because you’re white, but its because you’re father wrote in a legal document that he wished you to have it. Same goes for the treaties. (Not to mention the fact that there are over 100 000 Non-Status Indians who receive no more benefits from the government than you and I.) I have a friend who’s great great grandfather, whom she never met, had investments at his death worth over a billion. He wrote in his will, ie: legal contract, ie: treaty, that it was to be kept as an endowment and the wealth it generated would be paid to his descendants. This is no different. We got an entire country, they got free healthcare, housing and education for their descendants. Whooptee-fuckin-do.

It amounts to 58 cents a day. Can you really think of nothing else to be irate about?

@Gargantua:

• The treaties back east were with the British Crown, and when Canada became an autonomous nation (no longer a colony) those treaties are arguably annulled.

Who made that argument? All legal documentation, including  the Canadian Constitution states that the Treaties are “Recognised and Affirmed”

You may read those words in your country’s constitution here: http://www.solon.org/Constitutions/Canada/English/ca_1982.html along side your right to work and live anywhere in this country.

@Gargantua:

Nowhere else on earth, and nowhere else in history, do you see one group of people paying another group of people ‘rent’ for lands they conquered/colonized.

This is probably the root of your misunderstanding. No one was conquered. It was agreed by legal, international treaty that the lands inside Canada could be occupied and used by settlers in exchange for small concessions. If you spent a little time studying history you would know that. You might also know that the Spanish “Colonization of British Columbia” consisted of a single settlement and lasted only 6 years.

I encourage you to look into the legal history of indigenous relations with the Crown. It may help you understand these issues in a legal rather than racial lens. You may also sound more informed in your opinions. You can Start here: Read the 1969 Trudeau/Chretien “White Paper” which tired to abolish the Indian act, Indian status, and the treaties. Then read “The Red Paper” which was a response to the white-paper’s policies and the beginning of the road to having the Treaties Enshrined in the Constitution.

The White paper can be found here: http://epe.lac-bac.gc.ca/100/200/301/inac-ainc/indian_policy-e/cp1969_e.pdf

The red paper can be found here: http://ejournals.library.ualberta.ca/index.php/aps/article/view/11690/8926

Se also, The Unjust Society by Harold Cardinal Who was a Harvard lawyer who also had input into “The Red Paper”

Other articles of interest may be some of the work of Alan Cairns, who was a professor at UBC and worked at length to try and reconcile indigenous rights with a liberal capitalist society.

Happy reading!

I think it’s lucky white’s weren’t asked to drive the natives around in rickshaws….I would pay to see a photoshop’d pic of Garg operating a rickshaw with Tecumseh in full garb!

If it wasn’t for the Natives most of Canada would belong to the natives Americans as the war of 1812 was won primarily with the help of native allies.  Their reward was to be screwed over by the British.  60 cents a day is a bargain for that classic betrayal.