Yes
@Final:
Are you allowed to move land units from Scotland to Ireland without transports?
Part of Northern Ireland is contained in the “Scotland” space, and there is a visible land border between Scotland and Eire, so yes. You can walk in.
On page 24 of the Europe rules, in the bottom right the photo caption says 'On Italy’s turn, the UK sub in sea zone 97 can cost Italy up to 2 IPCs.
Shouldn’t this read 6 IPC’s since UK would roll 2 dice for their sub and if they rolled two 3’s that would be 6 damage to Italy, and they have a total of 8 IPC value adjacent to this sea zone so they could absorb all of it.
Yes, good catch Ike, that error has been noted by the rulebook writers and has been listed in the official errata
You might want to find a copy of the official FAQ/errata - try Harris’ website, or some helpful player may provide it to you here
@IKE:
On page 24 of the Europe rules, in the bottom right the photo caption says 'On Italy’s turn, the UK sub in sea zone 97 can cost Italy up to 2 IPCs.
Shouldn’t this read 6 IPC’s since UK would roll 2 dice for their sub and if they rolled two 3’s that would be 6 damage to Italy, and they have a total of 8 IPC value adjacent to this sea zone so they could absorb all of it.
Looks like an error to me, Italy has a possible 8IPCs in value from 3 different territories adjacent to the eligible convoy zone. The UK sub can convoy a total of 6IPCs from Itay in that sea zone.
Yes, good catch Ike, that error has been noted by the rulebook writers and has been listed the official errata
You might want to find a copy of the official FAQ/errata - try Harris’ website, or some helpful player may provide it to you here
Cheers
Yes, good catch Ike, that error has been noted by the rulebook writers and has been listed the official errata
You might want to find a copy of the official FAQ/errata - try Harris’ website, or some helpful player may provide it to you here
Here it is:
http://www.wizards.com/AvalonHill/rules/AAEurope1940_2ndEdition_FAQ.pdf
and
http://www.wizards.com/AvalonHill/rules/AAPacific1940_2nd Edition_FAQ.pdf
:-)
UK wants to amphibious assault a German coastal territory, Germany has a sub in the seazone that the UK plans to send the transports to. Since the transports are not escorted, the amph assault cannot occur. The UK needs to escort the transports and then he can ignore the sub during combat. All the UK has to escort are carriers(no attack value) and fighters(cant hit subs unless he has a destroyer present). He decides to send the carriers and fighters to the seazone to ‘escort’ the transports. Does the UK fleet:
1. Ignore the Sub anyway and conduct the amphibious assault like normal?
2. Fight in a naval battle with the sub (sub defends at one, so the attacker will have to retreat)?
3. Do nothing because the move is unable to occur?
4. None of the above?
If 1, and Germany has an operable airbase in a territory bordering the same seazone with planes ready, can the sub participate in the battle if Germany decides to scramble?
#1 Ignore the sub. The carrier counts as an escorting warship
If Germany scrambles to the zone, then the sub can defend the seazone and will not be ignored, so in this case yes, the carrier cannot possibly win and will need to retreat (or it may not actually be allowed to attack at all - Krieghund has said you must have a unit with attack power, to attack. I guess if you have aircraft, then it is allowed, but the amphibious assault will be impossible because the sub cannot lose)
Without a scramble, the sub can be ignored. Just need an escorting warship
or it may not actually be allowed to attack at all - Krieghund has said you must have a unit with attack power, to attack.
UK could bring the transport(s) in with just a carrier as an escort, since its plan is to ignore the sub rather than attack. However, as you pointed out, it would be pointless in this situation as Germany could simply scramble and thwart the assault with no risk to its units.
Okay, I am a little confused. I understand the concept of having a warship escort your transports for amphibious assaults if there is an enemy sub present. However, I understood that it could NOT be an aircraft carrier because they do not have an attack value. Escorting warships HAD to have an attack value.
It’s like with convoy raiding. An aircraft carrier by itself can not conduct convoy damage.
Yeah, you were thinking wrong. There is no attack value requirement when you read the rule about escorting transports looking to amphibiously assault over a submarine infested sea zone
Has nothing to do with convoy raiding
There IS an attack value requirement for entering into combat (you can’t attack with transports and carriers alone, looking to hit and run), but again, not related to the submarine rule
At the beginning of my turn, there are my fleets together with enemy’s sub in the same SZ. Is it legal to move my fleets out of this SZ in the combat move phase without taking part in any other battle?
Anyone can help?
At the beginning of my turn, there are my fleets together with enemy’s sub in the same SZ. Is it legal to move my fleets out of this SZ in the combat move phase without taking part in any other battle?
Anyone can help?
There will be a battle in this sz this turn btw. ( trying to kill this sub.)
Page 12-13 of the Europe rule book
The general rule is that you can’t move units in the combat movement phase if it doesn’t result in combat.
“During the combat move phase, all movement must end in a hostile space, with a few exceptions (see below)”
The closest exception is regarding hostile sea zones, but a sea zone with only subs/transports is not hostile.
Exception #2, bullet point on page 13
“Units moving from a hostile sea zone to escape combat as their combat move. A sea zone into which defending air units may be scrambled in reaction to an amphibious assault may be treated in the same was as a hostile sea zone for this purpose.”
Exception #3
“Sea units that will be participating in an amphibious assault from a friendly sea zone, as well as sea and/or air units that may be needed to support it in the case that defending air units are scrambled”
So it is only legal to move ships away from a zone with a sub in it, during the Combat Move phase, if those ships will be possibly participating in combat. If you can’t move them away during the combat movement phase and you are going to engage the sub, then those ships will necessarily be involved in the sub battle, so cannot move in the noncombat movement phase.
Attack the sub or move the ships, you can’t do both because it is not legal to move ships away from a non-hostile zone in the combat movement phase if those ships are not making a combat move (going to attack or support an amphibious assault).
Page 12-13 of the Europe rule book
The general rule is that you can’t move units in the combat movement phase if it doesn’t result in combat.
“During the combat move phase, all movement must end in a hostile space, with a few exceptions (see below)”
The closest exception is regarding hostile sea zones, but a sea zone with only subs/transports is not hostile.
Exception #2, bullet point on page 13
“Units moving from a hostile sea zone to escape combat as their combat move. A sea zone into which defending air units may be scrambled in reaction to an amphibious assault may be treated in the same was as a hostile sea zone for this purpose.”
Exception #3
“Sea units that will be participating in an amphibious assault from a friendly sea zone, as well as sea and/or air units that may be needed to support it in the case that defending air units are scrambled”So it is only legal to move ships away from a zone with a sub in it, during the Combat Move phase, if those ships will be possibly participating in combat. If you can’t move them away during the combat movement phase and you are going to engage the sub, then those ships will necessarily be involved in the sub battle, so cannot move in the noncombat movement phase.
Attack the sub or move the ships, you can’t do both because it is not legal to move ships away from a non-hostile zone in the combat movement phase if those ships are not making a combat move (going to attack or support an amphibious assault).
HI Gamerman01
Thank you for the quick response. But it’s still ambiguous here. In this case, Exception #2 should apply “Units moving from a hostile sea zone to escape combat as their combat move.” . When the attacker attacks this SZ with destroyer and the defender sub can’t submerge, then this SZ is bound to be hostile and conduct combat. Any seazone that conducts inevitable combat should be considered as a hostile SZ in my opinion.
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10 mins later
Ignore all these pls. Find Krieghund’s words somewhere “Attacking a sub (or transport) in a sea zone doesn’t make it hostile. Hostile sea zones are defined by the presence of enemy surface warships, not by combat.”
Right. The definition of hostile sea zone is simply -
Enemy surface warship present
Page 8, under “sea zones”
And quick?? No, that was slow - it was over 3 hours! :-o
Has n’t anybody in this forum questioned about this rule in this situation? It is so bizarre and can be abused. 1 lone sub can detain whole bunch of fleets or get free convoy? I don’t think so. The proper rule should be “Units moving from a sea zone (regardless it’s hostile or not) to escape combat as their combat move.” I want to hear what official ruler have to say about this.
I think you will quickly realize how ridiculous that is. Let’s imagine 1 enemy destroyer or 1 sub or 1 transport is there.
when facing 1 enemy destroyer, commander says " soldiers, lets kill it and move on." Great, isn’t it?
When seeing 1 enemy sub or 1 transport, commander says " soldiers, we can do nothing about it, we have to move on." WTF. I say send him to military court and accuse him of aiding the enemy.
There are many rules in A&A that don’t exactly make sense. Starting with, whole countries taking turns. Allies that can’t attack together. It goes on and on.
I hear the sub did maximum convoy damage against you :lol:
