German buys turn one

[jsp4563]

Assuming the best for germany (no fighter sub losses)…6fgt, 1bmb Western. 1CV, 1DD, 3 subs, 3tp sz5. 1BB, 1SS, 1tp sz13.

UK:
1BB, 2tp>sz7 (1tnk to UK from Canada)
Build 1DD sz6
Build 1CV sz7 (plus 2fgt from UK)

US:
1DD, 2tp sz10>sz12 Algerian Landing
1fgt, 1bmb US>UK
1DD sz20>sz18
1BB, 1TP sz55>sz20
1fgt Hawaii>E. Canada
1fgt W. US>sz10
Build 1CV, 1fgt, 1tp sz10

Russia:
1SS sz2>sz7

[jsp4563]

@CrazyStraw:

@jsp4563:

Channel Dash-Waste of a fleet, the UK & US airforces will make mince meat out of it before you can get to the med.

JSP, I’m surprised you would bring this up again when you were so thoroughly discredited before.  It’s kind of silly for you to keep making this claim when you have already demonstrated that you can’t back it up.

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=8335.0

G2 fleet unification in SZ7-I have yet to have an opponent pull this off.  As the allied player I can see it coming and no allied player worth his salt would allow it (IMHO) and it is easily countered.

Ok, find better players then.  It was shown in that thread that the counters aren’t easy and that a good player can profitably unite the fleets.

Don’t talk the junk when you don’t have the skills.

Thanks

Care to put your money where your mouth is, or are you all talk and no walk.

[squirecam]

@jsp4563:

Assuming the best for germany (no fighter sub losses)…6fgt, 1bmb Western. 1CV, 1DD, 3 subs, 3tp sz5. 1BB, 1SS, 1tp sz13.

UK:
1BB, 2tp>sz7 (1tnk to UK from Canada)
Build 1DD sz6
Build 1CV sz7 (plus 2fgt from UK)

US:
1DD, 2tp sz10>sz12 Algerian Landing
1fgt, 1bmb US>UK
1DD sz20>sz18
1BB, 1TP sz55>sz20
1fgt Hawaii>E. Canada
1fgt W. US>sz10
Build 1CV, 1fgt, 1tp sz10

Russia:
1SS sz2>sz7

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge. You’ve also just lost London.

[Guest]

Care to put your money where your mouth is, or are you all talk and no walk.

I talk a lot, but I’m better with the walk.

In your case, however, you can’t talk, so I know you can’t walk.

You had a chance in the other thread to demonstrate your knowledge; I’m still waiting for that to happen.

---

Man, we need some sound effects in here, old-west-saloon style.  Maybe tumbleweeds, player piano…

Emoticons like :mrgreen: just don’t give trash-talk the right feel for this kind of thing.

[Guest]

@squirecam:

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge.

Squire, that’s not fair!  You didn’t say he had to keep his capital.  That wasn’t part of the debate.

He was showing that he could stop the MERGE.  Who needs London if you have stopped the merge?

[cyan]

@CrazyStraw:

@squirecam:

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge.

Squire, that’s not fair!  You didn’t say he had to keep his capital.  That wasn’t part of the debate.

He was showing that he could stop the MERGE.  Who needs London if you have stopped the merge?

sacrasim i hope. …… right? stopping the merge is suppose to stop the germans fprm getting london.

[squirecam]

@cyan:

@CrazyStraw:

@squirecam:

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge.

Squire, that’s not fair!  You didn’t say he had to keep his capital.  That wasn’t part of the debate.

He was showing that he could stop the MERGE.  Who needs London if you have stopped the merge?

sacrasim i hope. …… right? stopping the merge is suppose to stop the germans fprm getting london.

Dont worry, I’m pretty sure it was sarcasm.

I should know this, being a sarcastic a-hole myself. :)

Squirecam

[cyan]

@squirecam:

Dont worry, I’m pretty sure it was sarcasm.

I should know this, being a sarcastic a-hole myself. :)

Squirecam

HOw do i know your not being sarcasstic now.  :wink:  :lol:

[jsp4563]

@squirecam:

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge. You’ve also just lost London.

Haaaa……reminds me of the “Kobiyashi Maru” test where Kirk changes the parameters of the test in order to win.  :-D

In any case, your new paradigm is easily fixed with a diversion of 1tp with 1tnk, 1inf from US>UK in sz8, Russian sub to sz12.  But your buy of all Navy for the Baltic would have left you in a very percarious situation on the Eastern front and to get all those air forces in Western would have meant forgoing an attack on Egypt and the UK med destroyer.

Let’s put it to the test. Up for a game?

[squirecam]

@jsp4563:

@squirecam:

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge. You’ve also just lost London.

Haaaa……reminds me of the “Kobiyashi Maru” test where Kirk changes the parameters of the test in order to win.  :-D

In any case, your new paradigm is easily fixed with a diversion of 1tp with 1tnk, 1inf from US>UK in sz8, Russian sub to sz12.  But your buy of all Navy for the Baltic would have left you in a very percarious situation on the Eastern front and to get all those air forces in Western would have meant forgoing an attack on Egypt and the UK med destroyer.

Let’s put it to the test. Up for a game?

First, if you lose your capital, I’d say yes it was a failure. Not changing the test parameters at all. You cannot honestly believe a “block” that costs you a game is viable??

Second, you now have 3 Inf 3 Arm Art, 2 bombers and a fighter. Thats a defense of 23 + aa
Germany has 3 Inf + 3arm + air(1 shot down by aa). That’s 3+9+22 = 31.

London is still lost.

Of course, since you changed your moves, I could do the same. I simply build AC+3 transports and have 4 Inf + 4 armor. Now its 35 vs 23. Even better odds.

Third, I (never included, just for this purpose) my bid units, so that can take care of Egypt. Which is why I mentioned the Bomber in Lybia, which can attack London and still land.

But let me end this now. You will say that instead, you bring 2 transports to London. Fine, Now you cannot block me, and I therefore attack your fleet and then merge.

Fourth, USSR wont trouble me as I have UK’s $30 to spend. Added with the 40-50 IPC I have, and now I’m looking at 15 tanks or so…

Fifth, I will be at Greg’s Spring Gathering. I plan on being there all day and  playing A&A so feel free to ask me then.

[squirecam]

@cyan:

@squirecam:

Dont worry, I’m pretty sure it was sarcasm.

I should know this, being a sarcastic a-hole myself. :)

Squirecam

HOw do i know your not being sarcasstic now.  :wink:  :lol:

touche

[jsp4563]

@squirecam:

@jsp4563:

@squirecam:

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge. You’ve also just lost London.

Haaaa……reminds me of the “Kobiyashi Maru” test where Kirk changes the parameters of the test in order to win.  :-D

In any case, your new paradigm is easily fixed with a diversion of 1tp with 1tnk, 1inf from US>UK in sz8, Russian sub to sz12.  But your buy of all Navy for the Baltic would have left you in a very percarious situation on the Eastern front and to get all those air forces in Western would have meant forgoing an attack on Egypt and the UK med destroyer.

Let’s put it to the test. Up for a game?

First, if you lose your capital, I’d say yes it was a failure. Not changing the test parameters at all. You cannot honestly believe a “block” that costs you a game is viable??

Second, you now have 3 Inf 3 Arm Art, 2 bombers and a fighter. Thats a defense of 23 + aa
Germany has 3 Inf + 3arm + air(1 shot down by aa). That’s 3+9+22 = 31.

London is still lost.

Of course, since you changed your moves, I could do the same. I simply build AC+3 transports and have 4 Inf + 4 armor. Now its 35 vs 23. Even better odds.

Third, I (never included, just for this purpose) my bid units, so that can take care of Egypt. Which is why I mentioned the Bomber in Lybia, which can attack London and still land.

But let me end this now. You will say that instead, you bring 2 transports to London. Fine, Now you cannot block me, and I therefore attack your fleet and then merge.

Fourth, USSR wont trouble me as I have UK’s $30 to spend. Added with the 40-50 IPC I have, and now I’m looking at 15 tanks or so…

Fifth, I will be at Greg’s Spring Gathering. I plan on being there all day and  playing A&A so feel free to ask me then.

Let’s play a game and see if you can pull it off.

[cyan]

@jsp4563:

@squirecam:

@jsp4563:

@squirecam:

Congrats, you’ve stopped a merge. You’ve also just lost London.

Haaaa……reminds me of the “Kobiyashi Maru” test where Kirk changes the parameters of the test in order to win.  :-D

In any case, your new paradigm is easily fixed with a diversion of 1tp with 1tnk, 1inf from US>UK in sz8, Russian sub to sz12.  But your buy of all Navy for the Baltic would have left you in a very percarious situation on the Eastern front and to get all those air forces in Western would have meant forgoing an attack on Egypt and the UK med destroyer.

Let’s put it to the test. Up for a game?

First, if you lose your capital, I’d say yes it was a failure. Not changing the test parameters at all. You cannot honestly believe a “block” that costs you a game is viable??

Second, you now have 3 Inf 3 Arm Art, 2 bombers and a fighter. Thats a defense of 23 + aa
Germany has 3 Inf + 3arm + air(1 shot down by aa). That’s 3+9+22 = 31.

London is still lost.

Of course, since you changed your moves, I could do the same. I simply build AC+3 transports and have 4 Inf + 4 armor. Now its 35 vs 23. Even better odds.

Third, I (never included, just for this purpose) my bid units, so that can take care of Egypt. Which is why I mentioned the Bomber in Lybia, which can attack London and still land.

But let me end this now. You will say that instead, you bring 2 transports to London. Fine, Now you cannot block me, and I therefore attack your fleet and then merge.

Fourth, USSR wont trouble me as I have UK’s $30 to spend. Added with the 40-50 IPC I have, and now I’m looking at 15 tanks or so…

Fifth, I will be at Greg’s Spring Gathering. I plan on being there all day and  playing A&A so feel free to ask me then.

Let’s play a game and see if you can pull it off.

then stop b****hing about it  and play.  :-P

[squirecam]

If I’m not otherwise committed, Im more than happy to play you there. {Crazystraw, Yoper, V-Disc, and several others are on my list.}

But I’m more concerned about settling this debate now. You stated that it was easy to block. Did you have any other potential blocking moves??

If you conceed the point on London vs the fleet, then thats fine too.

[jsp4563]

@squirecam:

If I’m not otherwise committed, Im more than happy to play you there. {Crazystraw, Yoper, V-Disc, and several others are on my list.}

But I’m more concerned about settling this debate now. You stated that it was easy to block. Did you have any other potential blocking moves??

If you conceed the point on London vs the fleet, then thats fine too.

Not sure what the “greg’s spring gathering” is, If it’s a FTF then it’s not likely I can be there.  If you want to play online…then this is the place.  If you think your strategy is a winning one then step up.  I guarantee you won’t get london or merge your fleet on G2.  :-D

[squirecam]

@jsp4563:

@squirecam:

If I’m not otherwise committed, Im more than happy to play you there. {Crazystraw, Yoper, V-Disc, and several others are on my list.}

But I’m more concerned about settling this debate now. You stated that it was easy to block. Did you have any other potential blocking moves??

If you conceed the point on London vs the fleet, then thats fine too.

Not sure what the “greg’s spring gathering” is, If it’s a FTF then it’s not likely I can be there.  If you want to play online…then this is the place.  If you think your strategy is a winning one then step up.  I guarantee you won’t get london or merge your fleet on G2.  :-D

1 - Yes, its FTF

2 - You’ve already “guaranteed” that.

3 - You asked me for my moves.

4 - I gave them, asked for your block

5 - The block that you gave cost you London.

6 - Since you have now publically boasted twice, I want to see it. Tell it to me, right now. Dont just say its unlikely that you cant meet FTF. You said it was SIMPLE and you’d tell me about it. So please put it here in black and white.

{FWIW, I said “usually” because there is one block that can be done, but which requires forsight and the absolute knowledge of the future.}

[Imperious Leader]

Ok first of all we are assuming the Soviets do this:

Soviets attack and take Belo and West Russia. Belo is attacked with 2 fighters and 3 men and west russia is attacked with most of the rest. Russia has protected caucasus. They bought mostly infantry but certainly didnt go heavy on tanks. For example we assume either 1) 8 infantry, 2) 3 tanks and 3 infantry, 3) 4 infantry and 3 artillery

Further we assume Soviets lost 1-2 Inf taking belo and 2-4 infantry taking west russia.

also the Soviet sub is in blocking mode against german fleet

The bid is 3-6 and no NA’s are being used.

NOW we can sort out the opening in the following terms:

Book opening= predictable and safe opening system with a clear mandate of what we are trying to accomplish while making a predictable line of play.

Gambit= you are deliberatly making a calculated risk assesment and leaving a ‘hole’ in your position in order to gain some advantage in another area. Thus you give up in one area of your opening so gain an advantage in another.

Cheapo= this is when you open a line of play that relies on luck elements to pull off an acute advantage ( e.g  many attacks at long odds but with a big pay off, or channel dash option, or sealion)

Desperado= The ultimate risk taker. Something that if you fail will quickly lead to your downfall ( e.g. going for rockets)

Ill try to come up with a 5th option closer to safe play option but i dont have a name for it.

Eventually Illcolor coordinate these into types of openings into colors Green, Yellow, orange, red

Now we have not gotten into the german attacks but depending on the style of opening will dictate in some cases what is attacked.

But i have looked at the odds and come up with these attacks for Germany:

1. Gibrater UK BB is attacked with: 1 sub, 1 bomber, 3 fighters Reasoning: we want not to lose a plane and need 2 hits in first round.

2. Uk Destroyer off egypt attacked with: 1 BB, 1 transport, 1 fighter Reasoning: you will get one hit and BB will take a hit ( not losing anything)

3. Attack egypt with tank and inf from lybia and land 2 infantry from transport, plus bring in 2 fighters. You can also pick up one tank and one infantry instead of 2 infantry, but you may run into losing 3 units which will dig into the tanks which many have been lost courtesy of the Soviets on R1.

4. In Russia the attacks will be done w/o plane support and are largely dependant on what the Russian player has lost, generally youll take back Belo, and also kar… trying to hold Ukr.

Now how exactly does this channel dash thing work? How is it a viable option on G1 or G2?

Sealion is not possible with a bid of zero or 3. I have only seen it work with a bid of 8. If UK buys a fleet how then can G2 be a decent plan for channel dash?

I do see the merits of such a plan but i dont see how they get away with it against a decent Uk player. its certainly not w/o major risks of failure.

[squirecam]

@Imperious:

Ok first of all we are assuming the Soviets do this:

.

I havent always agreed with Crazystraw. Over time, I’ve come to respect him. But just like I’ve said to you, (and him) writing a “paper” on this stuff will only bring problems. You will be misleading people, as your assumptions about the best/risky moves would be flawed. The moves listed will contain many assumptions, many of which could be wrong and countered.

By your own admission, you dont understand Crazy’s “channel” moves. It seems to me you should read those papers. But even then, you are going to be hard pressed to come up with a comprehensive paper of any sort which will definitavely answer what is best. Because what is best varies based upon those too many factors I’ve said before.

I dont want to see you fruitlessly waste your time. Which is what this project will ultimately be.

[jsp4563]

@squirecam:

@jsp4563:

@squirecam:

If I’m not otherwise committed, Im more than happy to play you there. {Crazystraw, Yoper, V-Disc, and several others are on my list.}

But I’m more concerned about settling this debate now. You stated that it was easy to block. Did you have any other potential blocking moves??

If you conceed the point on London vs the fleet, then thats fine too.

Not sure what the “greg’s spring gathering” is, If it’s a FTF then it’s not likely I can be there.  If you want to play online…then this is the place.  If you think your strategy is a winning one then step up.  I guarantee you won’t get london or merge your fleet on G2.  :-D

1 - Yes, its FTF

2 - You’ve already “guaranteed” that.

3 - You asked me for my moves.

4 - I gave them, asked for your block

5 - The block that you gave cost you London.

6 - Since you have now publically boasted twice, I want to see it. Tell it to me, right now. Dont just say its unlikely that you cant meet FTF. You said it was SIMPLE and you’d tell me about it. So please put it here in black and white.

{FWIW, I said “usually” because there is one block that can be done, but which requires forsight and the absolute knowledge of the future.}

Then let’s settle it here and now, online. I’ll set up the thread. LHTR, No Tech, No NA’s.

[squirecam]

@jsp4563:

Then let’s settle it here and now, online. I’ll set up the thread. LHTR, No Tech, No NA’s.

No dude. I gave you the moves. You said you had a simple counter. Post the counter, like you said you could.

If its so simple, what’s stopping you???