Larry Harris 1914 Tournament Rules ( "potential rules" using his language)

[Krieghund]

@Flashman:

So just to be crystal:

On G1 the German fighter in Berlin can join infantry from Prussia & Silesia in an attack on (hostile) Poland, but infantry from Berlin cannot take part in this invasion.

However, if there was a single Austrian infantry contesting Poland with Russia, all the units in Berlin could move into Poland.

Correct.

[Flashman]

@Chacmool:

@Flashman:

we realised we’d been moving some units 2 spaces into hostile tt.

Italy was in economic collapse before it had a turn!

:lol:Â

let me guess how that happened: did you took Switzerland with units from Tyrol, attacked Venice from Triest and Tyrol, landed some troops from Triest in Toscany and attacked Piedmont later with Germany from Alsace/Munich via Switzerland ?Â

Exactly so. At this point we realised something was wrong…

I still think Tuscany needs more units, though. And Switzerland at 1 is so wrong.

[WILD BILL]

@Krieghund:

@Flashman:

So just to be crystal:

On G1 the German fighter in Berlin can join infantry from Prussia & Silesia in an attack on (hostile) Poland, but infantry from Berlin cannot take part in this invasion.

However, if there was a single Austrian infantry contesting Poland with Russia, all the units in Berlin could move into Poland.

Correct.

So in the above scenario you can move ground units two spaces (through a friendly territory) to attack or reinforce a contested territory even if you had no units there to begin with (you weren’t the power contesting it when your turn started, your ally was).

[Flashman]

I’m assuming the Berlin units can attack or reinforce.

[Krieghund]

Yes.

[Chacmool]

Exactly so. At this point we realised something was wrong…

I still think Tuscany needs more units, though. And Switzerland at 1 is so wrong.

Giving the one Artillery in Libya to Toscany would be enough. Pre-emptive strike + 2 dices on 3 against max 2 units and Offshore Bombardement. Still possible for AH but more 50-50 chances for both.

[questioneer]

As the co-champion in the Origins 1914 tournament I might have a little insight here maybe…
My partner at the time also won the GenCon 1914 tourney as well…so I know how he plays.
By now he has probably over 30 games of experience…6 games in tourney format.
I myself have played the game 10-12 times- 3 in the tourney format.

The tourney format at GenCon and Origins were slightly different than Larry tourney rules (here -->

(http://www.harrisgamedesign.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=18335)

…GenCon/Origins adopted them but changed 2 things:

1. They didn’t use the new setup

2. They allowed US to enter at turn 3 instead of 4.

This yielded in an average 18-20 IPCs given to the Allies in order for the other side to take the Axis.  However, personally I like the tournament rules AS written by Larry WITH the setup changes and the US still entering on round 4.  This makes the bid much lower too- balancing the game better IMHO.

[Flashman]

First game under PTR; ended on the third Russian turn with a crushing Allied victory.  I’d really like to know these CP winning strategies, as I still can’t see them having much of a chance.

The extra Russian infantry in the new setup make a big difference; they can take Mesopotamia R1 which is a hammer blow to the Turks. Holding the line Livonia-Belarus-Ukraine with big armies and artillery concentrated in the centre was too much for the CPs to break down.

Germany needs to buy 3 fighters round one or face air supremacy against them in every big battle.

I very much believe naval combat should be one round only, and/or that the attacker should have the option to retreat even after wiping out the defender; Germany destroyed the British fleet but was left with a single crippled battleship in British waters which then fell to a French cruiser, leaving the German coast vulnerable to Russian invasion.

I’d also suggest moving Turkey up the turn order between France and Britain. This at least gives it the chance to deal with a R1 Russian invasion before the Brits attack. Or bring Turkey into the war only at the start of its own first turn, with R & B forbidden to attack it.

Berlin is still too far from the western front even with 2 space movement - make Munich a PC.

Also a bit pissed off about a single infantry being able to hold up a 30 unit stack. Needs something like an overflow rule whereby a small force contesting a tt can only pin down 4 times its own numbers - the remainder being free to move out and attack hostile tt.

[Witt]

A lot of board games I have played had an 8_1 advantage was an automatic  (steamroller)  victory. Maybe something like that might be what you want Flashman.
my friend and I will start a Tournament rules game soon. Am looking forward to it. I will go all out France or all out Russia for once.

[Flashman]

I would suggest taking Switzerland with Austria to give you a double turn on the western front.

Make sure Germany has two fighters on each front.

Beware of leaving Russia to build an artillery/fighter stack.

[Hitlers Left Hand Pinky]

If France activates Albania on F1 can Italy use the Albanian troops to attack Trieste or Serbia on I1?

[Flashman]

Yes; Austria leaving Trieste undefended is a common mistake. Usually its the UK who activates Albania with an infantry from Egypt.

Shouldn’t be allowed.

[Chacmool]

I think with tt-rules, Russia should go earlier into economical/political collapse maybe with 10/12.

Otherwise its too hard for the CPS to get anything to the west when US-troops arrive in Marseille/Picardie Round 4!!

[Flashman]

Or, as I’ve suggested under political rules, link US entry to Russian collapse - Wilson did not want to support one autocratic imperial system against another.

[Chacmool]

@Flashman:

Or, as I’ve suggested under political rules, link US entry to Russian collapse - Wilson did not want to support one autocratic imperial system against another.

Yes thats even better.

But wouldn´t the Allied player always retreat his whole Russian army to  activate US?

[Flashman]

More of a suggestion than a question, but should the USA really be able to use the port in Wales to offload units from America directly into Picardy?

It seems to me that if using the port-to-port 3 space naval movement, then the transport should be considered to have ended its movement off Wales and should be allowed to offload units only into that land tt.

[Krieghund]

@Flashman:

More of a suggestion than a question, but should the USA really be able to use the port in Wales to offload units from America directly into Picardy?

It seems to me that if using the port-to-port 3 space naval movement, then the transport should be considered to have ended its movement off Wales and should be allowed to offload units only into that land tt.

It is not necessary to end a move at a naval base to move three spaces.  You only have to start at one.

[Flashman]

Oops, missed that. Think it should be port-to-port, though.

Anyway, my map suggestion (qv) moves the border of SZ 8/9 to make the USA - Picardy move impossible.

[Chacmool]

The PTR-movement Rules bring US-troops much faster to the western front. In fact there were 8 American Infantry units in Picardie in Round 4. And to balance this the Russians were given 6 additional Infantries from the start? PTR should help the screwed CPS more in my opinion. Russia should collapse economically on 9 and politically on 11 I have never seen them fall before Round 5. Or otherwise USA should enter on Turn 6, but thats a no go if you have only some 4 hours for playing this great game.

Other wishes for the PTR:
Subs were still too weak. I´m missing a German Cruiser near East Africa. ((Switzerland impassable/worth 4IPCs because its impossible to stack more than 4 units with chips in this small space)) Maybe the violation of any neutral brings US one turn earlier (CPs inavde) or one turn later (Entente invades) into war against the CPs.

[ossel]

@Chacmool:

Maybe the violation of any neutral brings US on turn earlier (CPs inavde) or one turn later (Entente invades) into war against the CPs.

I don’t really know why this game departed from the method used in G40, that if a strict neutral was attacked, ALL strict neutrals would then become pro-whoever-didn’t-attack-them. This was a great deterrent to invading strict neutrals like Switzerland, and it makes real-world sense as well.

I would suggest that this simple change be made to the PTR. Imagine if Switzerland was invaded by Germany to widen the front, France could just pop down into Spain and pick up some free units/IPC’s. If France invaded Switzerland, Germany could roll through Holland and pick up some units along the way. Definitely a deterrent.