Re: Field Marshal Games Pieces Project Discussion thread

[d142]

are there plan’s for france and poland forces,
i think that a set of sculpts of 1 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 armor, 1 fighter, 1 aircraft carrier, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 1 transport for france, and 1 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 armor, 1 fighter, 1 destroyer, 1 transport for poland,
for later turns if france and poland are in play, the sculpts other national sculpts could be used for the larger ships and submarines,

france

15 infantry
7 artillery
7 armor
5 fighter
3 aircraft carrier
3 cruiser
5 destroyer
5 transport

poland

15 infantry
7 artillery
7 armor
5 fighter
5 destroyer
5 transport

[crsluggo]

@Imperious:

Also, I have a new idea:

I want all these new pieces to be totally different pieces from AA. Twofold.

First: Avalon Hill already made the stuka and Me-109, but the stuka looks horrible

so if you have the German plane as the JU-87 Stuka or Fw-190 you create a new piece and also create the utility of having a new plane that people can use  rather than have yet another Me-109… By having a new unit to make these pieces really viable for all sorts of ideas.

The German Battleship should be the Graf Spee or Scharnhorst because we already got the Bismarck

The Japanese BB should be Kongo Class, so people can make the Yamato into a 5-5 battleship

The American BB should be the Lexington

The American fighter should be the MUstang

The German Artillery should be a PAK

The German tank should be Panzer IV or Tiger 2 or King tiger

etc… no sculpt should be an AH sculpt because your making something new and bold.

I agree with IL on most of these modifications & I have a few to add myself.

British Tank: Crusader or Churchill
British Bomber: Avro Lancaster
British Battleship: Nelson

American Tank: M3 Grant
American Artillery: M2 155mm “Long Tom” cannon
American Bomber: B-29 Superfortress
American Aircraft Carrier: Essex Class ships
American Submarine: Gato Class ships

German Tank: Pz. IV D (with short barrel 75mm gun)
German Artillery: 88mm (with anti-tank shield)
German Bomber: Heinkel 111

Also, will the pieces match the colors of the AH models?

[d142]

i would rather the king tiger tank,
i have a set of panzer IV from axis and allies revised

[crsluggo]

The German Tank in all of the newer A&A games is the Panther, not the Panzer IV

[AG124]

Yes, the German tank mold from all A&A editions from Revised onwards is the Panther (although I am not sure what sub variant). There are differences in the molds (see Boardgamegeek for comparison pictures) but all of them are various Panthers.

I agree to a certain degree with Imperious Leader regarding unique molds; many of us are going to retain the original pieces, and could use different molds for different house rules (or at the very least, we could enjoy a variety of molds simply for aesthetic value). However, some people may prefer to replace their old units altogether, and some of the original molds are hideously ugly and inaccurate (the German Admiral Hipper class CA and US Iowa class BB come to mind). Also, some units are so representative of their type and nation, it feels inappropriate to leave them out. The US Gato class submarine (or ‘Ray Class’ according to AAR…sigh…) comes to mind, but most US subs would look very similar at this scale anyway. Bearing, all of this in mind, I think I would settle for (in some cases, there are multiple units I think would be OK):

US:

• CV - Essex Class.
• [CVE - Bogue Class].
• BB - South Dakota Class or Iowa Class.
• CA - Baltimore Class.
• DD - Fletcher Class.
• SS - Gato Class.
• AK - Liberty or Victory Class.
• Fighter - Wildcat, Hellcat, Mustang, or Corsair (all are very iconic and well known).
• [Dive Bomber] - Dauntless or Helldiver.
• Heavy Bomber - B-17 or B-29.
• Tank - M4A3 or M4A4 Sherman (the current Sherman appears to be an M4A1). Also, I would like to note (in repsonse to an earlier post) that the US M3’s were called Lee, and not Grant, the latter being the UK lend-lease name for them.
• Artillery - M8 Howitzer would be OK (not the SP version though).
• Half-Track - M3 Half Track.

UK:

• CV - Illustrious Class (most other UK CV’s were one-offs, and most were sunk by the game’s start date).
• [CVE - Share US Bogue mold, or use Collossus Class].
• BB - King George V Class.
• CA/CL - Southampton Class or County Class.
• DD - Tribal Class.
• SS - T Class.
• AK - North Sands Class.
• Fighter - mid-war Spitfire or Hurricane.
• [Dive Bomber] - Barracuda.
• Heavy Bomber - Lancaster or Halifax.
• Tank - Churchill IV (most Churchills would look the same at this scale anyway).
• Artillery - I’ll let someone else choose a UK artillery piece.
• Half Track - Bren Carrier.

USSR:

• CV - Project 72.
• [CVL - “Komsomolets” - 1920s design].
• BB - Soyuz Class.
• CA - Kirov/Maxim Gorkij Class.
• DD - Type 7.
• SS - S-IX.
• AK - US Liberty Class, I guess.
• Fighter - Any Mig or Yak model.
• [Dive Bomber - IL-2, although the IL-2 was actually a ground-strike aircraft and not a true bomber].
• Heavy Bomber - PE-3.
• Tank - T-34/76, or if everyone else wants something different, T-34/85 or KV-1.
• Artillery - Again, some else can choose an appropriate piece here.
• Half Track - Either a lend-lease M3, or choose any original Soviet halftrack (I can’t think of one right now and don’t have time to look one up, but they did exist).

Germany:

• CV - Graf Zeppelin.
  -[CVL - Seydlitz].
• BB - Bismarck or Scharnhorst Class (not the Deutchland class though, as they were little more than 11" CA’s and were later classified as such anyway).
• CA - Hipper Class (I hate the current mold).
• DD - Z-36 Class (again, I hate the current mold).
• SS - Type IXC.
• AK - I do not have a preference for a German transport, but I do want a unique German mold here.
• Fighter - FW-190 would be fine.
• [Dive Bomber] - JU87B Stuka.
• Heavy Bomber - HE 111.
• Tank - Panzer IV F2/G/H, or Tiger I (Panther Ausf. D seems too early and limited production for me, and Tiger II/King Tiger seems too much of a late war tank).
• Artillery - A 7.6mm artillery piece would be OK.
• Half Track - Sd Kfz 251.

Italy:

• CV - Aquila.
  -[CVL - Sparviero].
• BB - Littorio Class.
• CA - Zara Class.
• DD - Navigatori Class.
• SS - Marconi Class.
• AK - Any, but must be unique.
• Fighter - C202 Folgore.
• [Dive-Bomber] - Share Stuka mold.
• Heavy Bomber - SM79 Sparviero
• Tank - either M11/39 or M13/40.
• Artillery - Don’t have a preference for Italian artillery.
• Half Track - Not too familiar with Italian halftracks, so someone else can make a suggestion here.

Japan:

• CV - Shokaku Class
  -[CVL - Zuiho Class]
• BB - Nagato Class, or Kongo Class.
• CA - Mogami Class, or Tone Class.
• DD - Kagero Class.
• SS - Type B1.
• AK - “Standard Merchant;” mass-produced freighter with aft engines.
• Fighter - A6M2 Zero
• [Dive Bomber - D3A Val, or B5N2 Kate]
• Heavy Bomber - G3M Nell
• Tank - Type 97 Chi-Ha
• Artillery - 70mm field artillery.
• Half Track - Type 1 Ho-Ha.

[tin_snips]

if FMG’s goal is to replace all of the original pieces for better quality ones, then the new molds should be based on common tanks, planes, etc from each nation. if it’s to build upon, then new molds different from the originals would obviously be the key

so is the goal to replace, or to add?

[Imperious Leader]

It can do both. example:

Germany

Tank: Panzer III or King Tiger
Artillery: Pak 36
Fighter: New decent Stuka or FW-190
Bomber: Heinkel
Submarine: Type VII
Battleship: Scharnhorst or Hipper class
Cruiser:Scharnhorst or Hipper class
Destroyer: Zerstörer 1936A “Narvik”

so basically you rebuilt the units with new iconic pieces to either replace the existing pieces with these ( which was the intention) or even better you got a new line of pieces so you can build an entire line of new types of pieces. It would be like how some people use the old MB AA pieces for various extra units.

The key is the color must match exactly and the size of each piece must be in the same proportion as in AA50. So you could have two kinds of German battleship if you wanted to and have it with different costs or capabilities or just use it to replace the old unit. This gives maximum utility from the value of getting pieces in the first place.

[Adlertag]

As usual I agree with IL

[dinosaur]

I imagine FMarsh needs to keep this project to a single set of molds to make it economically viable.  In this vein, I believe he will receive the greatest number of orders by having a complete new set of pieces which will be able to replace the OOTB pieces or used along side the OOTB stuff.  The colors are an important factor as is the detail quality.  The additional pieces may have to wait until he has shown a sufficient profit to pursue that as a new project.  Even in my “extras” request, I realized it was not trivial to ask for a special infantry mold for China and the Aussies.  I don’t have BOTB, AAE or AA50 so I don’t know what kind of extras are in those sets (pill boxes, trucks, etc.) but asking for pieces beyond the types used in AAR along with a set of cruisers and Italians may prevent this project from making a profit.  I hope FMarsh makes plenty of sets, has plenty of orders, and can develop many other products in the future with the profit he gets from this project.  My biggest reason to support this is because the AAR set I have includes redundant pieces (same tanks for UK and US, same arty pieces, same subs for different countries, and even the same transports).  I want a unique unit in each country.  My Pacific game has US Navy planes, so I don’t have to worry about the P-38 on my carriers any more.

For these reasons, I want something besides the “Zero” as the Japanese fighter.  But I don’t know what that plane should be.  I suppose a “Kate” might be OK, but maybe there are others.  I am also struggling with what the UK fighter should be since the Spitfire is already in the AAR set.  Is there an iconic Pacific theatre fighter for the UK?  There is no question you fellows know more about the specific WWII hardware than I do.

[tin_snips]

kittyhawk was a pacific fighter wasn’t it?

is there still going to be jet fighter molds at some point (sorry if i skipped someone covering that). i want an me262 for my germany  :cry:

[Black Fox]

kittyhawk was a pacific fighter wasn’t it?

The Kittyhawk, Warhawk and Tomohawk were all P-40 but different variation.  The Tomohawk was basically the export version and was the main type that served with the Flying Tigers.  All versions served in the pacific.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtiss_P-40

[Imperious Leader]

American fighter has got to be the Mustang P-51

American bomber should be a B-25 Mitchell. That way the other bomber from AA50 could be a heavy bomber because it looks just like a strategic bomber, while the B-25 is your average joe medium bomber.

The AA50 fighter already looks like a classic naval tac fighter or torpedo bomber

I agree that all the new pieces need to be iconic, but their are other choices than just redoing the basic pieces.

The American tank is fine , so the new tank could be a Stuart, M24 Chaffee, M3 Lee. It makes no sence to just make a new replacement Sherman because we already got that and the current Sherman is just fine. The whole idea is:

1. make a new set of pieces
2. to correct the problems found in some of the AA pieces ( Italian cruiser, etc)

If your just wasting money revamping the exact same pieces but a little bit better it WONT be as successful financially as just making something original and better.

The spitfire for UK is just fine, a Swordfish would be something while all the other British fighters look alot like the spitfire. It makes no sence to make ANOTHER SPITFIRE. To me it seems like a waste of money for the trouble to FIX basically not “broken” pieces. To me the whole idea is to fix what is broken which is the whole issue that a number of the AA pieces are doubled up on more than one nation ( like Italy and Japan having the same artillery unit)

So since FMG is taking the bold step and making new pieces, it seems a waste to redo alot of the same pieces that were basically fine, but missing the opportunity to make something new, which creates utility for other games yet to come. It would give a whole new universe of pieces to create new rules for and substitute in future AA games, because frankly i expect WOTC to maintain its cheapness and avoid new pieces and keep rehashing out the old crap over and over. FMG stands to make a huge standing for all these types of games and raise the bar for quality.

[ithkrall]

I agree 100% with IL

New units, give us some variety.

I would love a hurricane, typhoon or mosquito for the UK fighter, so it can go along with the spitfires fro AA50.

Even dive bombers for the fighter pieces would be neat.

Variety is the spice of live after all!

[d142]

all the pieces should be new sculpt’s, the extra detail that would be used would be noticable, although most of the pieces from revised are detailed, with the exception of the airforce, the transport, the u.s. and u.k. armor,
for the project to be successful, the pieces should be as far removed from other readily available pieces that are at market,
there is also room for  highly detailed bigger battleships, new I.C. and AA gun, i think that the color for the models should be chosen by the color that show’s the greatest detail to the finished model

[mrninjaz]

FMG: Are making new pieces for China also? And I’m in for a pre-order!  :-D

[frimmel]

I’m not uninterested in this project but personally don’t have a lot of call for additional pieces. Being on the fence on the matter I’ve felt I should ‘stay out.’

However just re-sculpts of the pieces I have would be of less interest than an additional set of pieces that could be their own units or generic units. A Tiger Tank sculpt would be of more utility than a more accurate panther sculpt.

Basically agreeing with IL.

[Krieghund]

Of course, that assumes that the new pieces are at least close in color to the official ones.  If they’re too different, they’re not of much use as specialized unit types.

[LuckyDay]

Color is supposed to match the battledice, but even if a bit different I think they could still suffice to work with current pieces.  Some Paintskreig could always fix your ills.  And since they’d have to be at least re-sculpted designs of the original units they could function as extensions of unit types from the original or stand-alones that simply replace all the originals.

[ithkrall]

@LuckyDay:

Color is supposed to match the battledice, but even if a bit different I think they could still suffice to work with current pieces.  Some Paintskreig could always fix your ills.  And since they’d have to be at least re-sculpted designs of the original units they could function as extensions of unit types from the original or stand-alones that simply replace all the originals.

Neato, someone using the term “Paintkrieg”. I wonder if i can claim coinage of that ;)

Anywho, as long as the model quality is good i will buy, I would prefer new units, but the colour wont phase me as I will paint them.

I can see how people would want the new plastics as close as possible to the originals though

[crsluggo]

I would be content if the pieces matched the battle dice. Besides WOTC/AH already has so many variations in their national colors…Japanese in 3 colors…Germans in 4…