PanzerStahl vs barnee EXP

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm ahh my Bad. Looks like you got Rail already down. :flushed:

Be nice if i could sow a few Sea Mines for India lol

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm I just reread the rules and i don’t have the Natl Guard activating correctly. I’ll have to fix the xml. For now gotta use Edit.

The US National Guard is activated if Japan –
unprovoked – attacks any US, UK or ANZAC
units or territories/islands.
Any Japanese attack against Dutch
territories/islands is considered an attack against
UK and ANZAC, with the same consequences
concerning activating the US National Guard.

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm ok I was fckn up. Those were Pacific rules lol. Was trying to figure out what was up lol

*The United States may not declare war on any Axis
power unless an Axis power either declares war on it first
or captures London or any territory in North America,
after which it may declare war on any or all Axis powers
on its following turn. However, on turn 3, Japan will
awaken the sleeping giant at Pearl Harbor, and the United
States may declare war on any or all Axis powers at the
beginning of the Collect Income phase of that turn if
it has not done so already. *

So rules are working correctly :)

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm Hmm … I guess triplea does it wrong. I just checked OOB with a RD 1 JPN Attack on UK and ANZAC no USA and it gives the option to DOW for USA.

According to the above rules they shouldn’t be able too.

Hmm … you’ve played some OOB online, how do you guys play it ? Is triplea wrong ?

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm I’m all Fckd up here. Natl Guard Rules are what we need to go by. So USA can DOW after JPN Attack on UK/ANZAC.

I’m just trying to see the downside for JPN not to DOW on all of them.

Well, I’m gonna Edit Natl Gd and DOW with USA. Let me know if that’s how you see it. I’ll wait before I post turn.

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm OK it’s buggin me :) I’m gonna ask @The-Captain

Hi Cap. JPN did a DOW on UK and ANZAC rd 2. So USA Natl Guard activates per EXP rules. Can USA also DOW on any Axis on there turn 2 ?

I’m not sure of OOB rules and wanted to know how you guys play it.

Thanks

[barnee]

Can’t edit posts here :)

The more I think about it, in EXP, Natl Gd activates after JPN DOW on UK/ANZAC but USA still can’t DOW Axis until of end of rd 3.

The dudes are just being deployed.

? :)

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm well looks like USA can DOW, so that’s what there gonna do.

I just don’t see the benefit for JPN not to DOW on all of them. Must be a leftover Pacific rule thing idk

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm cheese and rice. Machine just locked up. I’m making a mess here lol See if i can recover it.

If not, I’llrerun. Well, will have to, but it’s to your advantage as the only USA contested battle is off singapore with your SS which was sunk with no hits :)

See if I can straighten us out lol

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Americans
        Americans buy 2 Fortifications, 1 Heavy_BB, 1 artillery, 1 destroyer, 1 elite, 1 transport and 2 usa_armours; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Politics - Americans
        Americans takes Political Action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for Germans and Americans from Neutrality to War
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for British and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for ANZAC and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for Americans and French from Neutrality to Allied
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for Americans and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Allies from Neutrality to Friendly_Neutral
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Germans: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Axis from Neutrality to Unfriendly_Neutral
        Americans takes Political Action: Political Action Americans To War With Japanese
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Americans from Neutrality to War
        Americans takes Political Action: Political Action Americans To War With Italians
            Americans succeeds on action: Political Action Americans To War With Italians: Changing Relationship for Italians and Americans from Neutrality to War
        Trigger Americans War Production Eastern: has removed 1 factory_minor owned by Americans in Eastern United States
        Trigger Americans War Production Central: has removed 1 factory_minor owned by Americans in Central United States
        Trigger Americans War Production Western: has removed 1 factory_minor owned by Americans in Western United States
        Trigger Americans War Production Eastern: Americans has 1 factory_major placed in Eastern United States
        Trigger Americans War Production Central: Americans has 1 factory_major placed in Central United States
        Trigger Americans War Production Western: Americans has 1 factory_major placed in Western United States

    Combat Move - Americans
        Trigger Americans Unrestricted Movement: Setting movementRestrictionTerritories cleared for rulesAttachment attached to Americans
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceAmericans: Americans has 2 Europe_Rails and 6 Rails placed in Eastern United States
        1 destroyer moved from 35 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
              Americans take 35 Sea Zone from Japanese
        1 submarine moved from 54 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
        1 usa_fighter moved from Philippines to 43 Sea Zone
        1 usa_fighter moved from Philippines to 44 Sea Zone

    Combat - Americans
        Battle in 44 Sea Zone
            Americans attack with 1 usa_fighter
            Japanese defend with 1 transport
                Americans roll dice for 1 usa_fighter in 44 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.50 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 transport in 44 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/0 hits, 0.00 expected hits
                1 transport owned by the Japanese lost in 44 Sea Zone
            Americans win with 1 usa_fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 transport
        Battle in 37 Sea Zone
            Americans attack with 1 destroyer and 1 submarine
            Japanese defend with 1 submarine
                Americans roll dice for 1 submarine in 37 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 submarine owned by the Japanese lost in 37 Sea Zone
            Americans win, taking 37 Sea Zone from Japanese with 1 destroyer and 1 submarine remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 submarine
        Battle in 43 Sea Zone
            Americans attack with 1 usa_fighter
            Japanese defend with 1 submarine and 1 transport
            1 submarine owned by the Japanese submerged
                Americans roll dice for 1 usa_fighter in 43 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.50 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 transport in 43 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/0 hits, 0.00 expected hits
                1 transport owned by the Japanese lost in 43 Sea Zone
            Americans win with 1 usa_fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 transport

    Non Combat Move - Americans
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveAmericans: has removed 2 Europe_Rails and 3 Rails owned by Americans in Eastern United States
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveAmericans: has removed 3 Rails owned by Americans in Alaska
        1 usa_fighter moved from 43 Sea Zone to Philippines
        1 usa_fighter moved from 44 Sea Zone to Philippines
        1 infantry and 1 usa_armour moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone
        1 infantry, 1 submarine, 1 transport and 1 usa_armour moved from 10 Sea Zone to 8 Sea Zone
        1 infantry and 1 usa_armour moved from 8 Sea Zone to Aleutian Islands
        1 transport moved from 8 Sea Zone to 10 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun and 1 elite moved from Eastern United States to 101 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun, 1 carrier, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 1 elite, 1 submarine and 1 transport moved from 101 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun and 1 elite moved from 91 Sea Zone to Gibraltar
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Eastern United States to 101 Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 101 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 91 Sea Zone to Morocco
        1 bomber moved from Eastern United States to United Kingdom
        2 usa_fighters moved from Eastern United States to 91 Sea Zone
        1 Rail moved from Eastern United States to Western United States
        1 Rail and 1 infantry moved from Western United States to Alaska
        1 mech_infantry moved from Western United States to Central United States
        1 Rail moved from Eastern United States to Central United States
        1 Rail and 1 infantry moved from Central United States to Alaska
        1 Rail moved from Eastern United States to Central United States
        1 Rail and 1 infantry moved from Central United States to Alaska
        1 usa_fighter moved from Hawaiian Islands to Queensland
        1 mech_infantry moved from Western United States to Central United States

    Place Units - Americans
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Adding units owned by Americans to Western United States: 6 infantry and 2 usa_fighters
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
        2 Fortifications placed in Aleutian Islands
        1 transport placed in 10 Sea Zone
        2 usa_armours placed in Western United States
        1 artillery placed in Central United States
        1 elite placed in Eastern United States
        1 Heavy_BB and 1 destroyer placed in 101 Sea Zone

    Turn Complete - Americans
        Americans collect 52 PUs; end with 52 PUs
        Trigger Americans AdvancedProduction: Americans met a national objective for an additional 14 PUs; end with 66 PUs
        Objective Americans 1 Homeland: Americans met a national objective for an additional 10 PUs; end with 76 PUs
        Objective Americans 3 Defense Obligations: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 81 PUs
        Objective Americans 2 Outer Territories: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 86 PUs
        Objective Americans 4 Philippines: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 91 PUs
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Removing units owned by Americans from Western United States: 2 usa_fighters
        EDIT: Adding units owned by Americans to Eastern United States: 2 usa_fighters
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

    Purchase Units - Chinese
        Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
        Chinese buy 6 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Chinese
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceChinese: Chinese has 2 Rails placed in Kansu
        1 infantry moved from Kweichow to Hunan
              Chinese take Hunan from Japanese
        1 infantry moved from Suiyuyan to Chahar
              Chinese take Chahar from Japanese

    Combat - Chinese

    Non Combat Move - Chinese
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveChinese: has removed 2 Rails owned by Chinese in Kansu
        1 fighter moved from Shensi to Burma
        1 infantry moved from Shensi to Kweichow
        1 infantry moved from Shensi to Suiyuyan
        1 infantry moved from Shensi to Sikang
        1 infantry moved from Szechwan to Sikang

    Place Units - Chinese
        6 infantry placed in Tsinghai
        Chinese undo move 1.
        2 infantry placed in Sikang
        4 infantry placed in Tsinghai

    Turn Complete - Chinese
        Chinese collect 9 PUs; end with 9 PUs
        Objective Advanced Production 1 Infantry: Chinese met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 12 PUs

    Purchase Units - British
        Note to players British: <body><b>It is Late 1940 and the British Army has Formed a Tank Army.<br />They are Commanded by a Tank General. You may only have 1 Tank Army at any one time.<b></body>
        Trigger UKTankGeneral: buyUK_TankGeneral added to productionBritish
        British buy 1 Fortification, 1 elite, 5 infantry, 3 uk_armours, 1 uk_fighter and 4 uk_paras; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceBritish: British has 2 Rails placed in Union of South Africa
        1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Burma to Yunnan
        1 infantry moved from Shan State to Siam
              British take Siam from Japanese
        2 uk_fighters and 1 uk_tactical_bomber moved from India to Yunnan
        2 infantry moved from Ethiopia to 76 Sea Zone
        1 battleship moved from 39 Sea Zone to 72 Sea Zone
        2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 76 Sea Zone to 72 Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from 72 Sea Zone to Kenya
        1 bomber moved from Malta to Kenya

    Combat - British
        Battle in Kenya
            British attack with 1 bomber and 2 infantry
            Italians defend with 1 infantry
                British roll dice for 1 battleship in Kenya, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                Italians roll dice for 1 infantry in Kenya, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the British lost in Kenya
                1 infantry owned by the Italians lost in Kenya
            British win, taking Kenya from Italians with 1 bomber and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for British: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Italians: 1 infantry
        Battle in Yunnan
            British attack with 1 artillery, 3 infantry, 2 uk_fighters and 1 uk_tactical_bomber
            Japanese defend with 3 infantry
                British roll dice for 1 artillery, 3 infantry, 2 uk_fighters and 1 uk_tactical_bomber in Yunnan, round 2 : 2/7 hits, 2.67 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 3 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the British lost in Yunnan
                2 infantry owned by the Japanese lost in Yunnan
                British roll dice for 1 artillery, 2 infantry, 2 uk_fighters and 1 uk_tactical_bomber in Yunnan, round 3 : 1/6 hits, 2.50 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Yunnan, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Japanese lost in Yunnan
            British win, taking Yunnan from Japanese with 1 artillery, 2 infantry, 2 uk_fighters and 1 uk_tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
            Casualties for British: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Japanese: 3 infantry

    Non Combat Move - British
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveBritish: has removed 1 Rail owned by British in Trans-Jordan
        Trigger RailMovementAutoPlaceRemoveBritish: has removed 1 Rail owned by British in Egypt
        2 uk_fighters moved from Yunnan to India
        1 uk_tactical_bomber moved from Yunnan to Burma
        1 infantry moved from Burma to Shan State
        2 infantry moved from India to Burma
        1 uk_armour moved from India to Burma
        1 aaGun moved from India to Burma
        1 aaGun moved from Burma to Yunnan
        1 infantry moved from Eastern Persia to Persia
              British take Persia from Neutral_Allies
        2 artilleries and 2 infantry moved from Egypt to Trans-Jordan
        1 mech_infantry and 1 uk_armour moved from Ethiopia to Egypt
        1 destroyer moved from 76 Sea Zone to 98 Sea Zone
        1 bomber moved from Kenya to Anglo Egyptian Sudan
        1 Rail and 1 infantry moved from Union of South Africa to Trans-Jordan
        1 Rail and 1 uk_armour moved from Union of South Africa to Egypt
        1 infantry moved from British Guiana to Brazil
              British take Brazil from Neutral_Allies
        1 transport moved from 88 Sea Zone to 86 Sea Zone
        1 transport moved from 91 Sea Zone to 86 Sea Zone
        1 elite moved from United Kingdom to Scotland

    Place Units - British
        1 Fortification placed in Sumatra
        3 infantry and 2 uk_armours placed in India
        2 infantry and 1 uk_armour placed in Union of South Africa
        1 elite, 1 uk_fighter and 4 uk_paras placed in United Kingdom

    Turn Complete - British
        Total Cost from Convoy Blockades: 1
            Rolling for Convoy Blockade Damage in 119 Sea Zone. Rolls: 1,6
        British collect 47 PUs (1 lost to blockades); end with 47 PUs
        Trigger British AdvancedProduction: British met a national objective for an additional 6 PUs; end with 53 PUs
        Objective British 1 Original: British met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 58 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Americans regular : 1.67
Italians regular : 0.67
Japanese regular : -0.33
British regular : -1.83

EXP Game 1 Stahl UK 2.tsvg

Sorry for all the spam. So after all my rambling, I forgot to activate Natl Gd. That’s why I edited two Ftrs to E Coast.

Thought there was something else, can’t remember.

Anyway, oh yea, so I recovered with auto save after NCM USA

At any rate, we should be good. Let me know if you have any questions after I made a mess of this turn lol

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm JFC all Malta Air should be in Egypt. Was gonna move GIB DD into med as well but after this fiasco by the High Command, he can stay where he is.

The Air does need to move tho

Sorry for fckn shit up :)

[The Captain]

@barnee

Hi barnee,

The OOB rules say that USA can declare War on any or all Axis Nations, if any Axis Nation unprovoked declares War on or attacks USA before round 3 (Early 1941).

Since an attack is made by Japan in Late 1940 (round 2) against United Kingdom and/or ANZAC - and not against the USA - a state of War exists only between UK/ANZAC and Japan - not USA.

The US National Guard is activated by USA in order to prepare for a state of War between Japan and USA - but USA do not yet know if Japan is going to attack USA… so USA cannot declare War until attacked or declared War upon - or until Early 1941 (round 3).

[barnee]

@The-Captain Thanks Captain. That’s what I thought. I don’t know where simon got this because I can’t find it.

https://www.axisandallies.org/forums/topic/18412/global-2nd-edition-q-a-aag40-2/2964

following turn ? Maybe that’s my misunderstanding ? I see no benefit fot JPN otherwise.

Anyway, @Panzerstahl-Helm I need to completely redo USA 2. I’m not sure if I can tho. I’ve never tried it after posting a turn already. Should be able to I’d think. Idk.

I’ll give it a shot. We’ll sort it one way or another :)

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm ok it’ll let me redo the turn in pbem. Be a while. I just got up to piss and checked for an answer.

[barnee]

@barnee said in PanzerStahl vs barnee EXP:

Can’t edit posts here :)

The more I think about it, in EXP, Natl Gd activates after JPN DOW on UK/ANZAC but USA still can’t DOW Axis until of end of rd 3.

The dudes are just being deployed.

? :)

wtf why did I even ask lol

[Panzerstahl-Helm]

@barnee
Good morning. I haven’t looked at the game map yet, but I guess in OOB the US can declare war after Japan DOW to UK/ANZAC. Thst is my understanding of the rules and I guess we used to play it in the normal G40 games.
Nevertheless, in case US cannot declare war to Japan yet, wouldn’t it be enough to adjust the income of the US (I think they receove a bonus when entering the war, so this amount could be reduced) instead of re-dping the whole turn?

BR

[barnee]

Hi @Panzerstahl-Helm yea Idk what’s up exactly. I asked Panther directly and haven’t heard back. I wish people would just answer the question instead of saying here’s the rules. I know where the rules are. That’s not what I’m asking lol

The Captain interprets it the way i do. USA is still Neutral after the JPN DOW Rd 2 on UK/ANZAC and must abide by All USA Neutral Rules including Movement Restrictions.
The National Guard does Deploy though.

That’s how I see it and how I’m gonna play it :) It makes no sense otherwise. There is no benefit for JPN not to DOW USA if USA can DOW and Attack the same turn, Rd 2, that JPN does it’s UK DOW.

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm what got me all confused is triplea doesn’t do it that way. I know triplea isn’t perfect, but theres no mention of it anywhere in the Game Notes to Player Enforce and it’s been out for 15 years lol

[barnee]

@Panzerstahl-Helm OK after more discussion, triplea does it correctly and the latest save is legal.
EXP Game 1 Stahl UK 2.tsvg

The United States may not declare war on any Axis power unless an Axis power either declares war on it first
or captures London or any territory in North America, or Japan makes an unprovoked declaration of war against the UK or
ANZAC, after which it may declare war on any or all Axis powers on its following turn.

[barnee]

@The-Captain so according to simon USA can Declare War against JPN Rd 2 in the above scenario. I don’t fully understand it other than it was Pacific map only specific maybe.

The above post is from the Global Political situation.