G1 Taking all of France

@azpathfinder said in IC in France Liberated by US - Upgrade?:

Can the US upgrade the factory in Normandy to a major IC and keep control of it (until Paris is liberated, at which point it would become a French IC)? Thereby allowing the US to build 10 … or are they restricted to building 3?

Rulebook Europe 1940.2 page 27:
“The industrial complex to be upgraded must be located on an originally controlled (not
captured) territory that you have controlled since the beginning of your turn and that has an IPC value of 3 or higher.”

Normandy Bordeaux - originally controlled by France - has an IPC value of only 2.
So two reasons why US can’t do what you intend.

@azpathfinder said in IC in France Liberated by US - Upgrade?:

Please only provide answers that support my opinion, because the other side (who also reads this forum) is filled with a bunch of cheaters and hooligans.

I can’t figure out which side seems to know the respective rules however.
So - sorry - just in case your opinion was against the rules. :wink:

cc: @SuperbattleshipYamato

Germany has to deny the NO SZ125 but Japan can deny it by taking out Amur.

Ran some numbers last night. If the USSR buys an additional fighter, with 4 bombers Germany still has a positive expected value from bombing G3. To make it negative, USSR needs to buy two fighters. USSR doesn’t want to spend money on fighters so I guess it is still worthwhile for Germany to threaten it. Could conceivably be worthwhile to attack even with a negative expected value because USSR’s money is worth more than Germany’s. The problem is that if you lose a bomber or two, do you have enough to hit it next turn?

I say Germany always because Germany is your powerhouse as far as income, and the more income you can bring in for Germany the better chance you have of taking Russia since you can spend more, while I do like to bring an Italian Force into Russia this force is there to support the German force, take the first hits in counter attacks and keep my German units around much longer, Southern France also allows the Germans to build their own fleet to transport units to africa which can give you a big boost and can usually bring an Axis victory in the Med.

I see what you guys are saying and I agree. I’ve been kicking around the idea to replace the $5 NO for Japanese control of Borneo, Celebes, Java and Sumatra with the following:

$5 for Japanese control of Okinawa, Formosa, Iwo Jima, Marianas, Palau, Caroline Islands and Marshall Islands. This occurs when Japan is at war with the Western Allies. So if UK and/or ANZAC declare war on Japan, with USA still neutral, then Japan will collect this NO.
I’ve also modified the $5 NO for Japanese control of Midway, Wake, Guam, Solomon Islands and Gilbert Islands. I changed it to $1 for control of each island.

I also removed the US NO of $10 for US control of Eastern US, Central US and Western US because I think that falls in the same category as the DEI NO. The continental US is worth $42 to the US all together, has all their main manufacturing plants and includes two Victory Cities, one of which is their capital. That’s more than enough incentive to not lose any of those three territories. However, I didn’t want to just take away US NO money, so I replaced it with the following:

$1 each for Allied control of the following: Midway, Wake Island, Guam, Marshall Islands, Caroline Islands, Palau, Marianas, Iwo Jima, Okinawa and Formosa. This occurs when US is at war with Japan.

So you see, there is still the possibility for the US to make the full $10 in NO money, plus 3 of the Japanese Islands are worth $1 which will be an extra bonus. Also, since 3 of the islands are already US owned, the US can still collect $3 when at war with Japan but before their offensive gets moving.
I thought that might do something to get a little more action in these valueless islands. I wonder if I ought to change Japan’s because once the US is in the war, Japan’s NO is really easy to disrupt because the Marshall Islands are close to the US and they are unguarded. Do you think that I should remove the Marshalls from Japan’s NO?

Thank you for your last post.

The jerk part was a little pot shot at your username. My apologies.

Japan may be able to take any IC that the UK has/builds in Africa/Mideast.  A Japan that does a J4 along with sending its entire fleet into the Indian Ocean to take Egypt is tough to beat along with a successful German G1.

If you try it out, you’ll see that the U.K. can’t sufficiently reinforce France, even with the additional 6 French troops, from having Germany crush it on round 2.  Even if every available plane is landed there, and the strafe leaves 2 tanks plus the fighter, it’s impossible to hold.  So all that landing planes accomplishes is wiping out the British airforce (and keeping France from falling to Italy).  The payoff isn’t worth it.

The biggest downsides I can imagine are that (1) it is much more difficult to hold off serious landings at Normandy by the US and/or UK.  Italy then has to protect Western Europe and the Med–although with Germany taking S France, they can dump ships in the Med as well if it comes to that (subs backed up by planes would be cheap).  And (2) delaying the war on the Pacific side until round 3 (which would make this work much better at times, depending on the US builds) means that UK Pacific can shuttle some troops over.

The really nice thing about this strategy is that it’s more efficient to have Italy be the 1 force in the Med, and not have to worry about building enough ships off the S France factory right away to protect them from UK planes.

I think it’s going to be the standard opening in our play group for the foreseeable future.

The counter someone mentioned above about making sure to buy troops in S Africa–either mechs, or infantry/artillery to go with transports, in combination with some shuttling from India, is probably the safe response.

Grover and I just started another game, with me being the Axis, and I’ve got to say I’m enjoying the big Italian boost.

I could be undefeatable by anyone currently living on planet Earth and never skip a sacking of France on Germany 1 or failing Germany 1, at least whacking him good and doing it with Italy. (Although, with at least 4 fighters there, I highly doubt I would let Italy even try.)