National Objectives

Well that brings back the “national morale” index, where a nation falls at any time when the support of the people are so far against it that they just collapse. I know public opinion means nothing to some people here, but in this war that reality was the result in at least two cases.

@Imperious:

Well that brings back the “national morale” index, where a nation falls at any time when the support of the people are so far against it that they just collapse. I know public opinion means nothing to some people here, but in this war that reality was the result in at least two cases.

:roll:

Just because I showed that public opinion was not the most important factor in determining when the USA went to war does not give you license to hypergeneralize that to make it look like I said that unrest in a country is irrelevant in determing a full-blown uprising.

Just because I showed that public opinion was not the most important factor in determining when the USA went to war does not give you license to hypergeneralize that to make it look like I said that unrest in a country is irrelevant in determing a full-blown uprising.

You still here? You didn’t show anything, public opinion gives the politicians the support to do or not do. Don’t be naive. Public opinion brought down Imperial Russia and Germany. Translation: mutiny and revolution.

Incredible.

Pouting now that your troll thread was deleted?

When you mock me like that (soon you will claim that when you were referring to those to whom public opinion does not matter, you were somehow not referring to me.  :roll:)

We have seen your true colors. They include misdirection, poor/misleading/nonexistent sourcing, childish repeat-till-it’s-true argumentation, employing of a second account to agree with you, and encouraging violence and death to your debate opponents.

The real question should be why are YOU still here? Is there no one else with an elementary school education able to remove spam?

You sound like that guy who didn’t get Sanford and Son season 4.

I hope you don’t infect the other threads like this one since they took playground from baby.

New poster, but long time gamer.

In terms of National Objectives, I believe they are too restrictive and create a gaming experience that is heavily scripted.

what I’ve done in the past with other A&A titles and similar grand strategic war games is create a National Morale or Will Track.

For WWI, I would establish a 3 Theater Track - Western Theater, Eastern Theater, and Mediteranean Theater.  Each starts at ‘0’ and moves in favor of Entente or Central Powers on a set critera, such as IPC’s gained or lost on a single turn in one of the theaters for example.  Then set a prescribed turn to end the game on (say 10 turns).  If no one has reached ‘immediate’ victory by gaining a certain number on each of the theater tracks) then the game ends and whichever side is ahead on 2 of the 3 theater tracks wins a conditional victory.

I’ve found that this creates a lot of tension and opens up strategies with many options and many different paths to victory.  Obviously some conditions would be considered heavily on the tracks, such as the loss of Paris or Berlin, or the High Seas Fleet controlling the channel.  Additionally, the game can be played out in 2 to 2.5 hours a big plus for me.

The NO’s then would give a VP to players rather than IPC.

That would feed the morale tracker up or down.

And probably each turn a nation would reduce the NM by X

Keeping NO’s raises a nations “resolve” above water

sort of like being in the red or black in business. and each nation with a different starting point ( e.g. a different ‘breaking point’)

Lets work on this using the idea.

Idea: when a nation drops into negative integers it must sue for peace. Each NO you got on your list increases the resolve by one point per turn.

Each turn subtracts one resolve unit

Other events should also trigger ( not unlike a note) the resolve, like US entering the game, or losing a big battle, etc.

What would they be?

Remember KISS, not world in flames chrome rules.

no no no. too complicated.

Just take the NO’s you made, use that for the -1 morale cost.

then create starting points for each nation;

For CP, Germany has the most, followed by Austro, then ottoman

For Entente, Russia has the least, then Italy, France, UK, USA.

Example: Germany at +8, Austro +5, Ottoman +3

etc.

Agreed.  Keep it simple.  Can’t stress enough the importance of tracks for different Fronts/Theaters.  This will keep it interesting and relevant for all players.  If the Aust/Hun are getting hammered by the Russians/Italians, the Germans or Turks may have to come to their aid, which in turn takes pressure of the Western Front and opens door for British in Mediteranean, etc. etc…creates a strategic chess match.

Have to see the actual map before I make any definitive judgement, but preliminarily I would say key map areas would gain 2 points, lesser map areas 1 point, elimination of X number of BP’s gains 1 point, failed attacks (losing more BP’s than defender -1 point)….something like that.

If at the end of a game turn either Alliance has enough combined points on all 3 fronts or 2 fronts are past the Alliances Morale Factor limit the game ends immediately.  It would be possible and appropriate if one side were to be able to win in 4 or 5 turns.  However, the risk of overextending is obvisous, as you encourage both counterattacks, and failed attacks could also cost you negative points.

Make it like something Larry would make if he was forced too. People identify with something that familiar and uncomplicated.

Simple: you gain morale points when you successfully take enemy territories or eliminate all enemy units within a territory.  If you fail, you risk losing morale points.  The rewards are greater if you attack, but not always.  This prevents turtling, but also prevents ridiculous attack, attack, attack, without any consequence.

Well actually we don’t know what the VC are, but that list is much closer than before.

But for each city taken you gain 1 VP
lost you lose 1 VP
Each turn you lose 1 VP ( the cost of war)
Each NO you gain 1 VP
Each battle lost on your own starting areas you lose 1 VP

no income for NO’s or VC… this is not global.

Sounds like we’re moving in the same or similar direction.  Just have to wait and see the finished product and go from there.  I’m aiming at making a tight game that can be finished in an evening (or it will be sitting on the shelf for long periods).

I’ll create my chart or track at that point and share the results…we’ll see.

It’s cool to see WWI using the system…I like the map better.  Turkey’s location adds extra flavor and the German High Seas Fleet was second only to the British.  Attrition played a big roll on the Western Front and Eastern Front was sweeping.  It just feels less scripted than WWII, which I love as a period, but games on the grand strategic level feel “samey.”

Cheers…