@FranceNeedsMorePower good point
Revised Global 1940: New Setup
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hey IL
Since you started this tread and began it taking about planes, i have a complete set of revised rules for aircraft. If you and others are interesred in looking at them let me know if i should post them in this thread or not. i have playtested these new rules and they are good. i think they would work well with the starting setup ratios you are talking about.yah sure.
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Should i start a new thread for Revised Global 40 aircraft rules?
yes do that.
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Extrapolation of Armed forces 6/1/40 was done based on the following ratios:
Land:
5 infantry divisions = 1 unit
2 Armor Divisions = 1 unit
3 Motorized Divisions/ Mechanized = 1 unit
Artillery (subjective based on level of artillery in infantry and other factors)Sea:
3 Battleships = 1 unit
4 Carriers = 1 unit
10 Cruisers = 1 unit
20 Destroyers = 1 unit
30 submarines = 1 unit
2,000,000 Gross Tons of Merchant Shipping ( rounded up) = 1 UnitAir:
200-250 Front line Fighters = 1 unit
200-250 Front line Fighter- Bombers= 1 unit
450-500 Front line Bombers= 1 unitGermany:
26 infantry, 5 tanks, 3 mech, 4 artillery, 5 fighters, 2 bombers, 2 tactical bombers
1 BB, 2 CA, 2 DD, 8 SS, 2 APItaly:
15 infantry, 1 tank, 2 mech, 2 artillery, 2 bombers, 2 fighters (1 in Italian East Africa), 1 tactical bomber.
2 BB, 2 CA, 3 DD, 5 SS, 1 APJapan:
10 infantry, 1 mech, 2 artillery ( from this in China, 6 inf) also, 2 Manchuria, 1 Japan)
3 BB,3 CV, 3 CA, 5 DD, 2 SS, 3 AP Land Based air: 2 fighters, 1 tactical bomber, 1 bomber. Sea Based air: 3 fighters, 3 tactical bombersRomania:
5 Infantry, 1 mech, 1 artillery, 1 fighterFinland:
5 infantry, 1 artilleryHungary:
5 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 tankBulgaria:
3 infantry, 1 artillery, ( they should have 1 fighter as they had 300 fighters at end of 1940)Sweden:
4 Infantry, 1 tank, 1 artillery, 1 fighterGreece:
3 Infantry, 1 APArgentina:
4 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 CABrazil:
4 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 APIraq:
2 InfantryFrance:
16 infantry, 6 mech, 3 tanks, 2 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 tactical bomber (air force was not ready and mostly destroyed by June 1940)
2 BB, 2 CA, 3 DD, 3 SS, 1 AP
United Kingdom: Global
6 infantry, 3 mech, 1 tank, 2 artillery, 2 fighters, 2 bombers, 1 tactical bomber
5 BB, 1 CV, 4 CA, 10 DD, 2 SS, 8 APBEF:
1 Infantry, 1 mech, 1 artilleryANZAC:
1 infantry, 1 tank, 1 DD, 1 AP ( Australian)Canada:
1 infantry, 1 DD, 1 APIndia:
2 infantry, 1 tankAfrica:
1 infantrySouth Africa:
1 InfantrySoviet Union:
25 infantry, 4 tanks, 4 mech, 5 artillery, 3 fighters, 1 tactical bomber, 1 bomber ( rated Soviets lower due to huge issues on quality and doctrine, but on paper they had the largest air force easily)
1 BB, 3 DD, 7 SS, 2 AP ( on the Manchurian border:6 Infantry, 2 Mech, 2 artillery 1 tanks, 1 fighter)United States:
4 infantry, 1 tank, 1 artillery. Sea Based air: 2 fighters 1 tactical bomber Land Based air: 2 bombers, 2 fighters, 1 tactical bomber
4 BB,2 CV, 4 CA, 5 DD, 4 SS, 4 APChina:
11 infantry, 1 artillery
**Chile:
3 InfantrySpain:
6 Infantry, 1 mech, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 DD, 1 APTurkey:
5 Infantry, 1 armor, 2 artillery, 1 DDDutch:
1 DDFinal disposition. Now working on placement.**
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Very nice work on this IL. Can the ratios on the aircraft be changed to put more planes on the board at start? or will that throw the balance off? Maybe every 100 fighters= 1fighter?
is there a way to balance fighter ratios based on how many planes or squadrons an carrier can hold? with your ratio 2 planes on a WW2 carrier represent 500 planes, is that correct? and if it is, were carriers at that time able to hold that many fighters? -
Oh i see, you have 4 carriers= i unit. makes sense. so, 1 carrier is holding 125 planes becouse 2 fighters rep. 500 and 1 carrier rep. 4. is that correct?
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Can the ratios on the aircraft be changed to put more planes on the board at start? or will that throw the balance off? Maybe every 100 fighters= 1fighter?
is there a way to balance fighter ratios based on how many planes or squadrons an carrier can hold? with your ratio 2 planes on a WW2 carrier represent 500 planes, is that correct? and if it is, were carriers at that time able to hold that many fighters?These are just numbers based on ratios. It does not indicate the final setup or where it will be. Also, naval air forces may include planes that are not on carriers, but for the most part the ratios reflect an equal portion of these planes to their carrier inventory. Japan for example has just enough planes for her carriers as thats what they had.
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Force pool is now complete. I checked and rechecked.
Now working on placement for each based on 6/40 date
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Hi
If I would like to start the game earlier, and invade Poland. What would be right ratio/forces for Poland?
4-5 Infantry, 1 Artillery and 1 Fighter? -
4-5 Infantry, 1 Artillery and 1 Fighter?
I don’t know, but this is June 1940 and some nations would have differences in the force pool. France for example would have alot more aircraft.
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If im looking for more engauging naval activity. Can all ship #s be doubled at start of game without throwing off game balance? Would changing Naval ratios upset Land and air ratios? are they connected?
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Looked at your starting #s again, doubling naval would be way too much. just dont like the idea of same old UK fleet dessimated G1 and the big eventual confrontation of US and Japans fleets after many turns of staring each other down. both sides usally badly mauled.
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What about using search roll option for all naval combat?
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If I would like to start the game earlier, and invade Poland. What would be right ratio/forces for Poland? 4-5 Infantry, 1 Artillery and 1 Fighter?
Poland must be separte in two part. (You can also had warsaw as a capital city).
Poland had 39 divisions, 11 brigades of cavalry (Almost all still has horse) and 700 airplanes.
Western poland = 4 inf. + 1 fig. + 1 armored VH.
Eastern poland = 3 inf. -
What about using search roll option for all naval combat?
Me and my friends used air search patrol for years now.
2 or less. If you don’t find the fleet the attack is cancelled.A few years ago, my friend didn’t succeed to find my fleet with 8 airplanes!
Too bad, my fleet was in inferiority!
The attack was cancelled and during my turn I found his fleet and I destroyed it.
The battle looked like Midway! -
What about using search roll option for all naval combat?
Me and my friends used air search patrol for years now.
2 or less. If you don’t find the fleet the attack is cancelled.A few years ago, my friend didn’t succeed to find my fleet with 8 airplanes!
Too bad, my fleet was in inferiority!
The attack was cancelled and during my turn I found his fleet and I destroyed it.
The battle looked like Midway!Thats what im talking about!!! The dice are everything to the game. I wish i could see your friends face when you sunk his fleet. awesome. I love the fact that even thou i am an experienced player, the possibility exsists that less experienced player can kick my ass if i rool crummy dice.
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Thats not the goal of Revised Global 40. The only changes will be minor and to give the player more options.
Naval search is not a ‘fix’ of a glaring problem with G40. The setup and a few others things are. The goal is to repair the setup, make the AB and NB a bit more specialized, and fix techs, neutrality issues, and perhaps lend lease.
Not reinventing the wheel here.
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I agree with IL on his thinking of this.
I like the numbers you came up with.
Regarding the Soviet and Italian subs, they should be coastal only, Russia did not have ocean going subs.
(good house rule) -
The set up has them on coasts, but again though your correct again we are faced with making special rules for the same pieces for different nations. This id like to get away with because the marginal advocate of realism is not paying off in the “fun factor” department. Russian players may want to move them out of harms way and that rule will make the sitting ducks.
You can make it a special rule just for Soviets and Italian subs but for most players that is not the way to do it. Their are many other unrealistic ideas in this game and its very hard to fix everything. Rather lets just worry about the really ridiculous ideas and fix them.
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@Imperious:
The set up has them on coasts, but again though your correct again we are faced with making special rules for the same pieces for different nations. This id like to get away with because the marginal advocate of realism is not paying off in the “fun factor” department. Russian players may want to move them out of harms way and that rule will make the sitting ducks.
You can make it a special rule just for Soviets and Italian subs but for most players that is not the way to do it. Their are many other unrealistic ideas in this game and its very hard to fix everything. Rather lets just worry about the really ridiculous ideas and fix them.
Agreed!
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After many days of research a June 1940 start date has the following forces:
Revised Global 1940 setup: Pacific 1940
JAPAN
Japan: 2 Infantry, 1 Bomber
Manchuria: 2 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Mechanized, 1 Fighter, 1 Bomber
Jehol: 2 Infantry, 1 Artillery,1 Fighter, 1 Tactical Bomber, 1 Bomber
Shantung: 2 Infantry
Kiangsu: 2 Infantry
Kiangsi: 2 Infantry
Kwangsi: 1 Infantry
Siam: 2 Infantry
Sea Zone 6 (off Japan): 3 Battleships, 2 Carriers, 2 Cruisers, 2 Destroyers, 1 Transport, 2 Fighters, 2 Tactical Bombers
Sea Zone 17: 1 Submarine
Sea Zone 19: 1 Destroyer, 1 Transport
Sea Zone 20: 1 Destroyer, 1 Transport
Sea Zone 22: 1 Submarine
Sea Zone 36: 1 Carrier, 1 Cruiser, 1 Destroyer, 1 Submarine, 1 Fighter, 1 Tactical BomberUnited Kingdom
India: 2 Infantry, 1 Tank
Burma: 1 Infantry
Malaya: 2 Infantry
Sea Zone 39 (Ceylon): 1 Cruiser, 2 Destroyers, 2 Transports
Sea Zone 37: 1 Battleship, 1 Cruiser, 1 Destroyer, 1 Transport
Sea Zone 42: 1 Submarine
Sea Zone 43: 1 Destroyer, 1 TransportNote: the Balance of the armed forces for AAE40
BEF 1 inf, 1 art, 1 Mech
Africa: 1 Inf, 2 mech, 1 art
Canada: 1 inf, 1 DD, 1 AP
UK: 1 inf, 1 art, 1 mech, 1 tank, 2 fighters, 2 bombers
Gibralter: 1 BB, 1 CV, 1 SS 1 AP, 1 Tactical bomber
Scapa Flow: 3 BB, 2 CA, 1 DD, 1 AP
Misc: 5 DD, 5 APANZAC
New Guinea: 1 Infantry
Queensland: 1 Infantry, 1 Artillery
New South Wales: 1 Tank, 1 Fighter
Western Australia: 1 Mechanized
Sea Zone 54: 1 Destroyer
Sea Zone 62: 1 TransportDutch
Sea Zone 41: 1 DestroyerCHINA
Chahar: 2 Infantry
Hopei: 2 Infantry, 1 Artillery
Anhwe: 2 Infantry
Human: 2 Infantry
Yunnan: 3 infantry, 1 FighterUnited States
Western United States: 2 Infantry, 1 Fighter, 1Bomber
Sea Zone 10 (San Diego): 1 Battleship, 1 Cruiser, 1 Destroyer, 1 Transport
Sea Zone 12: 1 Carrier, 1 Cruiser, 1 Destroyer, 1 Fighter, 1 Tactical Bomber
Sea Zone 14: 1 Submarine
Sea Zone 25: 1 Submarine
Hawaii: 1 Infantry, 1 Tactical Bomber,
Sea Zone 26 (Honolulu): 2 Battleships, 1 Cruiser, 1 Destroyer, 1 Transport
Philippines: 1 Infantry
Sea Zone 35: 1 Destroyer, 1 TransportNote: Balance of US armed forces for AAE40 map:
1 BB, 1 CV, 1 CA, 1 DD, 1 AP, 1 SS, 1 Fighter, 1 Tactical bomber, 1 Bomber, 1 Tank, 1 ArtillerySoviet Union: ( global)
Amur: 6 infantry, 2 artillery, 2 Mechanized, 1 Tank, 1 Fighter
Sea Zone 5: 1 Submarine, 1 TransportNote: i have not yet fixed the Factories, naval ports or air bases
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