LHTR: Larry Harris Tournament Rules

[Jennifer]

@tekkyy:

you should be able to right?

switch’s quote lets you move fighters to a sea zone adjacent to an industrial complex you own and that you are going to place a new carrier there

so for a44bigdog’s “existing fighters in the same territory as the IC” (or anywhere for that matter) can just move to the LHTR’s “sea zone adjacent to an industrial complex you own” ?

Assuming they have enough movement points to get to the sea zone, then yes.

[axis_roll]

It must be a non-contested sea zone (i.e. no enemy ships except for submerged subs) since you can not end your non-combat move anywhere that would result in combat.

[Jennifer]

Yea, I don’t like the idea of letting the enemy build in contested sea zones either for that matter.  If you cannot land your planes there, then you shouldnt be able to build your carriers there either.

[tekkyy]

@Cmdr:

Yea, I don’t like the idea of letting the enemy build in contested sea zones either for that matter.  If you cannot land your planes there, then you shouldnt be able to build your carriers there either.

yeah thats a funny situation in terms of logics

and then theres the two opposing ICs building into the same sea zone
“first come last served”

[Jennifer]

I believe the idea was that you declare that you are building in that round and to prevent units from being “lost” without entering combat they allowed you to build in contested sea zones.

Honestly, I don’t like it.  I understand it.  I just don’t like it.  Then again, since when do I get everything I like???  Not like you all have declared me Empress of the Universe for Life yet!

[Krieghund]

@Cmdr:

I believe the idea was that you declare that you are building in that round and to prevent units from being “lost” without entering combat they allowed you to build in contested sea zones.

Honestly, I don’t like it.  I understand it.  I just don’t like it.

The alternative is to allow subs to completely bottle up naval production at an IC for as long as they can manage to avoid air strikes and submerge.  Not very appealing.

@Cmdr:

Not like you all have declared me Empress of the Universe for Life yet!

I didn’t even know you were running for the office!

[Romulus]

Canal Question.

From LHTR 2.0 (page 6):

Canals

There are two canals on the game board, artificial waterways that connect two larger bodies of
water. The Panama Canal connects the Pacific Ocean (sea zone 20) to the Atlantic Ocean (sea
zone 19), while the Suez Canal connects the Mediterranean Sea (sea zone 15) to the Indian Ocean
(sea zone 34). A canal is not considered a space, so it doesn’t block land movement: Land units
can move freely between Trans-Jordan and Anglo-Egypt. Panama is one territory: no land
movement points are required to cross the canal within Panama.

If you want to move sea units through a canal, your side (but not necessarily your power) must
control it at the start of your turn (that is, you can’t use it the turn you capture it). The side that
controls Panama controls the Panama Canal. The side that controls both Anglo-Egypt and Trans-
Jordan controls the Suez Canal. If one side controls Anglo-Egypt and the other controls Trans-
Jordan, the Suez is closed to sea units.

What about air units? Tey are not directly addressed in the rule.
If a fighter is in sea zone 15 (Mediterranean) and wants to go in sea zone 34 (Indian Ocean) is it allowed to use the canal passing directly from sea zone 15 to sea zone 34? (As if it was a sea unit)
This move makes sense to me considering that the “canal is not considered a space, so it doesn’t block land movement”. So the aircraft should go through the canal? Is this correct? Or the fighter have to pass through Egypt or Trans-Jordan?

I have always moved the aircrafts in this way… but I am having the doubt if this is really correct!

[Krieghund]

Just as ships do, air units use only one movement point to move from a sea zone on one side of a canal to one on the other side of it.  As you said, this makes sense.

[Romulus]

Thanks Krieghund! As said I have always moved the air units in such way. In recent play, however, I became to have a doubt if my interpretation was correct.

[sharps54]

I am new to the revised version of the game (used to play a lot in the 90’s) and have just discoverd the LHTR rule set. I have a 2 questions about the 2.0 ruleset.

1. In Appendix II B. Phase 4. Part 1. page 33 (from the PDF on this site) it has the defending US sub submerge while an enemy destroyer is still in the fight, is this just a mistake? If not I don’t understand how the US sub can submerge.

2. Also about subs, if the German sub in SZ 8 doesn’t move during G1 then there is no way the British transport from SZ 2 can conduct an amphibious assault on Algeria correct? Where I am getting confused is that the rules say

If any submarine submerges, it is returned to the game board, and is placed on its side to indicate it is submerged. It remains submerged until the end of the noncombat move phase. The submarine then resurfaces regardless of whether enemy units are still there; this does not trigger combat. The presence of a submerged submarine does not make a sea zone hostile, so enemy sea units may move freely into or through any sea zone containing a submerged submarines, and enemy transports may load or offload there.

If a fighter attacked the German sub in SZ 8 in UK1 and it submerged the battleship and transport from SZ 2 could move off the coast of Algeria (SZ 12) but only during the noncombat phase, do I have that right?

If so the British attack on Algeria on UK1 (assuming the German sub is left in SZ 8 at the end of G1) looks like this:
Combat move:
A fighter from the UK attacks the German sub in SZ 8 to make it submerge or destroy it. At the same time the Eastern Canada transport takes the tank and amphibious assaults Algeria (I guess with the UK bomber and the AE fighter if it somehow survived)
IF that works
NonCombat move:
Transport off UK (SZ 2) takes units from UK to the newly conquered Algeria?

The reason I ask is it seems the sub is a small sacrifice for Germany to stop a British amphibious assault of Algeria during UK1.

Thanks for fielding my rookie questions!
Jason

ETA one more question, under Industrial Complexes it says:

Usable by Invading Forces: If a territory is captured, an industrial complex there is also
captured. The capturing player can use it on the turn after it is captured. Industrial complexes are
never destroyed. You cannot place your new units at an industrial complex owned by a friendly
power, unless its capital is in enemy hands. Even if you liberate a territory with an industrial
complex in it, you cannot use the complex; the original controller can use it on his or her next
turn.

This is a little confusing, so if Britian builds a complex in South Africa, Germany takes England, now that England is occupied the US can build at England’s South Africa complex?

[Krieghund]

@sharps54:

1. In Appendix II B. Phase 4. Part 1. page 33 (from the PDF on this site) it has the defending US sub submerge while an enemy destroyer is still in the fight, is this just a mistake? If not I don’t understand how the US sub can submerge.

Yup, it’s a mistake.

@sharps54:

2. Also about subs, if the German sub in SZ 8 doesn’t move during G1 then there is no way the British transport from SZ 2 can conduct an amphibious assault on Algeria correct?

Correct.

@sharps54:

Where I am getting confused is that the rules say

If any submarine submerges, it is returned to the game board, and is placed on its side to indicate it is submerged. It remains submerged until the end of the noncombat move phase. The submarine then resurfaces regardless of whether enemy units are still there; this does not trigger combat. The presence of a submerged submarine does not make a sea zone hostile, so enemy sea units may move freely into or through any sea zone containing a submerged submarines, and enemy transports may load or offload there.

If a fighter attacked the German sub in SZ 8 in UK1 and it submerged the battleship and transport from SZ 2 could move off the coast of Algeria (SZ 12) but only during the noncombat phase, do I have that right?

Yes.

@sharps54:

If so the British attack on Algeria on UK1 (assuming the German sub is left in SZ 8 at the end of G1) looks like this:
Combat move:
A fighter from the UK attacks the German sub in SZ 8 to make it submerge or destroy it. At the same time the Eastern Canada transport takes the tank and amphibious assaults Algeria (I guess with the UK bomber and the AE fighter if it somehow survived)
IF that works
NonCombat move:
Transport off UK (SZ 2) takes units from UK to the newly conquered Algeria?

That works.

@sharps54:

ETA one more question, under Industrial Complexes it says:

Usable by Invading Forces: If a territory is captured, an industrial complex there is also
captured. The capturing player can use it on the turn after it is captured. Industrial complexes are
never destroyed. You cannot place your new units at an industrial complex owned by a friendly
power, unless its capital is in enemy hands. Even if you liberate a territory with an industrial
complex in it, you cannot use the complex; the original controller can use it on his or her next
turn.

This is a little confusing, so if Britian builds a complex in South Africa, Germany takes England, now that England is occupied the US can build at England’s South Africa complex?

Not exactly.  If South Africa was also in Axis hands, then the US liberated it while the United Kingdom was still under Axis control, the US would gain control of South Africa rather than handing it back to the UK.  Under these circumstances, the US could use the IC.  However, as soon as the United Kingdom was liberated, South Africa and its IC would revert to UK control, so the US would no longer be able to use it.

[sharps54]

Thanks for the clarification!
Jason

[planetside]

Hi, just got the game and found the rulebook to be quite confusing so I began poking around various fansites and found the LHTR 2.0 which I found much less confusing.  However there were still a couple of this I wasn’t 100% sure on.

1. Can you unload an anti-aircraft gun on amphibious assualt provided that it was loaded in the non combat move of a previous turn?
Assuming you can’t and it has to unload next turn during non combat move provided the amphibious assault wa succesful.

2. On p 21 it states

Transports can move to friendly coastal territories and load or offload cargo, unless they loaded,
moved or offloaded during the combat move or combat phase.

Therefore can transports unload/load after combat but have not moved during combat phase (LHTR only?) e.g. after the scenario above, britain waits its next turn so it may unload its AA gun.
a. Germany attacks the transport, it misses and decides to submerge

b. Britain elects to stay in zone with subs and fights them on their turn winning the battle, may they now unload or load units to/from friendly territory in non combat move and thus be able to unload that AA gun.

Cheers.

[Hobbes]

@planetside:

1. Can you unload an anti-aircraft gun on amphibious assualt provided that it was loaded in the non combat move of a previous turn?
Assuming you can’t and it has to unload next turn during non combat move provided the amphibious assault wa succesful.

No. AA Guns can only move during non-combat.

If the transport participated on the amphibious landing then the AA Gun would be left in the transport since a transport loads/moves/offloads in either combat or non-combat move phases. It can’t do actions on both phases like offloading both in combat and in non-combat movement. This has to do with your next question.

2. On p 21 it states

Transports can move to friendly coastal territories and load or offload cargo, unless they loaded, moved or offloaded during the combat move or combat phase.
Therefore can transports unload/load after combat but have not moved during combat phase (LHTR only?) e.g. after the scenario above, britain waits its next turn so it may unload its AA gun.
a. Germany attacks the transport, it misses and decides to submerge

b. Britain elects to stay in zone with subs and fights them on their turn winning the battle, may they now unload or load units to/from friendly territory in non combat move and thus be able to unload that AA gun.

Cheers.

Yes. The transport would have to wait until the next UK non-combat phase to unload the AA Gun, assuming it survives a German attack.

[planetside]

Thanks for the answers.  Just to clarify:

Yes. The transport would have to wait until the next UK non-combat phase to unload the AA Gun, assuming it survives a German attack.

In that scenario, the transport would be able to do the non-combat unload in the same turn as the conduct of combat?

[Krieghund]

No, it would not.  Participation in combat prevents unloading in the noncombat movement phase.

[von Jelen]

Hello, this is my first post on aa forum.

Q:
What happens when for example:

Germany takes Moscow and lose Berlin same turn. So only Japan stays, dose Japan has right to use factory in Moscow? Or it must wait for allies to take Moscow back and then try to take it (assuming that Japan wants to take it)?

Can airplanes attack subs, and if do why sub can not fight back?

[jsp4563]

Japan will have to wait for the allies to liberate Moscow and then capture it before it can be used by Japan.

Fighters can only attack subs if a Destroyer is present.  Subs can never hit aircraft so any hits by the subs would go against the Destroyer(s) or any other naval vessels present.  If attacking a combined fleet Subs and Surface ships\CV aircraft with only air power, the subs do not participate and can’t be taken as casualties.

[Krieghund]

@Emperor:

Japan will have to wait for the allies to liberate Moscow and then capture it before it can be used by Japan.

Correct.

@Emperor:

Fighters can only attack subs if a Destroyer is present.  If attacking a combined fleet Subs and Surface ships\CV aircraft with only air power, the subs do not participate and can’t be taken as casualties.

Sorry, but this is incorrect.  In LHTR, air units can always hit subs.

@Emperor:

Subs can never hit aircraft so any hits by the subs would go against the Destroyer(s) or any other naval vessels present.

Correct.

[von Jelen]

Thanks guys.

In my opinion if Japan army enters occupied Moscow, after fall of Berlin it should get Moscow resource.