Warship defender retreat

[General 6 Stars]

I havent tried it but how about all enemy ships can share the same sea zone without going into combat and then on attackers turn decides not to attack, they just stay there and on defenders turn they can decide to attack or stay or leave sea zone. When the sides do attack, either side can retreat ( withdraw ) but can stay and share the same sea zone due to the size of the water zone. Transports can’t unload.

[crusaderiv]

Well, I’m not a big fan to put everything in the same zone. It’s kinda free for all….
I thinking about to give the retreat for the defender warship only if there’s no plane involved in the combat.
Or only to the small and fast ships like destroyer,cruiser and carrier. (Battleship was slow).

[Razor]

Well, in the classic edition it was not allowed to share seazones, so if UK put a sub in the Med and another one in the North Sea, then Germany was denied building ships for the rest of that game. Not a fun rule. Ships must be allowed to share seazones in some way. Maybe a search roll like they have in other games. A seazone is always neutral, its not contestet, hostile nor friendly, just neutral. And if you want to attack other ships in that specific seazone, you will have to roll a search dice. Of course the other guy can roll a dice too, and if he win the search then he can sail away and escape battle.

As for defenders retreat, yes. The retreat is a battle tactic that armies and fleets use to get out of harms way so they can fight another day. In Russia they even scorch the earth when retreating, so the attacking Huns will not find food there. And for the naval battle, that is true maneuver warfare, ships don’t really retreat they just sail to a better position, in order to make the big T. In game terms, that is another seazone.

[General 6 Stars]

Well, in our games you have to send out a sea plane first to find enemy fleet and on a die roll of 3 or less you have found fleet. Then you can attack. You could have it were attacking fleet moves into defenders seazone, have 1 round of combat and then attacker and or defender can withdraw but stay in same seazone or can retreat to different seazone, but on defenders turn ( only if they  withdraw) they have to either attack or move on there turn. Still gives the attacker some advantage for attacking defender while defender withdrew but didn`t retreat.

[knp7765]

@SS:

Well, in our games you have to send out a sea plane first to find enemy fleet and on a die roll of 3 or less you have found fleet. Then you can attack. You could have it were attacking fleet moves into defenders seazone, have 1 round of combat and then attacker and or defender can withdraw but stay in same seazone or can retreat to different seazone, but on defenders turn ( only if they  withdraw) they have to either attack or move on there turn. Still gives the attacker some advantage for attacking defender while defender withdrew but didn`t retreat.

How does that work with Amphibious Assaults? Do you allow them to happen even with an enemy fleet still in that sea zone?

Hey Razor,
So you couldn’t mobilize new ships if there was an enemy ship in your sea zone in Classic? I thought you could always do that. Then again, planes could wipe out subs because there were no destroyers then so just putting a sub there wouldn’t end naval builds. You could send your planes out to blast that sub then put your ships down in the Mobilize Units phase.

[Razor]

@knp7765:

How does that work with Amphibious Assaults? Do you allow them to happen even with an enemy fleet still in that sea zone?

That is a good question.

During Dday I think Germany had 9 subs in the English Channel, but they did not stall the landing. During the UK landing in Narvik 1940, the Germans had 4 subs in the same sezone but they did not stall that landing. At the US landing in Leyte oct 1944 the Japanese navy was in the adjacent seazone at the start, but attacked the landing ships with aircrafts, kamikazes and ships the day after, and before all troops had time to finish debarking the ships. If the Japanese attack had been successful, then the US infantry would have died when the trannies sunk. So how to model this in a game. Also people tell me that Adolf did not dare landing in UK in 1940, even if the British army was scattered in France, just because he was afraid that the UK navy, who at that time was two seazones away, would visit the landing site and sink all the german trannies, putting the germans in UK out of supply.

So you tell me

[General 6 Stars]

Well, in our games you have to send out a sea plane first to find enemy fleet and on a die roll of 3 or less you have found fleet. Then you can attack.

This is what we use in are games.

You could have it were attacking fleet moves into defenders seazone, have 1 round of combat and then attacker and or defender can withdraw but stay in same seazone or can retreat to different seazone, but on defenders turn ( only if they  withdraw) they have to either attack or move on there turn. Still gives the attacker some advantage for attacking defender while defender withdrew but didn`t retreat.

This quote above was just a suggestion.

If you wanted to do a Amphibious Assault you have to fight the battle until you win.

[crusaderiv]

In our game,sub and transport didn’t have zone of control. So you can have a thousand of sub of different countries…It’s doesn’t matter…
But yes you have to sink ennemy warship before to make an amphibious assault.
I think warship must have zone of control.

And for the naval battle, that is true maneuver warfare, ships don’t really retreat they just sail to a better position, in order to make the big T. In game terms, that is another seazone.

You got a point but we saw a lot of naval retreat during WWII.

[Flashman]

I believe that attacking ships should have the option of retreating even if they destoy all the defending fleet.

It seems unfair that they have to remain there, possibly sitting ducks for enemy aircraft, as a punishment for winning the battle. Its not as if they have to stay in the target zone to “take control”, so shouldn’t they be permitted to return whence they came in order to repair and be reinforced by new builds?

Enable this, and it would be fair to allow defending fleets to retreat, certainly if they could move to a friendly NB by doing so.

[crusaderiv]

I agree with you Flashman.
The ‘‘sea zone control rules’’ appears in the first A&A game and apparently no one try to introduce a new rule.

I believe that attacking ships should have the option of retreating even if they destoy all the defending fleet.
Yes but not if the ships used all their limit of movement.