Tutor game: trulpen (X) vs Avner [and everyone else] (A+23) BM3

[FlyingBadger]

@avner said in Tutor game: trulpen (X) vs Avner [and everyone else] (A+23) BM3:

@flyingbadger

in fact I was thinking of a strafing but perhaps it is better to go all the way … for the reasons you write

Maybe the strafe would be better, either way I guess it’s an attack with 12 Infantry and the fighter. Not sure where the best place to retreat to is. Am I right in thinking the Russian fast movers can’t yet move into China to help protect the fighter?

[surfer]

@flyingbadger @Avner I would just get Yunnan for the NO, sit back and keep hitting at Yunnan each turn until J drives you off. China is always just a road block, but keeping him around is a good thing. Prevents J from just rolling forces towards India.

If you keep China in play for 2-3 turns, then everyone else can show up and change the game. There is no winning the game for the Allies early, just keep your forces active.

[surfer]

A 50/50 attack is not necessarily a bad thing because the attacker can retreat if things go bad. But in this case, you are likely only trading inf for inf and probably at a loss.

Strafe is possible if you want to try and get lucky, but any battle is negative TUV. But to press, get lucky and take Kweichow is just asking to be annihilated by the stack at Anwhe.

The Chinese are just better defenders. They pick off the lone Japanese units that have to spread out to maintain control of China. That’s their role in the land war, so be happy with it.

[Avner]

I’ve thought about it

so i guess i will take yunnan for NO and stay where i am (i will consider whether to help with russians depending on what german will do)

[Avner]

TripleA Manual Gamesave Post: Chinese round 2

TripleA Manual Gamesave Post for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 4.1.0

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Chinese
        Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
        Chinese buy 4 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Chinese
        3 infantry moved from Szechwan to Yunnan
        1 fighter moved from Szechwan to Yunnan

    Combat - Chinese
        Battle in Yunnan
            Chinese attack with 1 fighter and 3 infantry
            Japanese defend with 2 infantry
                Chinese roll dice for 1 fighter and 3 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 2/4 hits, 1,00 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 2 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 2/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                2 infantry owned by the Japanese and 2 infantry owned by the Chinese lost in Yunnan
            Chinese win, taking Yunnan from Japanese with 1 fighter and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for Chinese: 2 infantry
            Casualties for Japanese: 2 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Chinese
        1 fighter moved from Yunnan to Szechwan
        2 infantry moved from Shensi to Szechwan

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Chinese regular : 1,00
Japanese regular : 1,33

Savegame

[Avner]

Staying in Szechwan, however, even with the Russians helping, could mean China out of the game in the third round…

Reattaching yunnan I don’t think is possible… retreat to Sikang?

[FlyingBadger]

@avner said in Tutor game: trulpen (X) vs Avner [and everyone else] (A+23) BM3:

Staying in Szechwan, however, even with the Russians helping, could mean China out of the game in the third round…

Reattaching yunnan I don’t think is possible… retreat to Sikang?

If the primary goal is to stay alive then Sikang is the only realistic option I think, anywhere else and Japan can wipe out China next turn and then move onto India. If China can give India an extra turn, maybe India can give Sydney and Hawaii two extra turns to build up and hold onto the last Pacific VC.

[Avner]

TripleA Turn Summary: Chinese round 2

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 4.1.0

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Chinese
        Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
        Chinese buy 4 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Chinese
        3 infantry moved from Szechwan to Yunnan
        1 fighter moved from Szechwan to Yunnan

    Combat - Chinese
        Battle in Yunnan
            Chinese attack with 1 fighter and 3 infantry
            Japanese defend with 2 infantry
                Chinese roll dice for 1 fighter and 3 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 2/4 hits, 1,00 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 2 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 2/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                2 infantry owned by the Japanese and 2 infantry owned by the Chinese lost in Yunnan
            Chinese win, taking Yunnan from Japanese with 1 fighter and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for Chinese: 2 infantry
            Casualties for Japanese: 2 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Chinese
        7 infantry moved from Szechwan to Sikang
        2 infantry moved from Shensi to Sikang
        1 fighter moved from Yunnan to Sikang

    Place Units - Chinese
        4 infantry placed in Sikang

    Turn Complete - Chinese
        Chinese collect 6 PUs; end with 6 PUs
        Objective Chinese 1 Burma Road: Chinese met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 9 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Chinese regular : 1,00
Japanese regular : 1,33

Savegame

[Avner]

TripleA Manual Gamesave Post: British round 2

TripleA Manual Gamesave Post for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 4.1.0

Game History

Round: 2

    Politics - British
        British takes Political Action: Political Action British To War With Japanese
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Japanese and British from Neutrality to Unprovoked
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Japanese and UK_Pacific from Neutrality to Unprovoked
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Japanese and ANZAC from Neutrality to Unprovoked
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Dutch from Neutrality to War
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Chinese and British from Neutrality to Allied
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Chinese and UK_Pacific from Concordant to Allied
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Chinese and ANZAC from Neutrality to Allied
            British succeeds on action: Political Action British To War With Japanese: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly

    Combat Move - British
        1 tactical_bomber moved from Burma to 41 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Burma to 41 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Burma to 41 Sea Zone
        1 destroyer moved from 39 Sea Zone to 41 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Shan State to Siam
              UK_Pacific take Siam from Japanese
        3 infantry moved from Persia to Iraq
        1 transport moved from 80 Sea Zone to 76 Sea Zone
        1 armour moved from Ethiopia to 76 Sea Zone
        1 artillery moved from Ethiopia to 76 Sea Zone
        1 cruiser moved from 76 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 armour and 1 transport moved from 76 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 transport moved from 76 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 battleship moved from 39 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 artillery moved from 80 Sea Zone to Iraq
        1 armour moved from 80 Sea Zone to Iraq
        1 bomber moved from Malta to Iraq

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Savegame

[Avner]

DOW on japan i think obliged…

We keep egypt (even with the planes from malta) and we prepare the hunt for u-boats in the atlantic…

I do not think we can do anything else.

[trulpen]

@avner said in Tutor game: trulpen (X) vs Avner [and everyone else] (A+23) BM3:

DOW on japan i think obliged…

It’s always itching, but I try to abstain from making comments on moves under progress. In this particular instance, without having looked freshly at the map, I atleast should advice on thinking twice about a DOW.

In some special cases it might be a great move, but usually it’s not. The main problem is allowing Japan to slug it out on the small allies without dragging US into the war. Also, US won’t be able to make any significant movement until US4, since they only will join the war during their economic phase in US3.

Anyway, this is just some general pointers. Consider the options and consequences and all will be well. :)

[trulpen]

I’m glad the game attracts some more attention, getting discussions going. Pretty fun and interesting.

[Avner]

It is an evaluation that I have to make … because of the ON still available (UK and ANZAC).

They won’t be in the next round I guess …

[surfer]

@avner I would agree with @trulpen … DOW is a bad idea in this case.
All we are killing is a sub. Need to get transports or at least prevent transports from loading…This does neither

Also, if you were going to DOW, I would expect to stack Yunnan so that China can grow to help with artillery, but they are in Sikang–which is actually a good move–live to fight another day. Provided that you don’t DOW.

We have to let Japan have its time in the sun early. I’ve seen this Japanese opening several times now, and it is quite impressive. But Japan can’t cover everything after Turn 5 and up without a lot of things to go their way, as long as the US is there to threaten along with all the other forces. That’s what we delay to fight for.

Also, an early DOW is an open door for Japan to takeout Australia.

[surfer]

As far as a suggestion for the Brit move,
I would only move the tank to Iraq. Load one of the inf in Persia onto tranny so that you can bombard with cruiser + BB. Still a 99% battle
Take Italian somaliland with art, move SA mech to Belgium Congo and move 2 inf up to Tanganyika Terr to trap the Italian inf. You will get to take Madagascar next turn that way with one of the inf and get use out of the transport in Persia that would be coming back.

The other transport should goto SA. Change the buy to 1inf + 1 art and save $1 or upgrade ftr to tac if you have a good use for it. Probably best at this time to think defensive and get ftr.

I assuming you plan on putting the Home Fleet in Nova Scotia with newly minted DD. 2SS attack would be a loser. That fleet will be able to advance with the US and start removing the German subs and take N. Africa.

I would stack Burma, but need to leave 1 aa + 1 ftr + 1 tac+ 1 tank + 1 mech in India to prevent Java fleet from invading. This is a risk.
The remaining forces could be eliminated by a full J crush on Burma, but would likely lose 8 units (could all be ground), but then would have nothing to invade with, and it’s a long road back to Japan to get reinforcements. And all he is killing is a bunch of inf + 1 ftr. He would not have any DEI or hurt China. I would take that trade.

I’d also leave the 3 inf in Shan State. Again he could engage with 2 inf from FIC + air to eliminate, but it will slow him down elsewhere. This one I’m not as confident with, and they could just fall back to Burma, making that stack even stronger a less likely to be attacked. The advantage is that you get to counter punch Malaya which is annoying for Japan as it prevents the movement boost.
Just not sure it’s worth 3 guys.

[Avner]

the DOW was not to lose the ON when Japan opens the dance … but in fact, reflecting well, it is not worth it.

I also study suggestions for Africa

[trulpen]

@avner said in Tutor game: trulpen (X) vs Avner [and everyone else] (A+23) BM3:

the DOW was not to lose the ON when Japan opens the dance … but in fact, reflecting well, it is not worth it.

I also study suggestions for Africa

I think that’s 12 IPC of NOs (3 no sub, 3 Kwangtung/Malaya + 3 Malaya and 3 DNG) and then perhaps some more income from grabbing islands. Still not worth the strategic drawbacks.

[Avner]

TripleA Turn Summary: UK_Pacific round 2

TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 Balanced Mod3, version: 4.1.0

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Americans
        Americans buy 1 carrier, 2 destroyers, 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 transport; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Americans

    Non Combat Move - Americans
        1 artillery moved from Hawaiian Islands to 26 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Hawaiian Islands to 26 Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 1 battleship, 1 carrier, 2 cruisers, 2 destroyers, 1 fighter, 1 infantry, 1 submarine, 1 tactical_bomber and 1 transport moved from 26 Sea Zone to 54 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone
        1 mech_infantry moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone
        2 carriers, 1 infantry, 1 mech_infantry, 1 submarine and 1 transport moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands
        1 mech_infantry moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands
        1 mech_infantry moved from Central United States to Western United States
        1 armour moved from Central United States to Western United States
        1 mech_infantry moved from Central United States to Western United States
        1 fighter moved from Guam to 26 Sea Zone

    Place Units - Americans
        1 carrier and 1 destroyer placed in 10 Sea Zone
        1 destroyer and 1 transport placed in 101 Sea Zone
        1 infantry placed in Western United States
        Americans undo move 3.
        1 fighter placed in Western United States
        1 infantry placed in Central United States

    Turn Complete - Americans
        Americans collect 52 PUs; end with 52 PUs

    Purchase Units - Chinese
        Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
        Chinese buy 4 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Chinese
        3 infantry moved from Szechwan to Yunnan
        1 fighter moved from Szechwan to Yunnan

    Combat - Chinese
        Battle in Yunnan
            Chinese attack with 1 fighter and 3 infantry
            Japanese defend with 2 infantry
                Chinese roll dice for 1 fighter and 3 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 2/4 hits, 1,00 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 2 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 2/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                2 infantry owned by the Japanese and 2 infantry owned by the Chinese lost in Yunnan
            Chinese win, taking Yunnan from Japanese with 1 fighter and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for Chinese: 2 infantry
            Casualties for Japanese: 2 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Chinese
        7 infantry moved from Szechwan to Sikang
        2 infantry moved from Shensi to Sikang
        1 fighter moved from Yunnan to Sikang

    Place Units - Chinese
        4 infantry placed in Sikang

    Turn Complete - Chinese
        Chinese collect 6 PUs; end with 6 PUs
        Objective Chinese 1 Burma Road: Chinese met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 9 PUs

    Purchase Units - British
        British buy 1 artillery, 1 destroyer, 1 fighter and 4 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Purchase Units - UK_Pacific
        UK_Pacific buy 1 artillery, 3 infantry and 1 mech_infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
        1 cruiser moved from 76 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 battleship moved from 39 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 artillery moved from Ethiopia to Italian Somaliland
              British take Italian Somaliland from Italians
        1 bomber moved from Malta to Iraq
        1 transport moved from 80 Sea Zone to 76 Sea Zone
        1 armour moved from Ethiopia to 76 Sea Zone
        1 armour and 1 transport moved from 76 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Persia to 80 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from 80 Sea Zone to Iraq
        1 armour moved from 80 Sea Zone to Iraq
        1 infantry moved from Persia to Iraq
        1 infantry moved from Persia to Iraq

    Combat - British
        Battle in Iraq
            British attack with 1 armour, 1 bomber and 3 infantry
            Neutral_Axis defend with 3 infantry
                British roll dice for 1 battleship and 1 cruiser in Iraq, round 2 : 2/2 hits, 1,17 expected hits
                British roll dice for 1 armour, 1 bomber and 3 infantry in Iraq, round 2 : 2/5 hits, 1,67 expected hits
                Neutral_Axis roll dice for 3 infantry in Iraq, round 2 : 2/3 hits, 1,00 expected hits
                3 infantry owned by the Neutral_Axis and 2 infantry owned by the British lost in Iraq
            British win, taking Iraq from Neutral_Axis with 1 armour, 1 bomber and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for British: 2 infantry
            Casualties for Neutral_Axis: 3 infantry

    Non Combat Move - British
        1 bomber moved from Iraq to Egypt
        1 tactical_bomber moved from Malta to Egypt
        1 fighter moved from Malta to Egypt
        1 fighter moved from Malta to Egypt
        1 transport moved from 76 Sea Zone to 71 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Rhodesia to Tanganyika Territory
        1 infantry moved from Rhodesia to Tanganyika Territory
        1 mech_infantry moved from Union of South Africa to Belgian Congo
        1 mech_infantry moved from Eire to United Kingdom
        1 battleship, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer and 1 transport moved from 123 Sea Zone to 106 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Iceland to United Kingdom
        1 fighter moved from Iceland to United Kingdom
        1 destroyer moved from 76 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 destroyer moved from 39 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
        3 infantry moved from Shan State to Burma
        1 artillery moved from India to Burma
        1 infantry moved from India to Burma
        1 fighter moved from Burma to India
        1 aaGun moved from Burma to India
        1 tactical_bomber moved from Burma to India
        1 artillery moved from Ontario to Quebec
        1 infantry moved from Ontario to Quebec

    Place Units - British
        3 infantry placed in Egypt
        1 artillery and 1 infantry placed in Union of South Africa
        1 destroyer placed in 106 Sea Zone
        1 fighter placed in United Kingdom

    Turn Complete - British
        British collect 32 PUs; end with 33 PUs
        Objective British 4 Control Convoy Lanes: British met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 36 PUs

    Place Units - UK_Pacific
        1 artillery, 3 infantry and 1 mech_infantry placed in India

    Turn Complete - UK_Pacific
        UK_Pacific collect 17 PUs; end with 17 PUs
        Some Units in India change ownership: 1 artillery, 3 infantry and 1 mech_infantry

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Chinese regular : 1,00
Japanese regular : 1,33
Neutral_Axis regular : 1,00
British regular : 1,17

Savegame

[Avner]

I made some changes but I think it can go

[surfer]

@avner Why block with DD SZ37? Seems like waste of DD. J can take Sumatra from Java. And the DD doesn’t prevent any transports from the other territories.

It does block J from invading Burma, but that is a low payoff attack as the Brits can eliminate any ground units on the counter, and then J has nothing to take India with.