BotA Rd 3 (270 BC): P@anther (Rome) vs. AlexGreat (Macedonia and Co)

[lexgreat]

Seleucia is one tough nation to play….

[Panther]

The hole game seems to be tough to play IMHO.
I’m feeling quite uncomfortable and think to have a wrong strategy.
But it’s too late to change it, let’s see how this continues…

[Panther]

Ups… please add a “w” to the “hole”.
blush

[lexgreat]

so we both hold a bleak outlook for ourselves :)

[lexgreat]

my bad feeling is based on losing 17 macedonian units in rd1, all to neutrals. all attacks were reasonably supported. pls, after the game, give me your opinion on strategy. its never rolls alone, normally.

[Panther]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: 270BC, version: 1.1.2

Game History

Round :3

Purchase Units - Parthia
            Parthia buy 10 cavalrys and 1 horsearcher; Remaining resources: 2 PUs;

Combat Move - Parthia
            8 archers, 6 cataphracts, 2 cavalrys, 6 horsearchers and 21 spearmen moved from Seleucia to Hatra
            5 horsearchers moved from Persepolis to Hatra

Combat - Parthia
            Battle in Hatra
                Parthia attack with 8 archers, 6 cataphracts, 2 cavalrys, 11 horsearchers and 21 spearmen
                Seleucid defend with 4 cataphracts, 3 cavalrys, 1 city, 17 hoplites, 3 legionaires and 9 peltastss
                    Parthia roll dice for 8 archers, 6 cataphracts, 2 cavalrys, 11 horsearchers and 21 spearmen in Hatra, round 1 :  12/48 hits
                    Seleucid roll dice for 4 cataphracts, 3 cavalrys, 17 hoplites, 3 legionaires and 9 peltastss in Hatra, round 1 :  15/36 hits
                    3 cavalrys owned by the Seleucid , 15 spearmen owned by the Parthia and 9 peltastss owned by the Seleucid lost in Hatra
                    Parthia roll dice for 8 archers, 6 cataphracts, 2 cavalrys, 11 horsearchers and 6 spearmen in Hatra, round 2 :  12/33 hits
                    Seleucid roll dice for 4 cataphracts, 17 hoplites and 3 legionaires in Hatra, round 2 :  10/24 hits
                    9 hoplites owned by the Seleucid , 6 spearmen owned by the Parthia , 3 legionaires owned by the Seleucid and 4 archers owned by the Parthia lost in Hatra
                    Parthia roll dice for 4 archers, 6 cataphracts, 2 cavalrys and 11 horsearchers in Hatra, round 3 :  6/23 hits
                    Seleucid roll dice for 4 cataphracts and 8 hoplites in Hatra, round 3 :  9/12 hits
                    6 hoplites owned by the Seleucid , 2 cavalrys owned by the Parthia , 4 archers owned by the Parthia and 3 horsearchers owned by the Parthia lost in Hatra
                    Parthia roll dice for 6 cataphracts and 8 horsearchers in Hatra, round 4 :  7/14 hits
                    Seleucid roll dice for 4 cataphracts and 2 hoplites in Hatra, round 4 :  1/6 hits
                    2 hoplites owned by the Seleucid , 4 cataphracts owned by the Seleucid and 1 horsearcher owned by the Parthia lost in Hatra
                Parthia win, taking Hatra from Seleucid with 6 cataphracts and 7 horsearchers remaining. Battle score for attacker is 28
                Casualties for Seleucid: 4 cataphracts, 3 cavalrys, 17 hoplites, 3 legionaires and 9 peltastss
                Casualties for Parthia: 8 archers, 2 cavalrys, 4 horsearchers and 21 spearmen

Non Combat Move - Parthia
            1 spearman moved from Babylon to Seleucia
            1 spearman moved from Persepolis to Babylon

Place Units - Parthia
            10 cavalrys placed in Seleucia
            1 horsearcher placed in Persepolis

Turn Complete - Parthia
            Parthia collect 53 PUs; end with 55 PUs total

Territory Summary for Parthia :

Babylon : 1 flag, 1 spearman
    SZ 86 : 1 flag, 1 bireme
    Hatra : 1 flag, 6 cataphracts, 1 city and 7 horsearchers
    Seleucia : 1 flag, 10 cavalrys, 1 city and 1 spearman
    Persepolis : 1 flag, 1 city and 1 horsearcher

Production/PUs Summary :

Carthage : 65 / 69
    RomanRepublic : 61 / 61
    GreekCityStates : 32 / 38
    Macedonia : 47 / 47
    Egypt : 41 / 41
    Seleucid : 39 / 44
    Parthia : 53 / 55
    Numidia : 27 / 27

Dice Statistics:

Total
            1 was rolled 31 times
            2 was rolled 35 times
            3 was rolled 28 times
            4 was rolled 35 times
            5 was rolled 33 times
            6 was rolled 34 times
        Average roll : 3,541
        Median : 4,000
        Variance : 0,205
        Standard Deviation : 0,453
        Total rolls : 196

Seleucid Combat
            1 was rolled 15 times
            2 was rolled 14 times
            3 was rolled 8 times
            4 was rolled 13 times
            5 was rolled 12 times
            6 was rolled 16 times
        Average roll : 3,526
        Median : 4,000
        Variance : 0,519
        Standard Deviation : 0,721
        Total rolls : 78

Parthia Combat
            1 was rolled 16 times
            2 was rolled 21 times
            3 was rolled 20 times
            4 was rolled 22 times
            5 was rolled 21 times
            6 was rolled 18 times
        Average roll : 3,551
        Median : 4,000
        Variance : 0,239
        Standard Deviation : 0,489
        Total rolls : 118

[Panther]

@alexgreat:

my bad feeling is based on losing 17 macedonian units in rd1, all to neutrals. all attacks were reasonably supported. pls, after the game, give me your opinion on strategy. its never rolls alone, normally.

Yes, I would like to discuss it, too.

[lexgreat]

what the hell?? I had this battle below 50% for you. I rechecked only to discover that there is one cavalry that can move three…those from your capital I had not considered. may well forfeit game now.

[Panther]

Yes, and considering those it was a 87%-chance.
Your defenders diced not too bad.

[lexgreat]

fail to see the importance of dicing good or bad in this case. even so so many of your horse are left, and this oversight nets you a city as well that I would not have built had i checked the horse archers reach. was not expecting an exception, my bad

[Panther]

I see what you mean. It was actually by chance that I - some moves before - discovered some horse-units having three moves.
To me, who never played anything else then AA50, a few of Spring42 and (twice) Global40 before, it is very hard to

1. distinguish the units
2. know about their characteristics
3. use them in a strategical and tactical way.

So I think this is why we play this tournament.
:-)

[lexgreat]

Whatever the difficulty, I think I had a reasonably fair chance to win, at least not much less than you. You would have had a challenge at hand, but I think you agree with me that it will be impossible to recover. I will follow up with Numidia and Carthage, but then likely surrender. No point to play on after three rounds under a wrong presumption (again, nobodys fault than mine).

[lexgreat]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: 270BC, version: 1.1.2

Game History

Round :3

Purchase Units - Numidia
            Numidia buy 1 bireme and 5 cavalrys; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Numidia
            2 archers, 4 cavalrys and 4 spearmen moved from Paraetonium to Hermopolis
            1 cavalry moved from Siwa to Hermopolis
            1 cavalry moved from Siwa to Hermopolis
            1 spearman moved from Paliurus to Paraetonium
            1 spearman moved from Siwa to Paraetonium
            1 spearman moved from Siwa to Paraetonium
            1 spearman moved from Siwa to Paraetonium
            1 spearman moved from Berenice to Siwa
            1 spearman moved from Berenice to Siwa
            1 cavalry moved from Leptis Magna to Siwa
            1 spearman moved from Leptis Magna to Berenice
            1 spearman moved from Leptis Magna to Berenice
            1 cavalry moved from Oea to Berenice
            1 cavalry moved from Sabrata to Leptis Magna
            1 spearman moved from Sabrata to Oea
            1 spearman moved from Sabrata to Oea
            1 archer and 2 spearmen moved from Thenae to Sabrata
            1 cavalry moved from Zama to Thenae
            1 cavalry moved from Zama to Thenae
            1 cavalry moved from Siga to Tingis
            1 cavalry moved from Siga to Tingis
            1 cavalry moved from Siga to Banasa
            1 cavalry moved from Siga to Tingis
            1 spearman moved from Siga to Banasa
            1 spearman moved from Siga to Banasa
            1 swordman moved from Siga to Banasa
            1 archer and 2 swordmen moved from Siga to Tingis
            1 bireme moved from SZ 31 to SZ 32
            1 bireme moved from SZ 31 to SZ 32

Combat - Numidia
            Battle in Hermopolis
                Numidia attack with 2 archers, 6 cavalrys and 4 spearmen
                Egypt defend with 5 axemen and 5 spearmen
                    Numidia roll dice for 2 archers, 6 cavalrys and 4 spearmen in Hermopolis, round 1 :  4/12 hits
                    Egypt roll dice for 5 axemen and 5 spearmen in Hermopolis, round 1 :  4/10 hits
                    4 spearmen owned by the Numidia and 4 axemen owned by the Egypt lost in Hermopolis
                    Numidia roll dice for 2 archers and 6 cavalrys in Hermopolis, round 2 :  4/8 hits
                    Egypt roll dice for 1 axeman and 5 spearmen in Hermopolis, round 2 :  1/6 hits
                    3 spearmen owned by the Egypt , 1 axeman owned by the Egypt and 1 cavalry owned by the Numidia lost in Hermopolis
                    Numidia roll dice for 2 archers and 5 cavalrys in Hermopolis, round 3 :  2/7 hits
                    Egypt roll dice for 2 spearmen in Hermopolis, round 3 :  2/2 hits
                    2 spearmen owned by the Egypt and 2 cavalrys owned by the Numidia lost in Hermopolis
                Numidia win, taking Hermopolis from Egypt with 2 archers and 3 cavalrys remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
                Casualties for Egypt: 5 axemen and 5 spearmen
                Casualties for Numidia: 3 cavalrys and 4 spearmen
            Battle in Tingis
                Numidia attack with 1 archer, 3 cavalrys and 2 swordmen
                Neutral defend with 1 archer, 2 cavalrys and 1 spearman
                    Numidia roll dice for 1 archer, 3 cavalrys and 2 swordmen in Tingis, round 1 :  4/6 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 1 archer, 2 cavalrys and 1 spearman in Tingis, round 1 :  2/4 hits
                    1 spearman owned by the Neutral , 1 archer owned by the Neutral , 1 swordman owned by the Numidia , 1 archer owned by the Numidia and 2 cavalrys owned by the Neutral lost in Tingis
                Numidia win, taking Tingis from Neutral with 3 cavalrys and 1 swordman remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7
                Casualties for Neutral: 1 archer, 2 cavalrys and 1 spearman
                Casualties for Numidia: 1 archer and 1 swordman
            Battle in Banasa
                Numidia attack with 1 cavalry, 2 spearmen and 1 swordman
                Neutral defend with 1 archer and 1 spearman
                    Numidia roll dice for 1 cavalry, 2 spearmen and 1 swordman in Banasa, round 1 :  0/4 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 1 archer and 1 spearman in Banasa, round 1 :  2/2 hits
                    2 spearmen owned by the Numidia lost in Banasa
                    Numidia roll dice for 1 cavalry and 1 swordman in Banasa, round 2 :  1/2 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 1 archer and 1 spearman in Banasa, round 2 :  2/2 hits
                    1 spearman owned by the Neutral , 1 swordman owned by the Numidia and 1 cavalry owned by the Numidia lost in Banasa
                Neutral win with 1 archer remaining. Battle score for attacker is -11
                Casualties for Neutral: 1 spearman
                Casualties for Numidia: 1 cavalry, 2 spearmen and 1 swordman

Non Combat Move - Numidia

Place Units - Numidia
            1 bireme placed in SZ 52
            3 cavalrys placed in Cyrene
            2 cavalrys placed in Leptis Magna

Turn Complete - Numidia
            Numidia collect 36 PUs; end with 36 PUs total

[lexgreat]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: 270BC, version: 1.1.2

Game History

Round :4

Purchase Units - Carthage
            Carthage buy 2 biremes, 1 hoplite, 2 spearmen, 5 swordmen and 2 triremes; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - Carthage
            1 swordman moved from Salmantica to Palantia
            4 cavalrys moved from Carthago Nova to Tarraco
            1 swordman moved from Toletum to Tarraco
            1 swordman moved from Toletum to Tarraco
            1 swordman moved from Toletum to Tarraco
            1 swordman moved from Toletum to Tarraco
            1 cavalry moved from Toletum to Palantia
            1 cavalry moved from Toletum to Palantia
            1 swordman moved from Toletum to Tarraco
            1 swordman moved from Toletum to Palantia
            1 swordman moved from Toletum to Tarraco
            4 biremes and 4 triremes moved from SZ 26 to SZ 24
            1 swordman moved from Carthago to SZ 32
            1 swordman moved from Carthago to SZ 32
            1 spearman moved from Carthago to SZ 32
            1 spearman moved from Carthago to SZ 32
            2 spearmen and 2 swordmen moved from SZ 32 to Caralis
            1 swordman moved from Lilybaeum to SZ 36
            1 swordman moved from Lilybaeum to SZ 36
            1 swordman moved from Lilybaeum to SZ 36
            3 swordmen and 1 trireme moved from SZ 36 to SZ 32
            1 swordman moved from SZ 32 to Caralis
            1 swordman moved from SZ 32 to Caralis
            1 swordman moved from SZ 32 to Caralis
            1 cavalry moved from Leptis Magna to Siwa
            1 cavalry moved from Leptis Magna to Siwa
            1 spearman moved from Oea to Leptis Magna
            1 bireme moved from SZ 29 to SZ 30
            1 spearman moved from Palma to SZ 29
            1 bireme and 1 spearman moved from SZ 29 to SZ 30

Combat - Carthage
            Battle in Tarraco
                Carthage attack with 4 cavalrys and 6 swordmen
                Neutral defend with 3 axemen and 3 swordmen
                    Carthage roll dice for 4 cavalrys and 6 swordmen in Tarraco, round 1 :  5/10 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 3 axemen and 3 swordmen in Tarraco, round 1 :  1/6 hits
                    3 axemen owned by the Neutral , 2 swordmen owned by the Neutral and 1 cavalry owned by the Carthage lost in Tarraco
                    Carthage roll dice for 3 cavalrys and 6 swordmen in Tarraco, round 2 :  2/9 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 1 swordman in Tarraco, round 2 :  1/1 hits
                    1 swordman owned by the Neutral and 1 cavalry owned by the Carthage lost in Tarraco
                Carthage win, taking Tarraco from Neutral with 2 cavalrys and 6 swordmen remaining. Battle score for attacker is 13
                Casualties for Neutral: 3 axemen and 3 swordmen
                Casualties for Carthage: 2 cavalrys
            Battle in Caralis
                Carthage attack with 2 spearmen and 5 swordmen
                RomanRepublic defend with 1 ballista and 4 legionaires
                    Carthage roll dice for 2 spearmen and 5 swordmen in Caralis, round 1 :  2/7 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 1 ballista and 4 legionaires in Caralis, round 1 :  1/4 hits
                    1 ballista owned by the RomanRepublic , 1 legionaire owned by the RomanRepublic and 1 spearman owned by the Carthage lost in Caralis
                    Carthage roll dice for 1 spearman and 5 swordmen in Caralis, round 2 :  2/6 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 3 legionaires in Caralis, round 2 :  2/3 hits
                    1 swordman owned by the Carthage , 2 legionaires owned by the RomanRepublic and 1 spearman owned by the Carthage lost in Caralis
                    Carthage roll dice for 4 swordmen in Caralis, round 3 :  0/4 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 1 legionaire in Caralis, round 3 :  0/1 hits
                    Carthage roll dice for 4 swordmen in Caralis, round 4 :  0/4 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 1 legionaire in Caralis, round 4 :  1/1 hits
                    1 swordman owned by the Carthage lost in Caralis
                    Carthage roll dice for 3 swordmen in Caralis, round 5 :  3/3 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 1 legionaire in Caralis, round 5 :  0/1 hits
                    1 legionaire owned by the RomanRepublic lost in Caralis
                Carthage win, taking Caralis from RomanRepublic with 3 swordmen remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7
                Casualties for RomanRepublic: 1 ballista and 4 legionaires
                Casualties for Carthage: 2 spearmen and 2 swordmen
            Battle in Palantia
                Carthage attack with 2 cavalrys and 2 swordmen
                Neutral defend with 3 cavalrys
                    Carthage roll dice for 2 cavalrys and 2 swordmen in Palantia, round 1 :  2/4 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 3 cavalrys in Palantia, round 1 :  2/3 hits
                    2 cavalrys owned by the Neutral and 2 swordmen owned by the Carthage lost in Palantia
                    Carthage roll dice for 2 cavalrys in Palantia, round 2 :  0/2 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 1 cavalry in Palantia, round 2 :  0/1 hits
                    Carthage roll dice for 2 cavalrys in Palantia, round 3 :  0/2 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 1 cavalry in Palantia, round 3 :  1/1 hits
                    1 cavalry owned by the Carthage lost in Palantia
                    Carthage roll dice for 1 cavalry in Palantia, round 4 :  1/1 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 1 cavalry in Palantia, round 4 :  0/1 hits
                    1 cavalry owned by the Neutral lost in Palantia
                Carthage win, taking Palantia from Neutral with 1 cavalry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for Neutral: 3 cavalrys
                Casualties for Carthage: 1 cavalry and 2 swordmen
            Battle in SZ 24
                Carthage attack with 4 biremes and 4 triremes
                RomanRepublic defend with 4 biremes and 4 triremes
                    Carthage roll dice for 4 biremes and 4 triremes in SZ 24, round 1 :  3/8 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 4 biremes and 4 triremes in SZ 24, round 1 :  2/8 hits
                    2 biremes owned by the Carthage and 3 biremes owned by the RomanRepublic lost in SZ 24
                    Carthage roll dice for 2 biremes and 4 triremes in SZ 24, round 2 :  2/6 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 1 bireme and 4 triremes in SZ 24, round 2 :  0/5 hits
                    1 bireme owned by the RomanRepublic and 1 trireme owned by the RomanRepublic lost in SZ 24
                    Carthage roll dice for 2 biremes and 4 triremes in SZ 24, round 3 :  3/6 hits
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 3 triremes in SZ 24, round 3 :  1/3 hits
                    1 bireme owned by the Carthage and 3 triremes owned by the RomanRepublic lost in SZ 24
                Carthage win with 1 bireme and 4 triremes remaining. Battle score for attacker is 55
                Casualties for RomanRepublic: 4 biremes and 4 triremes
                Casualties for Carthage: 3 biremes

Non Combat Move - Carthage

Place Units - Carthage
            1 hoplite and 4 swordmen placed in Lilybaeum
            1 bireme and 1 trireme placed in SZ 36
            2 spearmen and 1 swordman placed in Carthago
            Carthage undo move 1.
            4 swordmen placed in Lilybaeum
            1 trireme placed in SZ 33
            1 bireme placed in SZ 32
            1 hoplite placed in Carthago

Turn Complete - Carthage
            Carthage collect 75 PUs; end with 75 PUs total

[lexgreat]

pls take this file instead.

[Panther]

Lol … you see: The dice even it out. Absoultely no reason for you to surrender.
I’m sure you will win this game!
:-)

[Panther]

Test summary from TripleA, engine version: 1.6.1.2, time: 20:50:51

[Panther]

Just a test because I had to correct the forum data in your second file.

[Panther]

TripleA Turn Summary for game: 270BC, version: 1.1.2

Game History

Round :4

Purchase Units - RomanRepublic
            RomanRepublic buy 7 biremes and 4 velitess; Remaining resources: 0 PUs;

Combat Move - RomanRepublic
            1 ballista, 3 cavalrys, 7 legionaires and 2 velitess moved from Verona to Genua

Combat - RomanRepublic
            Battle in Genua
                RomanRepublic attack with 1 ballista, 3 cavalrys, 7 legionaires and 2 velitess
                Neutral defend with 3 cavalrys and 3 swordmen
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 1 ballista, 3 cavalrys, 7 legionaires and 2 velitess in Genua, round 1 :  3/13 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 3 cavalrys and 3 swordmen in Genua, round 1 :  1/6 hits
                    1 velites owned by the RomanRepublic and 3 cavalrys owned by the Neutral lost in Genua
                    RomanRepublic roll dice for 1 ballista, 3 cavalrys, 7 legionaires and 1 velites in Genua, round 2 :  9/12 hits
                    Neutral roll dice for 3 swordmen in Genua, round 2 :  1/3 hits
                    3 swordmen owned by the Neutral and 1 velites owned by the RomanRepublic lost in Genua
                RomanRepublic win, taking Genua from Neutral with 1 ballista, 3 cavalrys and 7 legionaires remaining. Battle score for attacker is 18
                Casualties for Neutral: 3 cavalrys and 3 swordmen
                Casualties for RomanRepublic: 2 velitess

Non Combat Move - RomanRepublic
            4 velitess moved from Roma to Arretium
            2 biremes and 3 triremes moved from SZ 28 to SZ 34
            4 legionaires and 5 velitess moved from Capua to SZ 34
            4 legionaires and 5 velitess moved from SZ 34 to Messana
            1 bireme moved from SZ 44 to SZ 35
            1 velites moved from Capua to SZ 35
            1 velites moved from SZ 35 to Messana

Place Units - RomanRepublic
            4 velitess placed in Roma
            7 biremes placed in SZ 28

Turn Complete - RomanRepublic
            RomanRepublic collect 61 PUs; end with 61 PUs total

Territory Summary for RomanRepublic :

Arretium : 1 flag, 4 velitess
    Roma : 1 flag, 1 city and 8 velitess
    Verona : 1 flag
    Aleria : 1 flag
    Messana : 1 flag, 4 forts, 8 legionaires and 11 velitess
    Capua : 1 flag, 1 city, 4 legionaires and 7 velitess
    SZ 35 : 1 flag, 1 bireme
    SZ 34 : 1 flag, 2 biremes and 3 triremes
    SZ 28 : 1 flag, 7 biremes
    Genua : 1 flag, 1 ballista, 3 cavalrys and 7 legionaires
    Patavium : 1 flag

Production/PUs Summary :

Carthage : 75 / 75
    RomanRepublic : 61 / 61
    GreekCityStates : 32 / 38
    Macedonia : 47 / 47
    Egypt : 35 / 41
    Seleucid : 39 / 44
    Parthia : 53 / 55
    Numidia : 36 / 36

[Panther]

Greek City States to follow tomorrow.
I have to think carefully about this next move.