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What happens if you SAVE your money G1?
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As UK why not just hold your IPC’s round 1 as well? It’s not as if Germany will be able to attack that very next turn. If Germany can wait so can you. You are essentially in the same position as you were on turn 1 just you both have larger amounts of money.
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God, I have been on the recieving end of this one before and its has got to be one of the most annoying games of 1940 global I have ever played! The problem was that my opponet was doing this for the enitre axis, except Italy( kinda hard not to spend 10IPC) and it really created a problem for me as the allies.
The issue, and why this worked for him in the end (or atleast got him close, we couldnt finish the game due to an accident) was because the Axis powers already have large armies on the board. If you were to compare the total IPC value of the Axis armies against the Allied armies, the difference is quite staggering. Japan espically, their armies value is enormous and dwarfs the total IPC value of all forces against it in the pacific, including the Soviet forces. This does, in theroy, give the Axis a bit more flexabilty with their buys on their opening turns. Now, in Germanys case, they have the abality to grow their economy by quite abit on G1. Germany can easily jump from 30IPC to 42IPC (conservative estimate) by the end of its first turn. Add to this the 19IPCs it gets for taking Paris and 10IPCs for having 2 NOs, and at the end of G1 Germany has a cash in hand value of 101IPCs!!! In my game the player use this as a reserve and was able to replace losses, repair faculities, and place huge builds in any area of the game he wanted. When the US got into the war he was able to match it build for build with Germany.
He also had mild success with this same stratgey as Japan, being that Japan dosnt start the game at war with several major powers with large economies. Granted, China is annoying, but its no Britian, although its no France either, which is a good and bad thing. Either way, Japan isnt threatened right away, so can afford to do this a bit more with out as big of a risk to screwing itself over long term. It takes Japan about 2 turns to reach the resever level of Germany, with 104IPC by the end of its second turn.
Needless to say that the Axis being able to throw down such large forces, aimed at any front for their choosing is a major advantage, and makes it difficult for the Allies to counter. One of the odd side effects is that it forces the allies to spend all of their IPCs every turn, needing to have the forces ready incase the axis strike out of nowhere. It will turn your game into a series of massive and intense axis offensives, and where or if their offensives run afoul, it will become a long drwan out slug-fest -
As UK why not just hold your IPC’s round 1 as well? It’s not as if Germany will be able to attack that very next turn. If Germany can wait so can you. You are essentially in the same position as you were on turn 1 just you both have larger amounts of money.
UK can only buy 10 units per round with its major factory… if they held off and did not buy anything the first round and it turned out that Germany was going to go for a Sea Lion, the best the UK could do on turn 2 would be to buy 10 units, which would not be enough to hold off the invasion on Germany’s turn 3.
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My concern is that the Axis, Germany in particular hold the initiative. Now you want to wait and see what UK does so that Germany can respond? I don’t understand why you would want to cede that control? The Axis are on the clock, saving money doesn’t seem to be a wise idea unless we are talking about Italy saving for a major fleet purchase I2.
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My concern is that the Axis, Germany in particular hold the initiative. Now you want to wait and see what UK does so that Germany can respond? I don’t understand why you would want to cede that control? The Axis are on the clock, saving money doesn’t seem to be a wise idea unless we are talking about Italy saving for a major fleet purchase I2.
Too each their own, you don’t need to use this tactic. It forfeits a bit of initiative in favor of flexibility. To me, the unseen unspent IPCs are more worrisome than units on the board.
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When talking about “Initiative” think about the bigger picture, in the smaller picture.
Is adding 3 units, with NO attack value (acc 2x transports) G1 instead of G2 (or a different G2 build) Really losing the initiative?
It’s one aircraft carrier, because the transports basically don’t matter. OMG you are on the clock! Say you are right, where ON AVERAGE, is your acc on G2? PROBABLY SZ 112!
If you plan an ALL barbarossa, and don’t want to build the ships, this is “a” way to go. And if your opponent gaffs england and falls for this, even better! Thank you for input everyone.
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My concern is that the Axis, Germany in particular hold the initiative. Now you want to wait and see what UK does so that Germany can respond? I don’t understand why you would want to cede that control? The Axis are on the clock, saving money doesn’t seem to be a wise idea unless we are talking about Italy saving for a major fleet purchase I2.
Too each their own, you don’t need to use this tactic. It forfeits a bit of initiative in favor of flexibility. To me, the unseen unspent IPCs are more worrisome than units on the board.
I completely agree… I don’t think that you really give up anything by holding your cash on G1, and it gives you a lot of options depending on what the UK player does on their first turn. I am going to try this in my next game.
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When talking about “Initiative” think about the bigger picture, in the smaller picture.
Is adding 3 units, with NO attack value (acc 2x transports) G1 instead of G2 (or a different G2 build) Really losing the initiative?
It’s one aircraft carrier, because the transports basically don’t matter. OMG you are on the clock! Say you are right, where ON AVERAGE, is your acc on G2? PROBABLY SZ 112!
If you plan an ALL barbarossa, and don’t want to build the ships, this is “a” way to go. And if your opponent gaffs england and falls for this, even better! Thank you for input everyone.
Exactly my point. It’s totally upside. I’ve always hated the “requirement” that everyone has to build a CV on G1. The CV is in support of Sealion, but if Sealion isn’t your plan anyway, how do you still get UK to spend on INF…you keep your cards and don’t show them on G1, that’s how.
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By not spending your $ or very little of it on G1 then the Allies have to guess what your up to and if they guess wrong then you could take advantage of their move. Like what Garg said Leningrad and London would have to make deployments to cover them selves, in the event that Germany on 2 could do to them (smash either one or both)
At first I was Skeptical, but after reading this thread I believe it could work out rather well -
I still say, as England, I am going to blow 2 rounds of money on Homeland Defense and just end the threat of Sea Lion once and for all.
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@Cmdr:
I still say, as England, I am going to blow 2 rounds of money on Homeland Defense and just end the threat of Sea Lion once and for all.
Agreed. Unless you are one of those UK players that want to bait the Germans into doing Sealion.
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@Cmdr:
I still say, as England, I am going to blow 2 rounds of money on Homeland Defense and just end the threat of Sea Lion once and for all.
Agreed. Unless you are one of those UK players that want to bait the Germans into doing Sealion.
Then I am buying warships off S. Africa and evacuating England…(by that I mean flying away.)
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@Cmdr:
I still say, as England, I am going to blow 2 rounds of money on Homeland Defense and just end the threat of Sea Lion once and for all.
Great! Then I don’t need to waste money on Naval buys, I can just do the TRN or skip Sealion and go right to Barbarossa.
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@Cmdr:
Shadow, why not move the puny British fleet in SZ 98 out and get it to SZ 39? (Not the aircraft, the fleet)
I have seen that done and worked surprisingly well for the British…
I find this discussion thread very interesting… Very interesting even!
Looking at the fleet battles, there is really no reason to go crazy about defending 112. Let’s assume for a second that the English fleet is wiped out except for the cruiser in 91 and the destroyer from 109. Although, Normandy will survive… So in that case, why not going for not 1, but 3 sub ($18 IPC)
So UK will have 4 planes attacking with the destroyer and cruiser. Since the attacking destroyer is present, the subs can serve as fodder.
4 planes at 3 + 1 destroyer + 1 cruiser against 1 damaged battleship, 1 cruiser, 3 fighters and 3 subs is not a good bet at all, even with option to retreat… Then, what’s next for UK?! Cannot build fleet, too many subs. Need to build infantry and put fleet out of range of all the subs (if not, that’s crazy). Next turn, one sub gets to work in 109, 1 in 119. 2 more subs get to 118 and 108 (assuming 1 sub survived the naval battles of first round) and the other one gets to work in (with or without the rest of the fleet). How will the UK get out of trouble with this? The best they can do is to kill one of these four subs (with the 109), and they will lose the destroyer after the first turn. They can’t build fleet again either so they go land. Then, just starve them off with subs!
And with these 3 subs, how about adding a bomber? If Italy takes gibraltar, the bombers can come in quite handy!
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I guess it’s a cool wow factor but by Turn 2 German needs to show their cards with this strategy anyway.
- England still needs to prepare for Sea lion
- Russia still needs to plan for Barbarossa (really what else can do but prepare until attacked anyway :-D )
I always thought the CV purchase (only played a few games actually) is to protect the fleet in SZ 112.
Just by having a CV does not require you to do Sea lion; I think you still have a lot of options/routes and at least your fleet is protected for only $16If you purchase 3 SS on turn 1 for SZ 112 your not doing Sea lion turn 3… Turn 4? (how big is Russia at this point?)
I know people don’t like scripted first turns…but UK is pretty well stuck with 9 Inf UK1 and the other allies are pretty well scripted?
A Germany 1 CV just gives you a lot of options still.Japan is by far the more interesting Axis with options in my opinion.
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Well a CV’s real use is to protect surface ships. If you plan to go with Barbarossa, then why build the CV? You can spend G1 and G2 money on land units (10 ART, 5 TANK, 5 MECH) and forget about the CV, while still forcing UK to build 9 INF on UK1 - or alternatively if the UK player doesn’t build the INF, whack him with Sealion.
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a Cv, 2 trn turn 1 can still transport troops to Norway to Leningrad or just do a decent re-supply later on in the war against Russia.
The CV and any extra naval purchases later can then join up with Italy/keep UK income/ships down.Again Japan needs to be doing a good job for the Axis to win anyway.
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You know, 1 Airbase is cheaper than a carrier and provides 3 extra fighters for defense…if we are not putting out fleet that is. Norway seems like a good place for one.
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Well a CV’s real use is to protect surface ships. If you plan to go with Barbarossa, then why build the CV? You can spend G1 and G2 money on land units (10 ART, 5 TANK, 5 MECH) and forget about the CV, while still forcing UK to build 9 INF on UK1 - or alternatively if the UK player doesn’t build the INF, whack him with Sealion.
Because it’s added defense in SZ 91 allowing you to slow the Americans a bit more before Italy is threatened.
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Well a CV’s real use is to protect surface ships. If you plan to go with Barbarossa, then why build the CV? You can spend G1 and G2 money on land units (10 ART, 5 TANK, 5 MECH) and forget about the CV, while still forcing UK to build 9 INF on UK1 - or alternatively if the UK player doesn’t build the INF, whack him with Sealion.
You are right, the advantage to buying the CV, DD, and Transport on G1 is that it forces the UK to buy all inf on its first turn and pulls its resources away from the med… if you hold onto your money G1, the UK STILL Has to do that! If UK does a defense buy you save the fleet money and go all in on Barbarossa. If they don’t beef up defense and buy ships, go all in on Sea Lion.
I just do not see any down side to holding the money with Germany on G1.
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