I agree.
Thoughts on Industrial Complexes
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I find myself wondering why China would need a IC? China can only build inf. & art. and can place them in any China teritory they occupy at the end of her turn. This includes the Chinese teritories Japan owns at the begining of the game.
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I agree why would china need to build at an IC? That takes away from their ability to pop up in any rice paddy they choose. With China having an IC it just becomes a bigger target for Japan to attack.
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China’s main weakness is not being able to march into Korea. In the late game Japan can ignore a resurgent China because they are trapped in their homeland.
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I find myself wondering why China would need a IC? China can only build inf. & art. and can place them in any China teritory they occupy at the end of her turn. This includes the Chinese teritories Japan owns at the begining of the game.
Reread the original premise: If China can capture the industrial complex they should be able to build Infantry, Artillery, Armor and Fighters at that complex. I had originally intended that China kept its original ability of building infantry and artillery anywhere it wanted, so the complex would really only be useful in adding a couple armor or a fighter if it could be captured.
China’s main weakness is not being able to march into Korea. In the late game Japan can ignore a resurgent China because they are trapped in their homeland.
Yes, that does make it kind of an issue. I would like to see Alpha 3 add Korea to one of the acceptable pieces of land that China can march into. In Anniversary (AA50) China can move into the Korean territory (it is part of Manchuria) so I am a little unclear why it was not made a permittable territory in 1940. I understand it being Japanese, so they can have a major complex on the mainland, just a little unclear why they stopped China from entering it. It was a Chinese territory, settled by Chinese people after one of their many wars. (pre 1500 BCE).
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Remember China is the only power that starts with their capital under enemy control…. Perhaps if Shanghai is liberated they begin to function as a normal power. Although I like your suggestion of build restrictions Jen, I don’t think China should ever be building a navy or bombers.
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@Cmdr:
The complexes are not destroyed when China takes them, they just cannot use them.
You’re thinking of the AA50 rules. In AA40, industrial complexes on Chinese territories are destroyed when liberated.
China had not developed it natural resources at that time to be able to make use of the IC. If they cannot use it then destroying it represents scorched earth policy. That said I wonder how they were able to make rifled tubes for modern artillary. Maybe the artillary represents some lend lease from the U.S.
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@Cmdr:
The complexes are not destroyed when China takes them, they just cannot use them.
You’re thinking of the AA50 rules. In AA40, industrial complexes on Chinese territories are destroyed when liberated.
China had not developed it natural resources at that time to be able to make use of the IC. If they cannot use it then destroying it represents scorched earth policy. That said I wonder how they were able to make rifled tubes for modern artillary. Maybe the artillary represents some lend lease from the U.S.
Wouldnt they have some materials in process of being made, some raw materials to build more, etc, etc, etc on site at a factory?
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@Cmdr:
@Cmdr:
The complexes are not destroyed when China takes them, they just cannot use them.
Your suggesting that the Japanese might have left some material at the IC site. But would the Chinese have had the knowledge to use the machinery?
You’re thinking of the AA50 rules. In AA40, industrial complexes on Chinese territories are destroyed when liberated.
China had not developed it natural resources at that time to be able to make use of the IC. If they cannot use it then destroying it represents scorched earth policy. That said I wonder how they were able to make rifled tubes for modern artillary. Maybe the artillary represents some lend lease from the U.S.
Wouldnt they have some materials in process of being made, some raw materials to build more, etc, etc, etc on site at a factory?
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China didn’t have the industrialized capacity to build planes, tanks, etc during ww2. Even capturing a industrial center, what are you suggesting? That China could build an A6m on their own because they captured some aircraft? They had years of access to soviet planes between 36 and 39, and they couldn’t effectively keep them in the skies even with soviet help, and those planes were outclassed by the japanese air force anyway.
Suggesting that the chinese could capture a japanese factory and understand how the raw materials went together to create an aircraft in the span represented by the game? I’m dubious. Even the Japanese had access to the me262 plans and parts and they could only get to prototype and test planes of anything that tech assisted with. Developing and mastering new technology takes time, money, and manpower, and I think the reason we didn’t see chinese industrialization isn’t because they didn’t have access to captured materials.
The technical expertise wasn’t there at the time. Any sufficiently effective design would take years to prototype and refine and more years to build and train sufficiently to use.
Even from the industrialized nations, capturing equipment didn’t mean we knew how it worked, but at least they had developed similar technology on their own and could replace or modify with our own tech.
It comes down to the fact the major and minor factories are abstracted. As far as I’m concered they represent staging points, training areas, bases, etc, not simply factories. And even capturing, it’s your own equipment. If you didn’t have the equipment or design, how on earth could you build it?
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We play with a house rule that if Japan builds an IC on Chinese territory and that territory is recaptured by the Chinese or liberated by an Ally, then the IC remains there but is simply not used. Then if Japan reconquers that territory, they can continue to use that IC.
Commander Jennifer, that is a good idea of maxing the damage cap on the IC. I think I will alter our house rule to include that. This way Japan still has to pay to use that IC, but it will be cheaper than having to buy a whole new one.
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For Russia …… Slash and burn, move the factory back one spot, then there is nothing for the Axis to Capture.
For China … destroyed!!! anything would have to be rebuild.
For Germany & Japan …damaged, pay for repairs this would also be the fate of the rest of the Axis and Allied Industrial Complexes
This is just my thoughts on the subject