Bombers

[gamerman01]

Was wondering what people out there thought about this.
Some games I’ve been involved with have gotten out of hand, what with the cheaper bombers and 3 techs that apply to them.  What do you think?

[axis_roll]

I think you need to consider whether Escorts are in play or not.
Based on your post, you have NOT taken into consideration that escorts are in play.

IMHO, escorts are a great way to keep ‘bomber fest’ from occuring.

Think about this:  without the un-encumbared ability to bomb, would bomber be such a great buy?

[gamerman01]

I don’t see a lot of SBR in games with or without interceptors.  The interceptor rules for AA50 are quite prohibitive for SBR attacks, yes.
They lightened up on them in AAP40 by not allowing AA fire to hit the fighter escorts.

No, I think the attack value of bombers on enemy military units and the attack range of bombers is so dominant that I wasn’t even thinking about SBR.  Again, I don’t see much SBR in my games, with or without interceptors.  The bombers are too busy attacking land and sea units, and many times players don’t even want to risk their bombers over non-radar AA fire and no interceptors.
Bombers dominate fleets.  See my threads about this.  Cmdr Jenn seems to agree that maybe bombers shouldn’t even be allowed to attack fleets, or if so, at a reduced attack value.

The choice for +1 cost for each tech obtained is already quite popular.  Interesting.  I may switch to this house rule in my games - it actually seems quite brilliant.

[critmonster]

I don’t really like the idea of gaining tech costing you money. Perhaps only a single type of tech could be applied to individual bombers each round: I can para, LRA or heavy but I have to pick which one I do this turn with each bomber.

[gamerman01]

@critmonster:

Perhaps only a single type of tech could be applied to individual bombers each round: I can para, LRA or heavy but I have to pick which one I do this turn with each bomber.

Not bad, not bad.  Thanks for the brainstorming.
Yes, the stacking is often overwhelming.

[axis_roll]

@critmonster:

I don’t really like the idea of gaining tech costing you money. Perhaps only a single type of tech could be applied to individual bombers each round: I can para, LRA or heavy but I have to pick which one I do this turn with each bomber.

Excellent suggestion for dealing with a bomber that can do it all due to all the tech it can have applied to it.

Simple changes are the best, especially when they achieve their objective.

[Bardoly]

I didn’t vote because you didn’t have an “Other” button.

I kind of like the +1 per tech cost, it just doesn’t necessarily answer the question, “What if one already has 8 bombers which only cost 12 and then rolls a breakthrough?  Does one not pay anything?”

The only 1 tech applied per unit is a really good thought, but then are you saying that one’s long range jet fighters could only choose 1 of the two techs with which to be upgraded each turn?  One’s infantry could only be upgraded by 1 tech (improved artillery, paratroopers, or mechanized infantry)?  One’s aa guns could only be regular aa with rockets or radar aa, but not both in the same round of play?

My answer would be that while Long Range is definitely quite game-changing, is shouldn’t necessarily preclude other techs, but I definitely agree that if an air transport (Oops, I meant “bomber”.  :-P) is loaded with troops, I really don’t think that it could also be loaded down with extra bombs at the same time, so I WOULD go for saying that one must choose whether an individual bomber is a Heavy bomber or a Paratrooping bomber each turn.

[gamerman01]

@Bardoly:

I kind of like the +1 per tech cost, it just doesn’t necessarily answer the question, “What if one already has 8 bombers which only cost 12 and then rolls a breakthrough?  Does one not pay anything?”

Correct.

[gamerman01]

@Bardoly:

The only 1 tech applied per unit is a really good thought, but then are you saying that one’s long range jet fighters could only choose 1 of the two techs with which to be upgraded each turn?  One’s infantry could only be upgraded by 1 tech (improved artillery, paratroopers, or mechanized infantry)?  One’s aa guns could only be regular aa with rockets or radar aa, but not both in the same round of play?

Good point.  I’ll let the guy with the idea speak up, but I think that yes, this is doable.  It would be a house rule, anyway, so the players could make these things out.

My answer would be that while Long Range is definitely quite game-changing, is shouldn’t necessarily preclude other techs, but I definitely agree that if an air transport (Oops, I meant “bomber”.   :-P) is loaded with troops, I really don’t think that it could also be loaded down with extra bombs at the same time, so I WOULD go for saying that one must choose whether an individual bomber is a Heavy bomber or a Paratrooping bomber each turn.

Totally agree.  Heavy bombing paratroopers is over the top, and how could they be loaded with both anyway?

[Bardoly]

@gamerman01:

@Bardoly:

The only 1 tech applied per unit is a really good thought, but then are you saying that one’s long range jet fighters could only choose 1 of the two techs with which to be upgraded each turn?  One’s infantry could only be upgraded by 1 tech (improved artillery, paratroopers, or mechanized infantry)?  One’s aa guns could only be regular aa with rockets or radar aa, but not both in the same round of play?

Good point.  I’ll let the guy with the idea speak up, but I think that yes, this is doable.  It would be a house rule, anyway, so the players could make these things out.

My answer would be that while Long Range is definitely quite game-changing, is shouldn’t necessarily preclude other techs, but I definitely agree that if an air transport (Oops, I meant “bomber”.   :-P) is loaded with troops, I really don’t think that it could also be loaded down with extra bombs at the same time, so I WOULD go for saying that one must choose whether an individual bomber is a Heavy bomber or a Paratrooping bomber each turn.

Totally agree.  Heavy bombing paratroopers is over the top, and how could they be loaded with both anyway?

Exactly!  But Long Range Heavys or Long Range Paratrooping bombers I would definitely allow.