@thinrich83 Yes.
New player to Global
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Hi
So my gaming group has started playing the full Global edition of A&A. Currently we have a four player game going and a two player game as well.
In the two player version I’ve got the Allies, I’ve got a few questions around the global edition and strategies going forward.
1 - USA entering the war - I presume they don’t get the 30 IPC and the minor to major industrial unit upgrade when entering the war. In global they will only get the industrial unit upgrade?
2 - Russia - I’m playing a pretty defensive Russian force with one infantry per territory to stop blitz attacks through, is there a more efficient way of offering road blocks and slowing the axis advance though? Is the sacrifice of an inf unit per territory worth it long term or should I just pull everything back to Moscow?
3 - The med - so my UK attack on the Italian navy failed miserably, I lost two fighters and the UK navy, inflicting no causalities on the Italian at all at Taranto… I’ve had some luck in bleeding the Italian army but feel very behind in the area. I’ve lost Egypt presently. Where do I go from here, any options available??
4 - US build up has predominately been in the Pacific but I’m wondering if I should go onto a war footing in Europe. I was aiming to neuter the Japanese navy but not sure how feasible that is early on?
5 - how balanced is the game early doors? it seems the Axis forces have the intiative and can throw some really good punches early on but I’m presuming the Allies come into it long term when the US is up and operational?
Any advice welcomed!
Thanks
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Firstly, can you still contest egypt ? You got a factory in SA and maby middle east?
Those can be used to take egypt back, or at least trade it with italy.Most probably we are early on at the moment and the Italian forces are weakened. South Africa is still viable, I just worry about weakening the UK defence to get offence into Africa…
You will need USA entry in europe in order to survive there, unless germany is doing really poorly in russia.
Umm will have to start building up in the Atlantic then as well, presume I won’t need a significant naval force here though as Italy is stuck in the med and the German forces are concentrating on ground forces for their push through Asia…
Leaving 1 inf blockers normaly isnt worth it, if germany really wants to attack your major stack with only arm-mech let them go for it trade inf for arm and mech is a good deal.
Good point I’m probably just wasting units. I’ll start to pull back the extra infantry. I’ve abandoned hope of holding the two minor industrial units, is that a bad idea?
Also check if italy can open op roads for germany to moscow ( it really sucks if you got a huge stack next to moscow and germany suddenly rolls in with 6 arm and 6 mechs against your 10 inf there.
Not sure that is feasible at the moment but will watch for it!!
Thanks
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new myself, and the one time I’ve played as america I had fun. I put a minor plant in Brazil and was able to leap frog units to southern side of the Sahara desert to help uk get back Egypt. Not really necessary but it made quick troop movements and I could still bring transports from eastern shore to Morocco and then bring them up to uk or across northern Africa if needed. Or if Italy is weak you can take Rome.
When I play them again I plan to take out japans fleet as much as I can. Just keep destroying their ships and planes. Taking out their fleet exposes the money islands and keeps them from gaining the victory cities to win. Use anzac to buy nothing but war ships until japans fleet is low and you can get a money island. you will need one transport to move some units to dutch new guinea to get your national objective money and hold it. Plan to also send lots of subs down to the med if Italy has Gibraltar so you can move the subs in and wipe out their fleet and then convoy sea zone 97. Uk can send subs up suez from union of south Africa but be sure you hold Egypt and trans-jordan or else you’ll be locked out. I played as Russia this last time and wiped out the Italian navy with 3 fighters and a tac. Went pretty smoothly!
I plan for lots of transports and some subs on Atlantic side (subs are cheap and German planes cant get them) and war ships on the pacific.
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new myself, and the one time I’ve played as america I had fun. I put a minor plant in Brazil and was able to leap frog units to southern side of the Sahara desert to help uk get back Egypt. Not really necessary but it made quick troop movements and I could still bring transports from eastern shore to Morocco and then bring them up to uk or across northern Africa if needed. Or if Italy is weak you can take Rome.
Thanks that is a really useful tactic. Might well try that to apply extra pressure on the African continent. Its really not far from Africa is it!
When I play them again I plan to take out japans fleet as much as I can. Just keep destroying their ships and planes. Taking out their fleet exposes the money islands and keeps them from gaining the victory cities to win.
That is the main tactic I’m trying at the moment, remove the Japanese ability to influence the Pacific with their fleet. Just hoping that they won’t get too large on the main land instead.
Use anzac to buy nothing but war ships until japans fleet is low and you can get a money island. you will need one transport to move some units to dutch new guinea to get your national objective money and hold it.
I’ve grabbed one of the Dutch territories for the Anzacs and that gives me the ability to build cruisers now, that is really useful, had been building inf and fighters before.
Plan to also send lots of subs down to the med if Italy has Gibraltar so you can move the subs in and wipe out their fleet and then convoy sea zone 97. Uk can send subs up suez from union of south Africa but be sure you hold Egypt and trans-jordan or else you’ll be locked out.
I’ll start getting subs from the US over there when I can. I’ve had problems with the Italians as I mentioned! Will be nice to start reducing their sea power.
I played as Russia this last time and wiped out the Italian navy with 3 fighters and a tac. Went pretty smoothly!
I hadn’t considered that but that is a good plan. I’ve had to pull them back to protect Moscow recently.
I plan for lots of transports and some subs on Atlantic side (subs are cheap and German planes cant get them) and war ships on the pacific.
Yeah definitely need to get the flow of troops going over to Europe and destroyers and subs seem best option for a guardian!
Really useful thoughts there, thanks both.
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If you are already behind schedule with the Americans you might want to go with some bombers to strategic bomb Germany and they are also useful against Japan when he leaves a transport out or even if you want to eliminate a small fleet. The ANZAC airbase is useful for this as well as establishing a garrison on Midway or Wake. You most definitely need to bomb Germany to slow them down. It will force his airforce to turn around and if you can get Norway you can bomb Germany and West Germany. I use this in every game with nearly 100% effectiveness.
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Bombers can be a tough thing for the Americans since they cost a fair bit for a 4 Attack 1 Defense unit. I find the Western European bombing campaigns to be relatively ineffective. It is easy to shift production to other factories if a couple get bombed. Usually one American bomber gets shot down after few turns. Also note that it is very hard to hit the major factory in the “Germany” territory. As an Axis player, I am more bothered by bombers based in Moscow hitting Novgorod and Ukranian factories that were conquered by Germany. This delays troop deployment to the front lines.
Don’t get too distracted from the central goals:
- Russia: fall back towards Moscow and look for limited opportunities to counterstrike with small numbers of land units supported by the small air force
- Germany: Push to Moscow. If it is too strongly held, swing down to the Middle East and boost your economy. Look for opportunities to sink the Allied Atlantic fleet if it is insufficiently strong.
3) Japan: control the Money Islands and try to push towards India. Be aggressive if the US spends heavily in the Atlantic and be more defensive if the US is spending big in the Pacific - US: contain Japanese expansion, reclaim one Money Island, and plan an invasion in Normandy or Norway
- UK: hold India and Egpyt, get planes to reinforce Moscow before G6 or G7. Support the US fleet in the Atlantic
- ANZAC: support the US Pacific fleet and look for opportunities to trade pieces with the Japanese. Economics are usually in the Allied favor.
Diverting too much from these general concepts will usually result in a quick loss for a new player. Grasshopper has some great videos. There are also opening moves for Germany and Japan in this forum. The Allies have to react to the initial Axis moves so there is less of a standard “playbook”.
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I tend to disagree with Harris on this. 4 bombers are always my go to purchase USA1. This positions me to send a serious threat wherever I need it immediately (Japan DOW on turn 1) with the small invasion force that exists at the begininng. If the Axis defer to RD3 to DOW on USA, its lights out for the Axis. They can also be used against Japan when stationed in Amur or go straight for Germany/Italy. It’s not about the short game.
Enderel, I suggest you try to build some bombers because the threat projection is enough to cause most Axis players to reconsider any attack plan. At this point in the game you need to get over there as fast as possible with Egypt down.
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You might have a chance to recover against a new player, but against veterans I tend to surrender if Italy captures Egpyt on the first round or two and there is no easy way to recapture it immediately. I also restart after a failed G1 attack on Paris. Those outcomes happen about 3% of the time and usually are fatal for the Allies.
On the Axis, I tend to surrender if I lose a majority of my air force on G1 attacking the British navy. I also give up if China somehow is crushing Japan due to ridiculous dice rolls during the first couple of rounds. Those low probability outcomes also tend to be game over events. Dice can make the game exciting, but it also can make it impossible if the events happened early on. The snowball effect makes you start falling further and further behind.
Sean: I am curious how the USA1 4 bomber build holds up against good Axis players. It would seem that you couldn’t threaten the shores of either the Atlantic or the Pacific for quit some time after that purchase. The Allied fleets tend to need another loaded aircraft carrier or two before they can sit within striking range of the Axis forces. I usually build the fleet part first before moving on to planes which can easily get into position.
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Thanks very much for the advice.
I checked last night we’ve only just finished round 2! Feels like it was longer into the game than that!
So turn three is looming, current state is that Germany is at war with the its normal adversaries in Europe, it had set up to attack Russia but hasn’t as yet. I managed to get a cheeky attack in on Normandy and retake that with the UK forces from Canada, I’m hoping it will distract him into coming back before he attacks the USSR. Greece, Yugoslavia, Finland, Bulgaria are all under Axis control.
Italy has taken Egypt but only has a tank left to defend with. Although expecting the transports left in the med to shift infantry over next turn to retake if I claim it or re-enforce it if I don’t.
Hoping to stop Italy building an industrial complex in Egypt and cementing their position.
Its incredibly frustrating not being able to do anything with USA or Russia for a few turns whilst the Axis forces attack with impunity. Sounds like both of those powers should be bought into play early by the Axis player anyway before they strengthen?
Japan has taken a few Chinese locations but not stepped up its Pacific presence massively as yet, hoping to scare them into doing so as I think I can out build them in that area… I’ve shifted two strategic bombers to the pacific theatre but like the idea of building more next turn. I can declare this turn with the USA can’t i?
its an incredibly diverse game strategy wise and there seems to be lots of obvious moves initially, which is slightly frustrating as the first couple turns seem to be the same types of move each time by each player… The diversity after that is incredible though or seemingly so far!
Sorry another few questions
1 - Can the USA send a transport down to Brazil before it is at war?
2 - Can a transport move one sea square, load on two infantry (or alternate cargo), move its last square and then do an amphibious assault?
3 - Can you retreat the naval units from the Philippines back to Pearl Harbour in any way? Or are they blocked in?? Japan isn’t hostile so can they move through or does the rule on moving through apply to global as well? -
As Allies if you are on Norway, USA wants a fair few bombers to keep hitting Germany. Hitting West Germany from London is far less useful unless the allies are creating a western front.
BTW, if Germany is silly enough to use its mobile units to push hard and fast into USSR, that’s when you counter attack. Often you want a few artillery to help with that, normally when you can’t build in Ukraine or Leningrad any more.
If Taranto fails so badly - only one hit!? I think you’re looking at an early surrender.
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Yeah Taranto failed completely, dice were ice cold on that one. So much so I went and got another pack and put the red dice from the box sets into purgatory…
Is Norway the default route into Europe or just the best one, position wise, to assist Russia as well in the long term?
I’ll make sure that I include artillery in the USSR build, its becoming apparent they are extremely useful!!
It seems that multiple fronts (death by a thousand cuts) is an excellent way of distracting and bleeding the IPC’s from the Axis forces?
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Well seems as if your game is turning.
To Harris:
I might not have as many posts as you but I assure you I am no novice. We play with some very difficult house rules in our group that allow political events as well as weather events which require near expert play to gain a win for either side.The bomber purchase provides instant punch to the US navy in 26. Place 3 in zone 10 and one in EUS. Even if they need to redirect to England they can make it by way of the AB. They can also catch up to the SZ26 navy on the next turn including the 2 in EUS, mobilizing in Queensland for a USA3 blitz on Japan. This is a confusing move for any experienced Axis player as now the US has the option to redirect to Germany or Italy. But the having five A4 rolls combined with the existing airforce and navy in Hawaii, WUS, and navy in SZ26 allows for the US player to annihilate any pocket fleet that Japan leave hanging. These are combined in Queensland and with Anzac naval support can do some quick damage to any island force, particularly Caroline Islands is of interest to me always as a base of operations.
This also predicates that on a DOW J1 you can build a massive fleet in the Pacific US2 because you will have full money. If no DOW J1, then move USA fleet from 26 to 64 and utilize in the European theater and replace on US2. All forces are in EUS - Atlantic theater and ready to go to Gibraltar, land ftrs/bombers in Morocco or Algeria and leftover Frenchies from RD1 (threaten Rome/Denmark/Norway - you pick) and redirect any stupid German airforce that wants to play with your fleet, only helps Russia.
Generally pacific builds consists of a 2 to 1 ratio of subs-destroyer. Following turn is 5-6 bombers. This forces Japan to start building fleet instead of troops for India/China crush.
I say try it in your next game and let me know how it goes because the subs are great fodder with a massive bomber fleet. Anytime a battle goes south with the subs just retreat and wait for the next group to arrive. I can end up with 11 bombers attacking Japan by round 5. Japan will really begin to think about where there money goes.Enderel,
Send bombers to Europe soon as you have the initiative it appears. Threaten the Italian navy and cut off supply to Egypt.
Then build your US invasion force. Don’t forget to pick up the guys in Brazil. 2 transports loaded with one arty or tank.
Build one destroyer or transport for UK in Canada along with one fighter in London and 3 infantry every other round. One mech or tank from South Africa each turn will retake Egypt once the US is in position. If he builds a factory in Egypt, bomb it and make him pay to use it.
Have fun and welcome to the most frustrating game next to golf.
Sean… -
Norway is more of a theoretically softer target to weaken Germany. Losing 10IPC per turn (including Finland) and fairly difficult for the Germans to retake. However, it is also fairly difficult for your land forces to move into USSR or mainland Europe in time to save Moscow. So it isn’t really a knock out blow, more (as you aptly put it) a death by a thousand cuts sort of move.
Getting on Normandy in force does more damage but is also much harder. You probably want to take down West Germany in the same move to slow down any counter attack. I like the Spanish beachhead strategy here because it’s a bit closer to the USA and a bit harder for the Germans to throw you off. Even if the Germans take it back it has taken focus off Moscow and you can usually retake it again.
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Sean: Thanks for the additional information on the US1 bomber build. I am surprised that you can pull it off so effectively, but you must have mastered the nuances that come with the opening. A large number of subs sure can be crippling against Japan as you start forcing them to build large numbers of destroyers every round.
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Thanks for the compliment and yes there were many iterations before I “mastered the nuances”. It takes a solid commitment and a clear plan of attack.
Pacific speaking:
The best thing about it is if the bombers are directed at Japan, it forces his fleet to stay in a group therefore relieving the massive bounce on India that every Japan player wants. If he leaves one transport undefended, you attack it for free. That should always be the first look move before anything else. This cuts off supply saving the money islands. The only bad thing is that USSR has to stay in Amur or Buryatia. Amur is best because if you get a chance to strat bomb Japan, you do it, after transport duty of course. I like the mobility of the bomber. They can make a big naval battle for the USA much more palatable even when odds suck. The best is when you can catch Japan out of position (and it will happen). Attack his carriers and once you damage them, run. Planes go in the drink for free with no where to land. With good ANZAC behind, it won’t take long to demolish Japan’s income base. Any extra subs can just convoy. He builds a destroyer, you kill it. Generally, what happens is the IJN fleet is neutered back to SZ6 cause he’ll need to build navy. This allows ANZAC and any available US units to go retake islands or better, Philippines.One other fun thing is if he builds an industrial complex on the mainland, you smoke that too and now it’s an albatross. Ties down fighters to defend it.
Europe speaking:
If no DOW J1, go to Europe with everything you have. Instant pressure on Rome. This leaves Germany by theirself to fight USSR. No more can openers. If Italy leaves their fleet open, smoke it too.USA has all the money and can replace stuff quick. Bombers get their quick and, if needed, can die quickly in a can opener for UK invasions, particularly Norway/Denmark. Paired with a few fighters and destroyers, they can send Italy or any other fleet down in a hurry. Hell, I often just stack Gibraltar while adding a few loaded trannies each turn. You can send 2 or 3 waves into Italy and turn the Nazis around in a hurry. Libya makes a fun spot to land to smoke Italy into the stone age if Egypt is secured and can make it to Moscow from there with 6 moves.
In a last ditch effort you can always send them to Moscow to soak hits and 5-7 extra PIPs can make the difference when it finally comes to fruition.
In conclusion,
We used to have a hard time winning with the Allies until we finally realized the full Jedi power of the US bomber paired with any other type of unit. We never used bids.It is a hard strategy to hold steady but when played effectively with a few land unit purchases is virtually unstoppable, less some $hitty dice roll comes up. Even then, just buy more.
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Generally pacific builds consists of a 2 to 1 ratio of subs-destroyer. Following turn is 5-6 bombers. This forces Japan to start building fleet instead of troops for India/China crush.
I just had to give som additional thumbs up fo9r this comment :D Buying other combat ships than subs, dds (Or CW + ftrs) is rarely correct. the 2 to 1 ratio shos that sean knows how fodder works and how it is the most important thing in these battles.
The only reason to stop buying the subs is if japan for some reason dont respond with fleetbuilding and only buys planes instead. But then you should win anyways :D
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We’ve just finished turn 4.
Africa is still in the balance, I’ve reclaimed Morocco and Gibraltar is now fortified to an extent. So no Italian navy is coming out to play in that direction. Egypt is still in Italian hands but aiming to bring US forces over this turn to roll down northern African coast.
USSR is holding, got 48 inf plus supporting units in Moscow now… purchased some artillery last turn but not sure how to attack / advance as he has pincer manoeuvred around with large armies to south and north.
Far east Japan is becoming unmanageable, its taken the money islands but left minimal forces in Japan but I cannot get enough force there to take it at the moment despite having a large fleet one sea square away from Japan… One transport and one tank to take on what ever appears in Japan this turn.
Main land Asia I’m beginning to reclaim Chinese territory but it really doesn’t do much for Allied capabilities. Having to return them to the Chinese means its dead IPC’s.
USA is struggling to prop up European ambitions and Pacific ones.
IPC production has Germany over 60 and Japan over 70 and Italy over 30 now (with bonus’s counted)
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Generally pacific builds consists of a 2 to 1 ratio of subs-destroyer. Following turn is 5-6 bombers. This forces Japan to start building fleet instead of troops for India/China crush.
I just had to give som additional thumbs up fo9r this comment :D Buying other combat ships than subs, dds (Or CW + ftrs) is rarely correct. the 2 to 1 ratio shos that sean knows how fodder works and how it is the most important thing in these battles.
The only reason to stop buying the subs is if japan for some reason dont respond with fleetbuilding and only buys planes instead. But then you should win anyways :D
which is why i said that it didn’t work against a too planeheavy japan. on theory, the DDs + other surface ships ofc needs to be enough to stop all the planes of japan + 2 rounds of plane only builds of japan.
What would prevent japan from attacking your fleet of subs-destroyers with air and a few destroyers. With 20+ planes they can whipe out your whole fleet with minimal losses as subs cant even hit the planes.
I normaly go for a carrier heavy fleet followed by subs destroyers for attacking power. Ideally i want my carriers to bait an early attack from japan that i can crush in the counter and get his carriers and BB out of the way so anzac and UKP can clean up the rest.
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