Myygames (Allies+58) vs Enno (X) LL OOB

[Myygames]

@Enno to be percise: One AC should have moved from SZ26 (Hawaii) to SZ54 (queensland)

Please let me know your thoughts, thanks

[Enno]

@Myygames I don’t mind NCM edits for the previously played nation, but in this case several other countries played after the US and those did also involve combat. So I prefer to leave it at this, sorry… This for sure will sometimes also bite me, but it does keep things simpler and I believe more fair for both sides. I am fine with the art in Kweichow, thanks.

[Myygames]

@Enno said in Myygames (Allies+58) vs Enno (X) LL OOB:

@Myygames I don’t mind NCM edits for the previously played nation, but in this case several other countries played after the US and those did also involve combat. So I prefer to leave it at this, sorry… This for sure will sometimes also bite me, but it does keep things simpler and I believe more fair for both sides. I am fine with the art in Kweichow, thanks.

The statement about several other countries played and involving combats only holds partly:
a) The only other nation after the allied turn was italy. Of course China and UK also went but that is actually the same turn
b) no combats were fought near that spot, the neares one being Burma and Kweichow. These did for sure have no influence on SZ54.

In addition, of course the situation pretty much dictates another ship in SZ54, since with present ships it cannot be holded and there were enoug available in the Hawaii SZ. It is also a pretty obvious that my intention was to attack SZ55 and SZ42 with ANZAC, since US could also easily have done that but only moved the fighters in the NCM, in fact waisting these fighters for the defence of SZ54 in Queensland, where only 3 of 5 can scramble. In my opinion this classifies perfectly as a forgotten move, and I am pretty sure that many would agree to this classification.

Nevertheless: “Edits always need to be agreed by both players”. This is also part of my edit policy, and if you deny me such a gentlements agreement I will accept it and move on, trying to limit the damage done by this forgotten move as much as possible. Please note that I will apply the same principles to you in the future.

[Myygames]

@Enno oob-playoff22-myygames-vs-elche_ITA10.tsvg

I am really mad at mysefl here. I need to be more focussed when doing the turns. These mistakes will cost me the game on the long run.

Game History

Round: 3

    Purchase Units - ANZAC
        ANZAC buy 1 fighter and 1 mech_infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - ANZAC
        1 fighter moved from Queensland to 42 Sea Zone
        2 fighters moved from Queensland to 55 Sea Zone
        1 destroyer moved from 54 Sea Zone to 55 Sea Zone

    Combat - ANZAC
        Battle in 42 Sea Zone
            ANZAC attack with 1 fighter
            Japanese defend with 1 transport
                1 transport owned by the Japanese lost in 42 Sea Zone
            ANZAC win with 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 transport
        Battle in 55 Sea Zone
            ANZAC attack with 1 destroyer and 2 fighters
            Japanese defend with 1 destroyer
                ANZAC roll dice for 1 destroyer and 2 fighters in 55 Sea Zone, round 2 : 2/1 hits, 1,33 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 destroyer in 55 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 destroyer owned by the Japanese lost in 55 Sea Zone
            ANZAC win with 1 destroyer and 2 fighters remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 destroyer

    Non Combat Move - ANZAC
        2 fighters moved from 55 Sea Zone to Queensland
        1 fighter moved from 42 Sea Zone to Western Australia
        1 cruiser moved from 54 Sea Zone to 46 Sea Zone
        1 transport moved from 62 Sea Zone to 63 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from New Zealand to 63 Sea Zone
        1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 63 Sea Zone to 54 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from 54 Sea Zone to Queensland
        2 infantry moved from New South Wales to South Australia
        1 artillery moved from New South Wales to Queensland
        1 infantry moved from Queensland to South Australia
        2 infantry moved from Egypt to Trans-Jordan

    Place Units - ANZAC
        1 fighter and 1 mech_infantry placed in New South Wales

    Turn Complete - ANZAC
        ANZAC collect 10 PUs; end with 11 PUs

    Combat Move - French

    Non Combat Move - French
        1 infantry moved from Trans-Jordan to Iraq
        1 infantry moved from French Equatorial Africa to Anglo Egyptian Sudan
        1 fighter moved from United Kingdom to Gibraltar

    Turn Complete - French

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Japanese regular : -0,33
ANZAC regular : 0,67

[Myygames]

@Enno myygames-vs-enno-g40-ll-FRE3.tsvg

wrong file posted

[Enno]

myygames-vs-enno-g40-LL- G4.tsvg

Thanks for your understanding. As mentioned, I am pretty lenient with accepting NCM until the combat of the next nation (not side). But once combat occurs, it changes the outlook and I am simply not a fan of then changing the prior situation, also in the case of several nations playing in the same turn.

While the effect of 1 unit can be small, the situation on the Pacific definitely has a material impact on what happens in Europe, and likewise Italy has a significant role in the offensive & defense in Europe. I simply don’t like to go into the details and whether the impact of a NCM was above a certain threshold (as it is never exactly 0), so to keep things simple, I prefer to stick to the rule I stated earlier.

I don’t think it’s very different to rule 5 you stated on your profile: “Edits should be made in a timely manner. Best case in the same turn before the post. Latest before the next players turn”

Finally, although it will have some positive effect for the axis, I don’t think it should have a material impact on the game; there is no free way for Japan to clear the blockers.

Go USSR!

[Enno]

By the way, please still decide whether you would like to change the casualty in Normandy to the inf instead.

[Myygames]

@Enno said in Myygames (Allies+58) vs Enno (X) LL OOB

Thanks for your understanding. As mentioned, I am pretty lenient with accepting NCM until the combat of the next nation (not side). But once combat occurs, it changes the outlook and I am simply not a fan of then changing the prior situation, also in the case of several nations playing in the same turn.

While the effect of 1 unit can be small, the situation on the Pacific definitely has a material impact on what happens in Europe, and likewise Italy has a significant role in the offensive & defense in Europe. I simply don’t like to go into the details and whether the impact of a NCM was above a certain threshold (as it is never exactly 0), so to keep things simple, I prefer to stick to the rule I stated earlier.

I don’t think it’s very different to rule 5 you stated on your profile: “Edits should be made in a timely manner. Best case in the same turn before the post. Latest before the next players turn”

Does that also mean that you do not accept NCM edits in the allied turn? I am used to being able to do US NCM edits after the UK turn. If it is not affected by rolls of course, but to be honest most moves are usually not impacted. My understanding is that it is common practice around here to allow this, but again I will accept it if you think it must be done another way. If that is really what you mean please confirm, then I need to take longer with the allied turns and doublecheck more.

I think this is actually a penalty for the allies, since the situation does not exist in the axis that more than one nation is done in one turn, while with allies it exists twice.

[Myygames]

@Enno said in Myygames (Allies+58) vs Enno (X) LL OOB:

By the way, please still decide whether you would like to change the casualty in Normandy to the inf instead.

I will most likely do that, will have a look at it.

[Enno]

@Myygames That is indeed my preference, although I am OK with an exception here and there.

I don’t think it penalizes a side, because checking whether anything is forgotten is mostly a function of number of units, e.g. checking China is very simple, and both sides have roughly the same number. I also think there are several reasons why it’s good practice to check any forgotten moves at the end of a turn for a particular nation, and it’s also most efficient as everything is fresh on ones mind. Things change irrevocably with combat, so that’s for me typically the deadline.

I also don’t want to deviate much from the convention around here, so if it is, that would be good for me to know.

[Myygames]

@Myygames said in Myygames (Allies+58) vs Enno (X) LL OOB:

@Enno said in Myygames (Allies+58) vs Enno (X) LL OOB:

By the way, please still decide whether you would like to change the casualty in Normandy to the inf instead.

I will most likely do that, will have a look at it.

I will change the casualty in normandy. This will change the result of the combat. I will make the necessary Edits with the russian Turn, probably this evening.

[Myygames]

@Enno said in Myygames (Allies+58) vs Enno (X) LL OOB:

@Myygames That is indeed my preference, although I am OK with an exception here and there.

I don’t think it penalizes a side, because checking whether anything is forgotten is mostly a function of number of units, e.g. checking China is very simple, and both sides have roughly the same number. I also think there are several reasons why it’s good practice to check any forgotten moves at the end of a turn for a particular nation, and it’s also most efficient as everything is fresh on ones mind. Things change irrevocably with combat, so that’s for me typically the deadline.

I also don’t want to deviate much from the convention around here, so if it is, that would be good for me to know.

No worries, i am fine with your policy. I will only edit NCM of the same Nation and otherwise ask for your Permission.

[Enno]

@Myygames Ah, that was a painful mistake; I thought I had the option to retreat as long as a defending unit was present, but I see now that’s not the case with only AA’s left.

[Myygames]

@Enno myygames-vs-enno-g40-ll-RUS4.tsvg

I edited normandy, should be OK but pls check.

Game History

Round: 4

    Purchase Units - Russians
        Russians buy 1 artillery and 10 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Russians
        1 infantry moved from Bryansk to Western Ukraine
        1 infantry moved from Bryansk to Ukraine
        2 fighters moved from Russia to Western Ukraine
        1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Russia to Ukraine
        1 armour moved from Bryansk to Smolensk
              Russians take Smolensk from Germans
        1 armour moved from Smolensk to Russia
        1 infantry moved from Vologda to Archangel
              Russians take Archangel from Germans

    Combat - Russians
        Battle in Ukraine
            Russians attack with 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
            Germans defend with 1 factory_minor and 1 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in Ukraine, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 1,33 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Ukraine, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Ukraine
            Russians win, taking Ukraine from Germans with 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry
        Battle in Western Ukraine
            Russians attack with 2 fighters and 1 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 factory_minor and 1 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 2 fighters and 1 infantry in Western Ukraine, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 1,17 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Western Ukraine, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Russians and 1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Western Ukraine
            Russians win with 2 fighters remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Russians
        2 fighters moved from Western Ukraine to Russia
        1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Ukraine to Russia
        1 armour and 2 mech_infantrys moved from Bryansk to Samara
        1 mech_infantry moved from Volgograd to Samara
        2 infantry moved from Vologda to Samara
        4 infantry moved from Vologda to Russia
        4 aaGuns, 7 artilleries and 32 infantry moved from Bryansk to Russia
        2 aaGuns and 18 infantry moved from Buryatia to Amur
        1 fighter moved from Northwest Persia to Russia
        1 infantry moved from Iraq to 80 Sea Zone
        1 mech_infantry moved from Iraq to Egypt

    Place Units - Russians
        1 infantry placed in Volgograd
        1 artillery and 9 infantry placed in Russia

    Turn Complete - Russians
        Russians collect 31 PUs; end with 31 PUs
        Objective Russians 2 Spread Of Communism: Russians met a national objective for an additional 3 PUs; end with 34 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans regular : 0,33
Russians regular : -0,50

[Myygames]

@Enno are you working on Japan?

[Enno]

@Myygames Yeah, it’s coming up today.

[Enno]

myygames-vs-enno-g40-LL- J4.tsvg
Go Allies!

[Myygames]

@Enno myygames-vs-enno-g40-ll-US4_NCM.tsvg

2 planes covering the amphibious assault on korea in SZ6, you have 1 fighter. pls confirm no scramble.

[Enno]

@Myygames Correct, no scramble.

[Myygames]

@Enno myygames-vs-enno-g40-ll-UK4.tsvg

Game History

Round: 4

    Purchase Units - Americans
        Americans buy 1 bomber, 3 fighters, 3 infantry and 3 transports; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Americans
        1 bomber moved from United Kingdom to Southern France
        1 artillery moved from Gibraltar to 91 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from Gibraltar to 91 Sea Zone
        1 armour and 1 infantry moved from Morocco to 91 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Gibraltar to Normandy Bordeaux
        1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 cruiser, 2 infantry and 2 transports moved from 91 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone
        1 armour, 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux
        1 destroyer moved from 26 Sea Zone to 46 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Queensland to 46 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Queensland to 54 Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Queensland to 54 Sea Zone
        1 battleship, 2 cruisers, 2 fighters, 2 infantry, 1 tactical_bomber and 1 transport moved from 54 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
        2 fighters, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 33 Sea Zone to Caroline Islands
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Hawaiian Islands to 26 Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 26 Sea Zone to 6 Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from 6 Sea Zone to Korea
        2 fighters moved from Amur to 6 Sea Zone

    Combat - Americans
        Strategic bombing raid in Southern France
                Germans roll AA dice in Southern France : 0/1 hits, 0,17 expected hits
            Bombing raid in Southern France rolls: 5 and causes: 5 damage to unit: factory_minor
            Bombing raid in Southern France causes 5 damage total. 
        Battle in Korea
        Battle in 46 Sea Zone
            Americans attack with 1 destroyer and 1 fighter
            Japanese defend with 1 submarine
                Americans roll dice for 1 destroyer and 1 fighter in 46 Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,83 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 submarine in 46 Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,17 expected hits
                1 submarine owned by the Japanese lost in 46 Sea Zone
            Americans win, taking Korea from Japanese with 1 destroyer and 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 submarine
        Battle in Normandy Bordeaux
            Americans attack with 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 fighter and 2 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 artillery, 1 factory_minor, 1 harbour and 1 mech_infantry
                Americans roll dice for 1 cruiser in Normandy Bordeaux, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                Americans roll dice for 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 fighter and 2 infantry in Normandy Bordeaux, round 2 : 2/1 hits, 1,83 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 artillery and 1 mech_infantry in Normandy Bordeaux, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                1 artillery owned by the Germans, 1 infantry owned by the Americans and 1 mech_infantry owned by the Germans lost in Normandy Bordeaux
            Americans win, taking Normandy Bordeaux from Germans with 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 fighter and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 5
            Casualties for Americans: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 1 artillery and 1 mech_infantry
        Battle in Caroline Islands
            Americans attack with 2 fighters, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
            Japanese defend with 1 aaGun, 1 airfield, 1 harbour and 2 infantry
                Japanese roll AA dice in Caroline Islands : 1/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                1 fighter owned by the Americans lost in Caroline Islands
                Americans roll dice for 1 battleship and 1 cruiser in Caroline Islands, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 1,17 expected hits
                Americans roll dice for 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in Caroline Islands, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 1,50 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 aaGun and 2 infantry in Caroline Islands, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Japanese, 1 aaGun owned by the Japanese and 1 infantry owned by the Americans lost in Caroline Islands
                Americans roll dice for 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in Caroline Islands, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 1,33 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Caroline Islands, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Japanese lost in Caroline Islands
            Americans win, taking Caroline Islands from Japanese with 1 fighter, 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is -2
            Casualties for Americans: 1 fighter and 1 infantry
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 aaGun and 2 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Americans
        1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Caroline Islands to 33 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from 46 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
        1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 2 submarines moved from 54 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
        2 carriers and 1 destroyer moved from 26 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
        1 submarine moved from 26 Sea Zone to 6 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Midway to 33 Sea Zone
        2 fighters moved from Western United States to Wake Island
        1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from Western United States to 10 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun, 1 carrier, 1 destroyer, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from 26 Sea Zone to Hawaiian Islands
        2 fighters moved from 6 Sea Zone to Siberia
        1 mech_infantry moved from Western United States to Central United States
        1 aaGun moved from Central United States to Western United States
        1 carrier and 1 destroyer moved from 91 Sea Zone to 110 Sea Zone
        1 mech_infantry moved from Central United States to 101 Sea Zone
        1 mech_infantry and 1 transport moved from 101 Sea Zone to 88 Sea Zone
        1 infantry moved from British Guiana to 88 Sea Zone
        1 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 1 transport moved from 88 Sea Zone to 91 Sea Zone
        1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from 91 Sea Zone to Morocco
        1 fighter moved from Eastern United States to Gibraltar
        1 fighter moved from Eastern United States to 110 Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from Normandy Bordeaux to 110 Sea Zone
        1 bomber moved from Southern France to United Kingdom

    Place Units - Americans
        2 transports placed in 101 Sea Zone
        1 infantry placed in Central United States
        1 bomber, 3 fighters and 2 infantry placed in Western United States
        Americans undo move 3.
        1 bomber, 2 fighters and 2 infantry placed in Western United States
        1 fighter placed in Eastern United States
        1 transport placed in 10 Sea Zone

    Turn Complete - Americans
        Americans collect 57 PUs; end with 57 PUs
        Objective Americans 1 Homeland: Americans met a national objective for an additional 10 PUs; end with 67 PUs
        Objective Americans 3 Defense Obligations: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 72 PUs
        Objective Americans 2 Outer Territories: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 77 PUs

    Purchase Units - Chinese
        Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
        Chinese buy 2 infantry; Remaining resources: 2 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Chinese
        1 infantry moved from Tsinghai to Shensi
              Chinese take Shensi from Japanese
        1 infantry moved from Tsinghai to Kansu

    Combat - Chinese

    Non Combat Move - Chinese

    Place Units - Chinese
        2 infantry placed in Tsinghai

    Turn Complete - Chinese
        Chinese collect 4 PUs; end with 6 PUs

    Purchase Units - British
        British buy 1 fighter, 6 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 1 submarine; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Purchase Units - UK_Pacific
        UK_Pacific buy 2 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
        2 infantry moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Holland Belgium
        2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber moved from India to Burma

    Combat - British
        Battle in Holland Belgium
            British attack with 2 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 infantry
                British roll dice for 1 battleship and 1 cruiser in Holland Belgium, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 1,17 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Holland Belgium, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Holland Belgium
            British win, taking Holland Belgium from Germans with 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry
        Battle in Burma
            British attack with 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
            Japanese defend with 1 infantry
                British roll dice for 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber in Burma, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,83 expected hits
                Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Burma, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Japanese and 1 infantry owned by the British lost in Burma
            British win, taking Burma from Japanese with 1 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for British: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry

    Non Combat Move - British
        1 tactical_bomber moved from Burma to West India
        3 aaGuns, 2 artilleries, 16 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from India to West India
        2 infantry moved from Persia to Northwest Persia
        1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 80 Sea Zone to 76 Sea Zone
        1 transport moved from 81 Sea Zone to 71 Sea Zone
        1 battleship, 1 carrier, 1 cruiser and 1 destroyer moved from 81 Sea Zone to 80 Sea Zone
        1 bomber moved from Persia to Northwest Persia
        2 artilleries and 2 infantry moved from Trans-Jordan to Iraq
        1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Egypt to Trans-Jordan
        2 mech_infantrys moved from Egypt to Iraq
        1 tactical_bomber moved from Egypt to Persia
        1 mech_infantry moved from Volgograd to Tsinghai
        1 armour and 1 mech_infantry moved from Volgograd to Russia
        1 infantry moved from Caucasus to Volgograd
        1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone
        1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux
        1 fighter moved from 110 Sea Zone to Normandy Bordeaux
        2 fighters moved from United Kingdom to Normandy Bordeaux
        1 fighter moved from Gibraltar to Normandy Bordeaux
        1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from United Kingdom to 110 Sea Zone

    Place Units - British
        1 fighter and 2 infantry placed in United Kingdom
        2 infantry and 1 mech_infantry placed in Egypt
        2 infantry placed in Union of South Africa
        1 submarine placed in 71 Sea Zone

    Turn Complete - British
        British collect 33 PUs; end with 33 PUs
        Objective British 1 Original: British met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 38 PUs

    Place Units - UK_Pacific
        2 infantry placed in India

    Turn Complete - UK_Pacific
        UK_Pacific collect 6 PUs; end with 6 PUs
        Some Units in India change ownership: 2 infantry

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Americans regular : -1,17
Japanese regular : 0,50
Japanese AA : 0,50
Germans AA : -0,17
Germans regular : 0,00
British regular : -0,00