Allies advice with an aggressive Japan

[fenderbender4]

I’ve seen a couple videos on the AnA 1942 Online and was wondering (when played at the boardgame) how the allies counter an aggressive Japan that’s gunning for India while Germany keeps building infantry as buffers for an assault with tanks?

The Japan strategy is this: Takes India Turn 3
And the German strategy is lifted from what the the video guy did in here German Infantry Build

Not sure how that German strategy plays out but it seems pretty sound compared to the usual blitz that people try and do.

I’ve tried to wrap my head around how the Allies counter while making any progress. I find it incredibly difficult to stall Japan, especially if they just build an army of subs in between at turns 2 and 3, enough to start wreaking havoc on any counter attack in the Pacific, let alone swinging around into the Atlantic.

I feel like I’m missing something major and any insight would be appreciated.

This is all assuming the 2nd edition OOB setup.

[Imperious Leader]

OMG those guys are lets say not the best. The British guy and 2 others. I have never seen games like they play. The key is builds and finding a way to take the money islands where UK gets some and USA gets at least one and both build a factory and churn out naval. UK needs to find a way to sink the German Medd fleet with air builds, and protect Egypt. Then with 2 factories churn out 5 tanks heading toward FIC and swinging North. The whole thing depends on Axis buys. To give you exact buys, movements, combat results, would be ridiculous. You need to find the flaws in his play and punish them without mercy. A few ideas you can follow on UK1, but that depends on what Germany did, which depends on what USSR did.

But on UK 1 you might buy 3 fighters, or some naval like a 2nd carrier, 1 fighter, 1 sub. You take Borneo and New guinea . you kill the destroyer and transport. You send the sub to probably stack with which ever SZ you think Japan might send a destroyer too, or attack the Japanese sub --because alot of people don’t have them set to submerge if attacked.

USA needs for sure a Carrier if the Hawaiian one was sunk, They need 1-2 Transports and land units ( now having 3 transports) so they can land 6 men, but they need to move by Island Hopping these assets

They need a few subs and probably a 2nd battleship. Turn 2 buy bombers and bring them to the Solomons.

Eventually it will be Philippines as a target, but Borneo and Indies will be already captured. This is a basic plan that will require you to perfect and play single player for this and try to emulate the ideas that were used against you in your defeats.

[aardvarkpepper]

@fenderbender4

Ugh, videos. Give me text any day.

The Japan strat video I didn’t finish watching. There’s a lot of small weird things in there, like India being almost empty, Germany holding Egypt on G1 with 2 inf 2 tank, UK putting its entire UK1 Indian Ocean fleet in range of Japan’s counter (at least the fighter normally lands in Szechwan or something). If that player wanted to make a decent video, they shouldn’t have tried it with a chump AI. Yes, I know they mentioned a disclaimer it’s for illustrative purposes but still.

The German strat video was maybe a LITTLE better, but stuff like - did they say they were surprised by UK’s shift out of India? That’s just bog standard. And I don’t know that Germany ought to have collapsed France / NW Europe so hard by G4 but without much info on the game, eh, what it is.

@fenderbender4 said in Allies advice with an aggressive Japan:

I’ve tried to wrap my head around how the Allies counter while making any progress. . . .
This is all assuming the 2nd edition OOB setup.

stop stop stop. Couple really big things here. 1) You need to REALLY understand 1942 Online doesn’t allow use of allied carriers, which changes KJF timings. You ask for advice in the 1942 2nd edition board, you need to say HEY GUYS I CAN’T USE ALLIED CARRIERS (and a buncha other gameplay changes 1942 Online made too btw). 2) OOB is tougher for Allies. 1942 Online allows LHTR setup, and forces LHTR setup on ladder games - and YOU should use LHTR setup too. Yes I know, it’s kinda lame 'cos Germany often ends up without its bomber on G1 unlike just about any other version of Axis and Allies, and other things, but even so, just for balance.

If you can’t wrap your head around the Allied counter - take a step back for a moment yeah? Far as I know there IS no “hard counter” that always works. You have to look at dice outcomes, opponent buys and moves, and tailor your move to counter.

Say you’re trying to assume a “worst case” scenario for Allies. If you’re trying to plan around the worst case scenario, you assume you have to handle EVERYTHING going wrong, and what with dice results even assuming “reasonable” bad results probably results in a situation where the Allies DON’T really have a good line. If you’re trying to wrap your brain around that, then you just think yourself into a box.

Far as “stalling Japan” - I’d say don’t try it. If you tie up Russian units fighting for 1 IPC territories in the east, that’s Russian units NOT fighting for 2 IPC territories in the west. Even stalling Japan’s advance gets weird. Imagine Russia puts 4 infantry at Yakut (can’t be hit by Japanese transport drops). Okay. Then suppose Japan sticks 1 inf on Buryatia and another 2 on Soviet Far East. Now what? If Yakut pushes to Buryatia or SFE, they die on the Japanese counter at net loss to Russia. If Yakut doesn’t press, Japan kills it. Even if Japan committed less to Buryatia / SFE so Yakut can “stall” (say Japan only put 2 inf between the two territories instead of 3), it’s still 2 Japanese infantry tying up 4 Russian infantry, while Germany’s pressing in the west.

As to India, even anti-KJF Japan can put out 6 ground to India’s 3. You can defend India, sure - but then with competent Axis players I’d expect that to mean West Russia collapses faster. Particularly, if Germany holds Caucasus before UK evacuates India, then any UK stack can get cut off. And that’s really something you want to avoid. (There’s a few different varieties, but basically if you have some kind of major UK stack on India, you want it to join up with Russia safely. If you have a German stack on Cauc and a UK stack on India, if you move the UK stack to Persia, the German stack slaughters the UK stack at net loss to Allies. In SOME games that’s not the worst because that opens Caucasus up for Russian recapture, but the German stack on Persia plus any units Germany fed towards Ukraine get a counter - and normally that counter should be, like, huge. So it gets very weird. Anyways that’s why you evac India EARLIER, if you can move a India stack to Persia then to Caucasus or Kazakh BEFORE Germany or Japan can cut those territories off, then you have a big block of units that can help defend Russia - and in the KJF scenario it’s actually a big block of units that can join up with UK units coming off Atlantic for a potential breakout. (You might NOT be able to break out too btw.)

Baaasically I’d say in 1942 Online just KGF. Always KGF; if you think your opponent’s a noob or you don’t care if you win or lose, then go ahead and KJF, but it’s an uphill battle.

As to Atl, your basic Allied setup is US1 fleet build, US2 air build (if you want, or more fleet whatever). And the US2 fleet move is off Morocco maybe, and US1-US2 maybe you get US transports dropping to French West Africa - but you want UK (not US) to grab Morocco and Algeria etc. IF YOU CAN MANAGE IT. Anyways UK3 drops fleet, then US3 reinforces. Get the picture? Normally the timing on that is very awkward for Axis to counter, though it’s POSSIBLE off things like a J1 bomber buy . . . but then you know about it well in advance and at worst it changes the timing to US4 (but Japan also gets slowed in Asia)

Then you start dropping units alternating from E Can to Finland/Norway to build pressure. Then a lot changes depending on what the Axis do - how they did their air, what they did with their comps. Like if Germany rushed tanks then their defense of France is bound to be less solid - but you shouldn’t be greedy and grab it for income unless you’re starved for income with UK and can’t produce 8 units (plus 3 at India if you still have it) AND can split the Allied fleet. You need to pressure Axis off Karelia if you can at all help it WHILE ALSO keeping in mind Axis Karelia stack can shift into W Rus and other places while still cutting off UK/US landed troops from pressing in to relieve Russia TIMELY. There’s a buncha weird things you can do in there depending on Axis moves, ranging from attacks into retreats to “teleport” armies around, building fighters to rush defense . . . I won’t get into that here.

In closing - you need to say if you’re playing 1942 Online or TripleA/board game. Non-use of allied carriers is a big fat nasty thing. And you need to not use OOB unless you’re using a bid.

[fenderbender4]

@aardvarkpepper Thanks for the insight. I also wonder if the online version makes me a worse tabletop player as the dice system and the defensive rolls create frequent occurrences of “unlikely scenarios” that what I expect to happen deviates too much outside the norm.

I think too I get confused by seeing different people’s strategies only on a single turn basis, like people either take UKR on R1 or they just strafe which then affects (I would imagine) what you buy R1 and from there on out, knowing that it takes 3 Inf, 1 Art, 2 Ftrs, and 3 Tanks to take out all the pieces in Ukr (at least in online). Which then usually leads you stuck in taking the territory and losing remaining units on G1.

[aardvarkpepper]

@fenderbender4

1. 1942 Online? Or TripleA?

2. R1 hitting Ukr with everything possible leaves West Russia less secure. That doesn’t make it “wrong”, but it is something you should go in knowing, especially as if Germany does have odds on West Russia that opens the door to a lot of aggressive Axis openings.

[fenderbender4]

@aardvarkpepper said in Allies advice with an aggressive Japan:

@fenderbender4

1. 1942 Online? Or TripleA?

2. R1 hitting Ukr with everything possible leaves West Russia less secure. That doesn’t make it “wrong”, but it is something you should go in knowing, especially as if Germany does have odds on West Russia that opens the door to a lot of aggressive Axis openings.

1. Yeah 1942 Online. AI does wonky things. Some of them I imagine a good player would do, at other times nothing even
   a semi-sentient human would do.

2. Yeah, I agree with that assessment of Ukr on R1, part of it in my mind is maybe the setup as well. With the Larry Harris updated setup, there’s a chance to get rid of that bomber going full in. In the OOB setup, it becomes less ideal as at most you take out the land units and the one fighter.

[aardvarkpepper]

Noticed Panther (I assume) moved this thread and put up a sticky in 1942 v2 forum. Good on him.

@fenderbender4 Sent a PM.

[EricB]

If you are doing a KGF strategy, dealing with Japan isn’t the top priority. You’re just trying to slow them down and distract them. With the UK in India, don’t let Japan stack Burma. When they go in with land forces, hit them back. Have artillery in India.

I buy 1 of 3 options with the UK in round 1.

1. Carrier, Transport, 2 infantry, 1 artillery.
2. Carrier, Destroyer, 3 infantry.
3. 2 Fighters, 2 artillery, 1 infantry.

Option 1 is if there’s minimal threat to the UK fleet. Germany builds a med carrier for example, loses fighters or moves them east. 3 or fewer planes in range.

Option 2 is if there are 4 planes in range. I’m not risking a transport.

Option 3 is if there are 5 or more planes/subs that can hit Britain. Build fighters in round 1. If they move away you can build a fleet in round 2. If they add more planes like building bombers, then wait until round 3 for the US fleet to arrive before building a navy. If Germany’s building that many planes, their army will be thin.

Basically I’m saying don’t focus all your attention with the UK on Japan. UK needs to be hitting Germany. It’s closer and easier to hit. The goal of the British in Asia is to harass Japan and delay them. Keep them occupied with India if you can. If they ignore India move up to Persia to block them from stacking Kazakh. A Kazakh stack is dangerous because it threatens Caucuses and Russia forcing Russia to abandon Caucuses.

With Russia, their job is to kill lots of Germans in the first 3 rounds. Don’t sacrifice troops but make Germany pay if they are overaggressive with Russia in a KGF. After the US and UK are landing in Europe just defend with Russia against Germany. Shift 90% of Russia’s focus to Japan and let the UK/USA deal with Germany. If Germany is stupid enough to keep attacking Russia and spreading themselves thin, they’ll collapse even faster.

With Japan, try to keep them out of any territories bordering Russia. If Japan is ignoring Russia mostly and focused 100% on India, move some infantry down to India. If it takes until round 5 for Japan to get India you’ve done your job. If I see India’s going to fall, I pull back the troops to Persia, then Kazach or Caucuses.

If Russia’s struggling use the UK forces to back up Russia. Russia has to stay alive. If Russia is fine, the UK India forces can head to Europe to take out Germany.

The USA should be totally focused on Germany.