India Fleet to the Med?

Move the fleet into the Med.  I do this if I have Suez control even if the destroyer there was sunk.  Then, as the USA, go completely KJF, just maintaining a garrison of infantry on the west coast and west canada.  Asll of your IPC’s should be directed towards europe.

Move into the Med and then after I eliminate the German threat in Africa move back into India and threatan Japanese islands.

A move into the Med’s a pretty good option to force the German player to deplete air and navy, but that option comes at the cost of a Japan in a far stronger position.

By this, I refer to the sub at the Solomons that the UK sub (and possibly fighter) can attack to force the Japs to commit more to Pearl; any additional air committed to Pearl means less air that can hit Russia on J1 and J2.  (because the fighters have to fly back from the carriers).

Also, I refer to the Jap transport off Kwangtung.  That single transport can pop the infantry and artillery into Asia on J1, which can make the precarious early position of the Allies in eastern Asia entirely untenable.

Of course, the UK profits from not losing Africa early, so is in a far better position to start attacking Germany very early.

Yes, attack! Take the bomber with you and land it in Transjordan afterwards.

This is a different scenario. Well in case Germany nailed the Des and failed to take egpt.

If not move in anyway. G will lose tra and figs to preserve its btls on the attack. That also means no additional troops to Africa, wich is a good thing.

On the Japs… well what effect does this fleet have against the most powerful navy in game. I always considered it quit useles.

@xenon:

This is a different scenario. Well in case Germany nailed the Des and failed to take egpt.

If not move in anyway. G will lose tra and figs to preserve its btls on the attack. That also means no additional troops to Africa, wich is a good thing.

On the Japs… well what effect does this fleet have against the most powerful navy in game. I always considered it quit useles.

It’s been almost a month since I played a game.  But if I recall right, you have a sub and transport off Australia, and a carrier, fighter, destroyer, and transport off India.  As well as yet another destroyer in the Med, which I will not mention further because you said it got nailed.

A fleet of transport, sub, destroyer, carrier, and two fighters is pretty damn good.  The US can attack with a far weaker position, and rely on the UK to move in on the next turn to fortify.

If you UNIFY the UK Pacific fleet, Japan is stronger for the following few turns against Asia (since the UK didn’t deplete Japan’s units), but the US can start seriously attacking in the Pacific much much earlier.

Hmmm.

I had the opportunity to bring the British into the Med on UK1 in the game I am playing vs BalungaLoaf right now and chose not to.

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=9006.0

Bringing the UK Indian Ocean fleet within range of the Luftwaffe early in the game did not seem like a good idea.

Here is a Frood-nalysis of a hypothetical Axis Med fleet with Luftwaffe vs the Combined UK East Med and IO fleet.

http://frood.net/aacalc/?mustland=0&abortratio=0&saveunits=0&strafeunits=0&aInf=&aArt=&aArm=&aFig=4&aBom=1&aTra=1&aSub=1&aDes=&aCar=&aBat=1&adBat=&dInf=&dArt=&dArm=&dFig=2&dBom=&dTra=1&dSub=&dDes=2&dCar=1&dBat=&ddBat=&ool_att=Bat-Inf-Art-Arm-Tra-Sub-SSub-Fig-JFig-Des-Bom-HBom-Car-dBat&ool_def=Bat-Inf-Art-Arm-Tra-Sub-SSub-Bom-HBom-Des-Fig-JFig-Car-dBat&battle=Run&rounds=&reps=1000&luck=pure&ruleset=LHTR&gameid=&password=&turnid=&territory=&round=1&pbem=

Attacker: 4 Fig, 1 Bom, 1 Tra, 1 Sub, 1 Bat. v. Defender: 2 Fig, 1 Tra, 2 Des, 1 Car.
A. survives: 96.6% D. survives: 2.5% No one survives: 0.9%

I like my decision.

But germany will still lose some stuff in the process of taking out the fleet.  The fleet isnt there to survive , its there for a distraction.  Its a big target.

Every time I keep the fleet in the indian ocean intact, it goes something like this:  I keep the fleet down there to keep japan on their toes and playing fair (no unguarded transports), I never get an opportunity, then I end up getting chased around by a japanese fleet and wishing I could do something more productive than just running away.

@polywog:

I agree. As the UK, I would rather tie down the Germans or force them into a fight by moving into the Med. In the game I’m in there are only 2 German fighters in range of a counter attack, which makes the odds a lot less favorable. As the Germans, I probably wouldn’t attempt this (and be stuck with a big fleet blocking access to Africa for at least another turn).

By the way, my opponent (the UK player) made his move and did not move the fleet to the Med. He moved most to Rhodesia SZ 33 for some reason ???

Lucky you  :lol:

I would have to concur.  The allies simply cannot compete with Japans navy in the first round of the game.  So instead of throwing expesive ships away to make new reefs (this does not help win the war), keep the initiative in Europe and force Germany to do what you want her to do.

The British Indian Ocean fleet is an example of the fine balancing of this game.  Take it to the Med. and you leave Japan unhindered and speed it’s arrival on the Asian continent.  Sacrific it to slow Japan down (and if successful, it DOES slow Japan down), and you have a difficult time getting “cannon fodder” within range of the German Med. Fleet in order to kill it.  I would rarely put the fleet in position to get killed with Axis air combined with the Axis Med. Fleet, but if you control the Suez, you control which fleet attacks the other.  It is well worth it to kill that Axis Med. Fleet if the opportunity presents itself.  It will save Russia a lot of grief not having that fleet landing troops in Ukraine and the Caucuses.  Try getting fleet into the Med from the other direction – there is no Suez canal to protect your fleet in that direction.

The point is, no matter which way you go, you present the Axis with opportunities they would not have if you had chosen differently.  That cannot be helped – it’s the nature of the game.  The trick is to capitalize on the opportunities presented to you.

I agree, move into the med and prevent Germany from exploiting Africa at all.

Focus 100% of all efforts on KGF instead of dedicating 8-16 IPC a round from America to Pacific builds. (I like putting 8 to 16 in the Pacific because it’s easy enough to move it to the Atlantic in an emergency, but it prevents Japan from moving into the Med, period.)

I like to make the other guy do the difficult decisons.  This game is all about who makes the first serious mistake.  Give your opponent lots of opportunities to do just that.  :evil:

The approach I am taking right now has the combined IO and Austrialian fleet assembled in SZ30. Â

*** South Compass Seazone (SEI/Z30)
2 Trn, 4 Inf, 1 Des, 2 Ftr, 1 AC, 1 Sub

This gives me a pretty powerful Carrier/Amphib battlegroup and it can put troops into New Guinea, East Indies, India, Persia, Trans-Jordan, Anglo-Egypt down to Union of South Africa.

Even with the Trans being protected, it has 5 units with an offensive punch of 12 and a defensive punch of 16.
As a landing force, it has 4 Inf and 2 Fig, for a offensive punch of 10 over 6 units (high skew).  As a reinforcing group on defense, the 4 Inf add 8 punch and if the Fig are commited 16 points of defensive punch.

Obviously, it does no good for the UK fleet to spend the rest of the game in SZ 30.  But being there at the end of UK1, it greatly complicates the decisions of the Axis player.  G1 ended with Anglo-Egypt in UK hands.  J1 ended with India in Japanese hands and a Pearl II operation.  US1 ended with the Pearl II force gone (1 sub, 1dest, 1cv, 2 fig & 1bb) and a single US bb in SZ52.  US also built a CV, 2 Tra and a Fig in SZ10 to deal with crossing the Atlantic.

Now the Axis is faced with three CV battlegroups (UK built a CV in SZ3 to cover the Trans that delivered forces to Nwy).

With VC being 9 and the Axis having 8 right now, the Axis has to decide where it will concentrate to get that 9th VC and they need to hang on to the 8 they have.  The UK is threatening both Leningrad and Calcutta.  Moscow is at least a turn away from a direct threat and the US is defending London and geared up to take the fight to the Germans. Â

KGF looks good but the option for a slower KJF is still on the board, making G2 and J2 difficult decisions for the Axis player.  Even if Moscow falls in two turns (unlikely) the Axis will have great difficulty keeping both Leningrad and Calcutta.  A slower assualt on Moscow that puts more protection into Leningrad and Calcutta plays into the Allies hands with their higher IPC (94 v 72).

It will be interesting.

There are some wild cards on the table.  
Germany can attempt a SeaLion but the US forces in the UK give poor odds of winning,  and the US Atlantic fleet is positioned to retake London.  Germany can also attempt a Canadian Shield  that would delay the US a turn at the cost of the majority of the German navy.  Germany could also send it’s Med fleet into the South Atlantic toward Brazil or Africa.  That would be an interesting gambit but not one with obvious VC gain.  Finally Germany can send it’s Med fleet to the Black Sea as part of a push for Moscow surrending the Med (and the AfrikaKorps) to the US.

Japan is in a more awkward spot.  It only has naval parity with the UK fleet and can ill afford the time, transports and units to deal with a Manila threatening island hopping campaign in the Pacific.  It needs to concentrate on putting pressure on the USSR but with the UK fleet in the IO and the risk of a US fleet on the West Coast there are a lot of distractions.

I am definitely looking forward to G2.

In my current game with Frimmel, I failed to take Egypt on G1 (UK held with 1tnk, 1fgt).  UK moved their fleet to the Med killing my German BB & TP in sz15.  That ended any hope of German moves into Africa, but it left the Japanese free to move into the IO.  Japan now controls the southern half of Africa while the allies control the North.  It may have been a good thing that Germany was forced to concentrate on Europe rather than spend resources in Africa.

I agree, Baghdaddy.  The British Empire can be quite formidable in the Pacific, especially with American pressure, and all for a minimal investment of 1 IC and a couple of infantry a round. (Might be best to put them in Australia to protect the IC, but India is perfectly viable as well.)

BalungaLoaf did not mount an attack on AE.  Instead he focused on the BB in the West Med.  He has brought over more ground forces and he bid an Armor in North Africa as well.

My IO fleet could not reach his Med fleet and the ground forces are too strong for direct confrontation at this point.  Pulling back the AE forces, except for one Inf, to concentrate for an expected push into Africa, while at the same time setting the IO/Aus fleet as a counter punch for either Africa or a Japanese push seemed like a good approach.

Right now, he has 3 Inf, 2 Art, and 1 Arm in North Africa but has not moved on AE.  That is 22 IPC holding down 2 IPC worth of territory.  If he sends it into AE (with no losses) the counter punch is 5 Inf, 1 Arm, 2 Fig.  85% chance of recovery with destruction of the AfrikaKorps…  Add US forces landing in Algeria and Germany is contained to Europe.