Table Manners

I suppose it depends really on how bad the situation is. It also depends on how much time you have to game. I don’t think anyone should resign after the first turn. I also don’t think it is cool to make your opponents play out an unwinable position. The problem of course is if there is disagreement on this point or if the player in the better position underestimates how good that position is.

I’m in any game for three rounds at least no matter how bad turn one went. But I just like to play. I think often that it is a big puzzle that I’m looking for an answer to. Going a few turns past an “obvious” place to resign can give you a feel for what may have been odd other than the dice. A feel for the kind of things to do if just one of those went wrong. You have something to learn even from losing. Often I think that my real opponent in any game is myself. Even if I can’t win I still can play my best or at the least have fun. Also I think that if you win “all the time” or often in your group it is good form to take your lumps.

You can always just put pieces back on the board if you don’t want to set up and start again.

I tend to always try to give the dice a chance to even out.

I have played several turns beyond knowing my butt was kicked.

But once there is no doubt (the inexorable German crunch with no offensive forces capable of a break-out, Japan being steadily forced further and further back in Asia, UK ringed by the Kreigsmarine, Japan building in Los Angeles, Germany and Japan having massed forces adjacent to Moscow and Moscow thinly held with no Allied assitance within 2 moves of Moscow…  Under those circumstances an honrable surrender is not out of line.

I always offer the person to restart from Russia 1 in really horrible round 1 cases.  Even if it’s decent round one but atrocious round 2 I’ll make the offer.  Original bid stands, no changes to initial board set up, but what fun is it if Germany’s down 4 planes, Japan lost a BB/Carrier and 3 planes attacking China/EPO and America still has a carrier in Hawaii while England’s looking at Germany behind two battleships?

Resignation is a valid move.

If it’s a face to face game, and it’s early in the night, resignation lets you set up for a second game.  If it’s at the midpoint, you can switch to another game that won’t take a long time.  If it’s late - well, it was late anyways, might as well wrap it up.

Generally, I think it is best for inexperienced players to play the game out, to get a feel for how to best finish the game effectively.  (It is valuable experience.)  But if both players are really very good, there’s no need to play it out.

Let’s say Russia does the following:

3 Infantry, 1 Fighter, 1 Armor to E. Europe
6 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor to W. Russia
3 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 2 Armor, 1 Fighter to Ukraine

Now, let’s say they got no hits on Round 1 and Germany got 4 hits in E. Europe; 5 hits in W. Russia and 6 hits in Ukraine leaving round 2 of battle as such:

E. Europe: 1 Fighter attacking 2 Infantry, 1 Armor, 1 Fighter
W. Russia: 1 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor attacking 3 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor
Ukraine: 1 Fighter attacking 3 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor, 1 Fighter

Would you not offer to restart the game at that point?  Or would you force them to capitulate or play it out?  How would that be fun at that point?

Yes, resignation is fine by me.  Switch listed the most common terms players resign under.  However, for some odd reason, some axis players insist on playing the game out after the other axis power has fallen, which in most cases, is just mind boggling.

I wouldnt resign after a bad first move though,  Id let it play out for another turn or two before I make up my mind over how bad the situation is.

IF there is a capital trade, and teh surviving Axis power was already well over $60 IPC before the Capital Trade, it might be worth playing on.  Otherwise it is certain death.

@ncscswitch:

IF there is a capital trade, and teh surviving Axis power was already well over $60 IPC before the Capital Trade, it might be worth playing on.  Otherwise it is certain death.

But thats kind of a big ‘if’….how often does that situation really come along?  Even if it did, with every allied power diverting all attention to one nation, it would probably just be a loooong, dragged out defeat of the Axis.

That is why you HAVE to have that huge income BEFORE the capital trade, so that you are near $100 IPC for teh immediate post-trade build, and with an income at or above $80 immediately after the trade.

Otherwise, you lose.

When dealing with the “lost will to fight” vs “you could still win” situation one option you have not mentioned is the player flip.

When playing against my son, he will occasionally find himself in a position where things seem hopeless.  I offer to “swap sides” as a way to keep the game going in a situation where I believe there is still some fight left in the losing side.  This gives the weaker player a chance to see just how challenging it can be to manage a IPC burning three front offensive and allows the stronger player a chance to work on the agressive defense game.

Either that or graciously allow the game to end in a fashion that preserves honor and dignity for the other play so that there will be a rematch soon.

@Jennifer:

Let’s say Russia does the following:

3 Infantry, 1 Fighter, 1 Armor to E. Europe
6 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor to W. Russia
3 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 2 Armor, 1 Fighter to Ukraine

Now, let’s say they got no hits on Round 1 and Germany got 4 hits in E. Europe; 5 hits in W. Russia and 6 hits in Ukraine leaving round 2 of battle as such:

E. Europe: 1 Fighter attacking 2 Infantry, 1 Armor, 1 Fighter
W. Russia: 1 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor attacking 3 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor
Ukraine: 1 Fighter attacking 3 Infantry, 1 Artillery, 1 Armor, 1 Fighter

Would you not offer to restart the game at that point?  Or would you force them to capitulate or play it out?  How would that be fun at that point?Â

So USSR makes an overly-agressive move. Fails. Now USSR wants to restart? Perhaps to get better dice?

And what if USSR every piece and Germany wiffed. Would Germany want to restart?

You learn by making bad moves, and by trying out strategies in “hopeless” situations.

To the OP:

I play mostly in tournaments. In such cases, resigning early would be bad form, yet resinging after a significant time (especially in later SE rounds) is accepted so that the winner can have a break.

Nevertheless, I always see the “challenge” : can I make a game of it given this position. Look at it that way and it can still be “fun”.

I am normaly willing to play as long as my opponent.  If I think there is no chance of winning an my opponent asks if I want to conceed I usualy will, because I can see he is probably bored, But I will play a losing game to the finnish if my opponent wants to.

I also have no problem accepting a concession, it’s no fun to make someone play when they don’t want to.

@Baghdaddy:

When dealing with the “lost will to fight” vs “you could still win” situation one option you have not mentioned is the player flip.

When playing against my son, he will occasionally find himself in a position where things seem hopeless.  I offer to “swap sides” as a way to keep the game going in a situation where I believe there is still some fight left in the losing side.  This gives the weaker player a chance to see just how challenging it can be to manage a IPC burning three front offensive and allows the stronger player a chance to work on the agressive defense game.

Either that or graciously allow the game to end in a fashion that preserves honor and dignity for the other play so that there will be a rematch soon.

This is a great idea, I may try this…

I started doing this with chess with my kids.  I told them they were allowed to switch sides with me once during any game.

That worked well until my daughter waited all the way until I had said “checkmate” and then she said “It is time to switch sides, Daddy”.

Not just a pretty face, my daughter.

Since she is less than 6 months away from being 15, I think I am already in a world of hurt.