That’s the point though. Sea Lion is an objective for Germany but there is no justification for doing while the USSR is still a credible threat because once you capture London, there is no way in hell you can defend against the US liberation and the Soviet invasion. Hence, just don’t do it. I am only suggesting that if one wanted to do an early Sea Lion, you will need Japan to put so much pressure on USSR that Germany can focus completely on US thus Japan will lose in the Pacific. I agree Sea Lion isn’t a wise move.
The Japan Playbook
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Yeah I do not attack Hawaii either, I just defend japan with 1 sub 2 destroyers and 3 fighters on Japan. Kamikaze rolls and such makes the 3 transport buy safe.
It is to take islands quicker. I generally prefer J1 over J2 DOW…. unless the allies put a serious bid that forces me to focus on China more.
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@Cow:
Sino Russian opener. This is for players that like waiting till japan 3 to DOW on western allies, because if you are going to wait to dow on western allies until j3, you may as well clear out china and russia while you wait.
…Oh yeah you don’t need to bring the xports up top if russia stacked 10+ units on amur, you just kill it and do the usual J2 DOW
In the game I’m playing now, on G1 I did the sea lion/feint opener. UK scrambled and lost all 3 fighters. So now I’m serious about sea lion. Meanwhile R1 ended with 16 inf in Amur and 2 in Siberia. It’s not that I “like waiting” to do a J3 DOW, but this situation seems ideal for not doing a J1 DOW to delay US.
I took Amur, dropped an inf and tank in Soviet Far East, and for non-combat move tried to set up for a J2 DOW based on your snippy.png pic.
This is the 2nd time I’ve played Japan so, if you happen to have some free time on your hands :wink: :wink:, I have two requests - would you please post:
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more detail in the Sino Russian opener, including when Russia stacks Amur with 10+ on R1?
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the “usual” setup for J2 DOW (cmon, here’s a reason to finally update that opener in the playbook :-D) Besides, I couldn’t find any J2 DOW setup via forum search.
THANKS!
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There is no “usual” J2 since what you do on J2 depends on what the Allies did. The R1 Amur stack tends to change the game alot, especially when Japan chooses to attack it J1 as you did.
Whether or not you want to 1) Sea Lion and/or 2) declare on J2 depends on what the Allies did on UK1 and USA1. There are many variables at play. But in general, if USA is in position to potentially disrupt your Sea Lion then it might be worth it to wait till J3 (or J4) to declare.
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If you attack Russian units on J1, you are going to war on J3. So on your J2 move your transports in position to take some territories for round 3.
Declare war on round 3. Round 2 you do not have transports in position to take territories. Round 3 you can start progressing on the islands and all (they may have declared war on you with anzac after UK put destroyers where your transports are preventing you from loading, so you may have to keep a few loaded on J2).
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It has been a long time since anyone has stacked amur against me.
That is pretty much the only thing that can keep me from declaring war on Japan 1 against everyone, except neutrals.
Generally speaking I do not like to do siberia when Germany is doing sea lion. It is really bad. If I am doing siberia I want Russia dead on round 6. That is my game plan.
Think of it this way if Japan is not blowing up and pushing for a VC win then there is no pressure for the USA to do anything in the Pacific. So you give it time to liberate london and that makes no sense at all. It is a good move by the Russians to stack Amur if it believes you are doing sea lion or to make you go Russia instead of London.
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I would much rather do a normal setup. You can still J1 DOW just make sure you have a big enough stack in Manchuria to defend.
In fact it is more optimal to get Japan going ASAP. The longer it takes for USA to liberate london…. the worse things look for him in the Pacific. Generally speaking if sea lion is successful, you are going to win in the Pacific.
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I J1 DOW even when Germany goes sea lion. Great success. I believe in the J1 DOW to the fullest. I have never lost an axis game doing J1 dow in a league or tournament game. Sample size of roughly 20. Sea lion + J1 DOW = USA has huge problems. -
TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 3.9
Game History
Round: 1
Purchase Units - Japanese
Japanese buy 3 transports; Remaining resources: 6 SuicideAttackTokens; 5 PUs;Politics - Japanese
Japanese takes Political Action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Americans from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and British from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and UK_Pacific from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and ANZAC from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and Dutch from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Japanese and French from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Germans and Americans from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Italians and Americans from Neutrality to War
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and British from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and UK_Pacific from Concordant to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and French from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and ANZAC from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Chinese and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for British and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for UK_Pacific and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for ANZAC and Americans from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and French from Neutrality to Allied
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Dutch from Neutrality to Friendly
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Allies from Neutrality to Friendly_Neutral
Japanese succeeds on action: Political Action Japanese To War With Allies: Changing Relationship for Americans and Neutral_Axis from Neutrality to Unfriendly_Neutral
Trigger Russians Allied Americans 5: Changing Relationship for Russians and Americans from Neutrality to AlliedCombat Move - Japanese
Trigger Japanese Unrestricted Movement: Setting movementRestrictionTerritories cleared for rulesAttatchment attached to Japanese
1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Kwangsi to Yunnan
2 infantry moved from Siam to French Indo China
Japanese take French Indo China from French
1 infantry moved from Kiangsi to 20 Sea Zone
1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 20 Sea Zone to 43 Sea Zone
1 infantry moved from 43 Sea Zone to Borneo
1 cruiser moved from 20 Sea Zone to 37 Sea Zone
1 fighter moved from Formosa to 37 Sea Zone
2 bombers moved from Japan to 37 Sea Zone
1 infantry moved from Okinawa to 19 Sea Zone
1 artillery moved from Manchuria to 19 Sea Zone
1 artillery, 1 battleship, 1 destroyer, 1 infantry, 1 submarine and 1 transport moved from 19 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
1 armour and 1 infantry moved from Japan to 6 Sea Zone
1 armour, 1 battleship, 2 carriers, 1 cruiser, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from 6 Sea Zone to 35 Sea Zone
1 armour, 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from 35 Sea Zone to Philippines
1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Kiangsi to Kwangtung
1 infantry moved from Kiangsi to Hunan
1 infantry moved from Jehol to Chahar
Japanese take Chahar from Chinese
1 infantry moved from Shantung to Anhwe
Japanese take Anhwe from Chinese
1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Shantung to Anhwe
1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Kiangsu to Yunnan
2 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers moved from Manchuria to Hunan
1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Jehol to Chahar
1 mech_infantry moved from Manchuria to Chahar
1 infantry moved from Kiangsu to Kiangsi
1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Kiangsu to Anhwe
2 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers moved from 6 Sea Zone to Kwangtung
1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from 33 Sea Zone to Philippines
1 fighter moved from Korea to Japan
1 tactical_bomber moved from Japan to 35 Sea Zone
1 tactical_bomber moved from Japan to Kwangtung
1 fighter moved from Okinawa to 35 Sea Zone
1 fighter moved from Japan to KwangtungCombat - Japanese
Battle in 35 Sea Zone
Japanese attack with 2 battleships, 2 carriers, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 1 fighter, 1 submarine, 1 tactical_bomber and 2 transports
Americans defend with 1 destroyer and 1 submarine
Units damaged: 1 battleship owned by the Japanese
Japanese win with 2 battleships, 2 carriers, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 1 fighter, 1 submarine, 1 tactical_bomber and 2 transports remaining. Battle score for attacker is 14
Casualties for Americans: 1 destroyer and 1 submarine
Battle in Philippines
Japanese attack with 1 armour, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 2 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
Americans defend with 1 airfield, 1 fighter, 1 harbour and 2 infantry
Japanese win, taking Philippines from Americans with 1 armour, 1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 6
Casualties for Japanese: 1 artillery and 2 infantry
Casualties for Americans: 1 fighter and 2 infantry
Battle in Hunan
Japanese attack with 2 fighters, 1 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers
Chinese defend with 2 infantry
Japanese win with 2 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry
Casualties for Chinese: 2 infantry
Battle in Borneo
Battle in Kwangtung
Japanese attack with 1 artillery, 3 fighters, 1 infantry and 3 tactical_bombers
British defend with 1 harbour and 2 infantry
Japanese win, taking Borneo from UK_Pacific, taking Kwangtung from UK_Pacific with 1 artillery, 2 fighters and 3 tactical_bombers remaining. Battle score for attacker is -7
Casualties for Japanese: 1 fighter and 1 infantry
Casualties for British: 2 infantry
Battle in Yunnan
Japanese attack with 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber
Chinese defend with 4 infantry
Japanese win, taking Yunnan from Chinese with 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 3 infantry and 1 tactical_bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 12
Casualties for Chinese: 4 infantry
Battle in 37 Sea Zone
Japanese attack with 2 bombers, 1 cruiser and 1 fighter
British defend with 1 battleship
Japanese win with 2 bombers and 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8
Casualties for Japanese: 1 cruiser
Casualties for British: 1 battleshipNon Combat Move - Japanese
2 bombers moved from 37 Sea Zone to Kwangsi
1 fighter moved from 37 Sea Zone to 43 Sea Zone
1 carrier and 1 destroyer moved from 33 Sea Zone to 43 Sea Zone
1 tactical_bomber moved from 35 Sea Zone to 43 Sea Zone
1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Philippines to 35 Sea Zone
2 fighters and 2 tactical_bombers moved from Hunan to Kwangsi
2 fighters and 3 tactical_bombers moved from Kwangtung to Kwangsi
1 fighter and 1 tactical_bomber moved from Yunnan to Kwangsi
4 infantry moved from Korea to Manchuria
1 aaGun and 6 infantry moved from Manchuria to JeholPlace Units - Japanese
3 transports placed in 6 Sea ZoneTurn Complete - Japanese
Japanese collect 40 PUs; end with 45 PUs total -
I sent an extra tactical fighter to sz 35 instead of to kwangtung. Ignore that. Just put it on kwangtung attacking or keep it on Japan if you are paranoid about America attacking.
If USA does attack your little fleet, 3 kamikaze dd 3 kamikaze cruiser. You will most likely get both of the naval units and wipe the remaining ships defending at the loss of a few units.
IT is actually a big risk for both sides. I play for speed so I like to gamble with the odds in my favor, global takes too long to finish otherwise.
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I find that people new to Japan and want to learn how to play it will do J1 DOW, because it can be relatively strait forward. You take islands, you make money, the end.
Experienced players tend to do J2, unless G1 went really bad for them… in which case they will do J1 and try to bang out a win that way.
The reason experienced players lean towards a J2 is because you can get diced doing a J1 DOW, Like the bship can get 2 hits, Phil can sometimes score 4 hits. Kwangtung can be annoying with snake eyes, yunnan can get 4 hits and make you sad a little.
~In a low luck game, J1 DOW is the most optimal decision. All your attacks go smoothly, you need only 2 fighters on Japan to defend. Everything perfectly calculated. The bship dies in one round of combat hits the cruiser 2/3 games and the other 1/3 you have a cruiser alive (yay). Everything is good.
J1 DOW low luck games, all day every day. I do not care if Russia supports china or what have you. I do it because I want money and I want India making less money sooner. I am taking India rounds 4-6 depending on what juicy attacks the allies want to give me or not give me.
Sometimes you have to make a choice to be defensive and keep USA from getting a foothold in Korea / Japan sea zone… or to just take India and kick him out later. Like those are legitimate decisions you face and you can go either way on that one. Personally I prefer to knock out Calcutta and deal with USA later (bring german bombers to the Pacific this prevents those lone destroyers from blocking your entire fleet).
Yes German bombers in the Pacific are critical, bring them over after Germany takes russia unless something went wrong in Europe and you are betting on Japan winning… then by all means bring bombers over sooner than later.
~Funny story, I attacked Russia with 20 tanks and missed 17 of them… Russians hit almost all their dice… I only had one option left… win in the Pacific within the next two rounds… had 9 german bombers in China after that failed attack… 9 German bombers was the difference between me taking Hawaii and me losing the game. He could not block my naval. I could not be stopped and the 9 german bombers suicide attacked before Japan went ALL IN. I sunk his naval barely and took Hawaii.
Good times. If I had more time I would out maneuver him and go Carolines to threaten New South Wales and Hawaii.
Another game I had German bombers defending the Kiangsu because I took New South Wales after Calcutta and I needed to hold all the VCs. Rolling 6 bombers and 2 japan fighters against 8 usa attackers… I DEFENDED! He was so mad.
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Wow - thanks guys for taking the time to post such details.
Based on your feedback, I’m thinking declare on J3. Time to get loaded transports and air support in position. It’s possible to declare on J2 and go for Philippines and Malaya. But isn’t waiting to J3 better if I am A) more prepared, and B) if UK or Anzac DOW turn 2 that puts the US out until turn 4 which would be great.
Other points. Game is low luck. My intention with Russia was for one turn only, with potential for gaining IPCs up north without spending too much more. US1 saw a transport, carrier, and tac go in at Eastern US so no disruption to sea lion coming that way.
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Interesting. Try J1 DOW next time. USA can only send 1 bomber to reinforce london anyway. Sometimes they send a fighter to iceland.
If they do not, well easy sea lion and your pacific is full throttle.
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Need your help COW.
1. We are as far as China in Rd1.
2. I’m setting up for a full Sea Lion G3.
3. I did J1 and have all units where they should be. I couldn’t take Hunnan, bad rolls.
USA moved all ships next to California to the Bahamas. Only Hawaiin fleet left in Pacific.
Do I take Australia now?
Also, he’s going FULLL atlantic. I need help with G2. I bought 1CV 2TT G1.
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Either Calcutta or ANZAC is fine. Both are good. If you go for ANZAC you can go for Hawaii and can block him from reclaiming hawaii with destroyers so you can pick up the quick 6 VC win.
The benefits of taking ANZAC is that for 9 ipc a round (3inf buy), you can make it really hard to liberate for the allies… and that is what you make off that island so it pays for itself.
The drawback is your fleet get scattered.
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To take ANZAC you either have boatloads of men going from Japan to Caroline to New South Wales or you land a bunch of dudes in western australia then fly your entire airforce over a round later then attack.
I prefer to take India first. If he is giving you new south wales, by all means, take it.
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What should my J2 purchase be?
I’m thinking a minor in Fic. Not sure what else. Only 2nd time playing with Japanese
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Also, is there a way to post pics via android?
I need help with G2 as well.
I have 72 I believe. Im think 6 or more TT and a DD or so. Maybe a SBomber.
I guess my question is, where is the optimal positioning for German troops by end G2 so they can maximize attaxk G3
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If you are playing a live game, just trust your instincts. Be fearless. That is the best way to learn.
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Yeah, it is a live game.
I just need a little help with J2 purchases
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@Cow:
If you are playing a live game, just trust your instincts. Be fearless. That is the best way to learn.
Best strategic advice ^^ Sometimes I purposely play “experiment” games where I know I have a good chance at losing. But I learn from those games and can synthesize all my new ideas into a stronger future game and it makes me a better player in the long run. Also, I look at how people have beaten me and there’s no shame in copying errrr I mean “learning” from them too.
When I started A&A I lost all the time, now I am a decent player in my group because I just try things out. It’s only a board game :P
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It is hard to say without seeing the board.
minor factory is nice. more boats with men. fighters. Can never go wrong buying more fighters. airbase or naval base if you need the extra movement to do a big attack.
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Would the minor and airbase both be in FIC?
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