My KJF Strategy

[dondoolee]

I think the million dollar question is how long do you need Russia to survive.  It would be valuable information to figure out how long Russia can hold out on a 3 V 1 type game.  Just have Russia (and maybe China) set up and go against all 3 Axis, just to see how long you can hold out, to at least get an idea as to what you are looking at.

Another thing to, should you actually KJF, or just neutralize it?  The actual taking the Japanese capital could turn into a nightmare.

Still though, I think the key is to figure out a UK balancing act, America could still probably afford to send over the occasional transport over to the West as well

[jsp4563]

@dondoolee:

I think the million dollar question is how long do you need Russia to survive.  It would be valuable information to figure out how long Russia can hold out on a 3 V 1 type game.  Just have Russia (and maybe China) set up and go against all 3 Axis, just to see how long you can hold out, to at least get an idea as to what you are looking at.

Another thing to, should you actually KJF, or just neutralize it?  The actual taking the Japanese capital could turn into a nightmare.

Still though, I think the key is to figure out a UK balancing act, America could still probably afford to send over the occasional transport over to the West as well

I’m coming to the conclusion that the Allies can’t really choose a KxF strategy.  Doing so leaves one or more of the Axis to become too powerful.  Especially in a National Objective game which favors the Axis.  My experience has been a more balanced approach works better.

[Lucifer]

What I learned so far in AA50 is that if Russia falls to either Germany or Japan, its not enough for allies to keep Italy.
Allies must then take most of Europe and I can’t see that happening unless Germany is in deep trouble.

Every capital in AA50 is mostly as important as in AAR, except Rome. If you can take and keep a capital, and not lose any own capitals, then you win the game.

[Jennifer]

No, you just need the one transport for island hopping.  Why leave your forces behind?  Just keep bringing them along with you.  If it comes down to it, you can more readily replace a fighter than an infantryman, so take those as casualties if you are winning instead.

The time to build more transports is when you want to take Japan itself.  Honestly, I don’t normally get to that point, usually when America has Japan whittled down to Japan and maybe a piece of China or an island left, they need to turn around and pump out equipment to finish off Germany (which is easier to kill since it’s on the land and not an island that has to be amphibiously assaulted!)

[bugoo]

Jenn: How do you keep japan out of India so they don’t get there 3rd NO?  Or do you just go for the south pacific IPCs and leave japan alone in FIC/India/Etc?

[Jennifer]

I don’t.

Japan can take Australia to get the 3rd NO if they want too.

If you are desperate to keep India, then put an IC there with England round 1 and move Russian infantry/armor in there for a turn or two until it’s established.  That usually keeps Japan at bay for a while.

The trade off, of course, is that the money and equipment is NOT being used against Germany and Italy.

[dondoolee]

@Subotai:

What I learned so far in AA50 is that if Russia falls to either Germany or Japan, its not enough for allies to keep Italy.
Allies must then take most of Europe and I can’t see that happening unless Germany is in deep trouble.

Every capital in AA50 is mostly as important as in AAR, except Rome. If you can take and keep a capital, and not lose any own capitals, then you win the game.

I agree that holding Rome is definatly less in value than holding moscow.  One of the Axis’ greatest strengths is having a power they can sacrifice if need be.  I have allowed the Allies to take Italy before, so I could get one more turn at putting more pressure on Russia, it is just that much more valuable.

And the more I think about it, the more I think a Neuter Japan First strategy is probably the way to go if you want to think along a more “pacific centric” strat, I don’t think you have enough time to do a KJF strat in most games to win them.

[Upside-down_Turtle]

@Rammstein:

Hi all

I just want to say that what bothered me the most about previous versions of A&A was the KGF strat and the fact that Japan had to go for Moscow while the US ignored her. There was very little action in the Pacific theater. AA50 is by far the most viable version to allow for a Pacific war.

My strategy is very simple, and could probably be tweaked here and there for efficiency. I’m not getting turn specific here because the strategy is fairly open.
This is how I played it though:

1. Russia does what it always does, survives as long as possible. I mostly buy infantry and withdraw as Germany advances. The idea is to build up as much defense fodder as possible for the ultimate defense of Moscow. In fact, when I played it I never attacked German troops once.
2. The UK buys nothing but fighters and sends them to Russia. I borrowed this idea from AA Europe where my friends and I would buy nothing but fighters as the Allies and send them to Russia. If Germany’s tank stack could not crush the Russian infantry/fighter stack in Moscow she would run out of steam and Russia could spring forward. Try to hold off Italy in Africa and Japan in India as long as possible.
3. The USA goes all out on Japan with everything it has, including all the east coast stuff.

At first I tried this strategy in 1942 but I found that Germany was too strong and could defeat Russia quickly. Russia doesn’t have enough fodder. In 41 Russia has more time to retreat and build up reserves. Plus the Allies start with their full incomes, which allows the UK to purchase 4 fighters on UK1 instead of 3.

My main problem is how to defeat Japan with the USA. I know that eventually it can be done, but I want to know the most efficient way of doing so. I’ve heard several people say that it’s a cakewalk, but I disagree. I find in either 41 or 42 that Japan is so damn strong naval wise. She has so many fighters that buying cheap carriers drastically bolsters her naval defense. The USA has to spend more IPCs to match this power. I also found that by the time USA liberates the 4 IPC islands etc that Japan is hardly affected because she is deep in Asia at this point. If anyone has a strong anti-japan strategy for the USA I would be very interested to hear it.

My strategy may not be perfect, maybe the UK would be better off landing troops in Europe? BTW I never play with techs or NOs as i feel they could unbalance the game too much in favor of the Axis. I haven’t tried NOs with this strat though, so who knows…
Has anyone tried this idea yet? I’d love to hear other KJF strats, or just how to defeat Japan as USA alone.

Thanks

PS. One thing I like about AA50 for the Allies is that the Axis starts the turn order in 41 and 42. This allows the Allies to maximize their efforts and exploit Axis errors. If Japan thought the USA was going to go all out against her and bought warships on J1, the USA could see that and merely choose to ignore her.

Taking the Japanese homeland will be tough if you let Japan build up too much infantry.  Assuming you’ve island hopped, and taking the homeland is all that’s left, BSR max damage in the IC.  That gives Japan 8 IPCs to repair 16 IPCs of damage every turn, and effectively stops production.  The wrest is simple, build up invasion force, and take your prize.

[Upside-down_Turtle]

1941 KJF is very doable, and IMO the best Allied strategy.  Japan can fall just as quickly as it spreads.  However, you need a UK player that is willing to commit.

US goes all Pacific, and threatens a direct invasion of Japan from the Northeast.  With the bulk of the Japanese Fleet pinned down, the UK can island hop from the Southwest.  In fact, the US does not need to go all Pacific, just enough to distract the Japanese fleet.

UK builds ICs in India and Australia.  India and Chine hold the continent, while Australia is the base to retake the British East Indies.  This is a war of maneuver.  Don’t engage the Japanese fleet! You must keep your small Pacific fleet alive.  If the Japanese come after you:
“Run Away!!!”-Everyone, Monty Python’s The Holy Grail
Don’t worry if you can’t retake the East Indies at first.  Patience in the key. 
“Wait…for the opportune moment…” Johnny Depp, The Curse of the Black Pearle

[Upside-down_Turtle]

Scratch my previous strategy.  IL came up w/ an optimal strategy that involved India and Australia falling on J2.

[jsp4563]

@Upside-down_Turtle:

Scratch my previous strategy.  IL came up w/ an optimal strategy that involved India and Australia falling on J2.

Well don’t keep it a secret! :-D :-D

[Upside-down_Turtle]

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=12868.15

Look for IL’s Manchurian Candidate entry.

[atarihuana]

@Rammstein:

My main problem is how to defeat Japan with the USA. I know that eventually it can be done, but I want to know the most efficient way of doing so. I’ve heard several people say that it’s a cakewalk, but I disagree. I find in either 41 or 42 that Japan is so damn strong naval wise. She has so many fighters that buying cheap carriers drastically bolsters her naval defense. The USA has to spend more IPCs to match this power. I also found that by the time USA liberates the 4 IPC islands etc that Japan is hardly affected because she is deep in Asia at this point. If anyone has a strong anti-japan strategy for the USA I would be very interested to hear it.

i also like tu pump 48 hardass dollars each round into the pacific :) i like to play hide and seek as long as possible with japan in india. by the time he gets a factory in india ive got one an egypt and we can trade persia till the end of time :) meanwhile  british fleet is back in sz7 addaing a tranny a turn

even if japan cashes out at 60ish, thats only 4 inf to spare if you must invest the other 48 into boats. you wont be buying any the first 3 rounds or only little amounts. america can take back Australia (+7 uk) and Carolines (+5 UK)  and once you retake sumatra (-9 japan) … oh boy im dreaming again  :evil:

[jsp4563]

@atarihuana:

@Rammstein:

My main problem is how to defeat Japan with the USA. I know that eventually it can be done, but I want to know the most efficient way of doing so. I’ve heard several people say that it’s a cakewalk, but I disagree. I find in either 41 or 42 that Japan is so damn strong naval wise. She has so many fighters that buying cheap carriers drastically bolsters her naval defense. The USA has to spend more IPCs to match this power. I also found that by the time USA liberates the 4 IPC islands etc that Japan is hardly affected because she is deep in Asia at this point. If anyone has a strong anti-japan strategy for the USA I would be very interested to hear it.

i also like tu pump 48 hardass dollars each round into the pacific :) i like to play hide and seek as long as possible with japan in india. by the time he gets a factory in india ive got one an egypt and we can trade persia till the end of time :) meanwhile  british fleet is back in sz7 addaing a tranny a turn

even if japan cashes out at 60ish, thats only 4 inf to spare if you must invest the other 48 into boats. you wont be buying any the first 3 rounds or only little amounts. america can take back Australia (+7 uk) and Carolines (+5 UK)  and once you retake sumatra (-9 japan) … oh boy im dreaming again  :evil:

What’s going on in Europe while the US is spending all that money in the Pacific?  I’m Guessing Italy is all over Africa, and Germany is giving Russia fits.

[Bigtiti]

@Rammstein:

Hi all

I just want to say that what bothered me the most about previous versions of A&A was the KGF strat and the fact that Japan had to go for Moscow while the US ignored her. There was very little action in the Pacific theater. AA50 is by far the most viable version to allow for a Pacific war.

My strategy is very simple, and could probably be tweaked here and there for efficiency. I’m not getting turn specific here because the strategy is fairly open.
This is how I played it though:

1. Russia does what it always does, survives as long as possible. I mostly buy infantry and withdraw as Germany advances. The idea is to build up as much defense fodder as possible for the ultimate defense of Moscow. In fact, when I played it I never attacked German troops once.
2. The UK buys nothing but fighters and sends them to Russia. I borrowed this idea from AA Europe where my friends and I would buy nothing but fighters as the Allies and send them to Russia. If Germany’s tank stack could not crush the Russian infantry/fighter stack in Moscow she would run out of steam and Russia could spring forward. Try to hold off Italy in Africa and Japan in India as long as possible.
3. The USA goes all out on Japan with everything it has, including all the east coast stuff.

At first I tried this strategy in 1942 but I found that Germany was too strong and could defeat Russia quickly. Russia doesn’t have enough fodder. In 41 Russia has more time to retreat and build up reserves. Plus the Allies start with their full incomes, which allows the UK to purchase 4 fighters on UK1 instead of 3.

My main problem is how to defeat Japan with the USA. I know that eventually it can be done, but I want to know the most efficient way of doing so. I’ve heard several people say that it’s a cakewalk, but I disagree. I find in either 41 or 42 that Japan is so damn strong naval wise. She has so many fighters that buying cheap carriers drastically bolsters her naval defense. The USA has to spend more IPCs to match this power. I also found that by the time USA liberates the 4 IPC islands etc that Japan is hardly affected because she is deep in Asia at this point. If anyone has a strong anti-japan strategy for the USA I would be very interested to hear it.

My strategy may not be perfect, maybe the UK would be better off landing troops in Europe? BTW I never play with techs or NOs as i feel they could unbalance the game too much in favor of the Axis. I haven’t tried NOs with this strat though, so who knows…
Has anyone tried this idea yet? I’d love to hear other KJF strats, or just how to defeat Japan as USA alone.

Thanks

PS. One thing I like about AA50 for the Allies is that the Axis starts the turn order in 41 and 42. This allows the Allies to maximize their efforts and exploit Axis errors. If Japan thought the USA was going to go all out against her and bought warships on J1, the USA could see that and merely choose to ignore her.

i prefer 42 for KJF
cause then you can put IC on those 4 IPC islands
and there, japan is actually beateble
Russia is also in offense first round, so germans have to withdraw a bit, which gives russia a bit more breath.

[TimTheEnchanter]

@Frontovik:

i prefer 42 for KJF
cause then you can put IC on those 4 IPC islands
and there, japan is actually beateble
Russia is also in offense first round, so germans have to withdraw a bit, which gives russia a bit more breath.

You can’t place US ICs in the pacific (except phi) in '42.  per the official FAQ, the “original controller” of those islands is still UK, even though japan starts the scenario with them.  If us takes them, they are liberated for the british.

[Bigtiti]

@TimTheEnchanter:

@Frontovik:

i prefer 42 for KJF
cause then you can put IC on those 4 IPC islands
and there, japan is actually beateble
Russia is also in offense first round, so germans have to withdraw a bit, which gives russia a bit more breath.

You can’t place US ICs in the pacific (except phi) in '42.  per the official FAQ, the “original controller” of those islands is still UK, even though japan starts the scenario with them.  If us takes them, they are liberated for the british.

sorry, my mistake :-)
but i still prefer '42