@andrewaagamer
Ah. I hadn’t understood that subtlety. It’s a bit like assuming that, as an attacker, I’m going to win - so, retreat isn’t an option. Thanks a lot for your help.
After Action Reports
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how did england build a factory in france and then recapture it in turn 2? this seems impossible….
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What is IFP? Increased factory production?
I’m assuming you played the 1941 version of the game. Under game bias you stated that each player had played 8 games. Yet, under Observations you state this was the first time the Axis won. Furthermore you stated you don’t see a good Allied counter to this strategy. Am I missing something? :? Were your first 7 games Allied victories?
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Title : Tokyo falls, Moscow falls, Axis win
Date : Last week 25th July, at my friend’s house
Game setup : 42, with NOs, sz 16 closed.
Game lenght 8 hours, about 10 turns
Gaming experience. We were 4 players. I got Germany+Italy. I consider myself as the player with most knowledge (as I read alot in these forums). I was playing against very capable players. My ally was a good player too, although he has really bad luck with dices.
Game summary.
Japan 1 : Can’t do much in 42 due to the lack of mobility. My partner do not attack Pearl Harbor, fail at destroying China (But destroy Yunnan with loss of airplanes). Hit 0 in BRY, total failure… (2 fighter, 1 bomber retreat to MAN). Attack on UK fleet and he manage to lose a BB + 1 fighter…
Russia 1 (probably the second player with most knowledge) : Build a bomber and try a very suicidal 3 INF + bomber against 1 bomber + 2 fig. The attack against Japan airforce fail. Japan lose 1 bomber and Russia take 3 inf as casualties. Ukraine attack fails
Germany 1 : The usual sink British ships. Home fleet and Med fleet are sunk without too much loss to my airforce. Im trying something new. Built 1 DD 1 cruiser and bought 17 of inf, art. Take Karelia without loss (he abandonned it). Take down most of his tanks.
UK 1 : Rebuild fleet (2 cv and with us Plane). Doesn’t do much that turn.
Italy 1 : Egypt is too strong… so I go and take Trans
USA 1 : Build some fleet. Combine his pacific fleet and take back Solomon island for his bonus. Start to bomb GermanyThat’s the round 1 for everyone. Japan, my partner, keeps doing his things, fail at beating China because of his bad luck. He kill Russia bomber that landed in BRY. Built an IC in SUM but it was probably the worst place because USA had their fleet Sol Island. Japan is forced into a navy war against USA in the Pacific. A lot of hit and run. The smaller Japanese fleet are sunk easily (Bomber + fighter). I think its only after round 4 that UK loses his bonus definitely (his African troops being slowly killed). USA did managed to take one Japanese Island, so that gave another +5 to UK. Eventually, USA bomber + ships sunk the entire Japanese fleet. He sailed in Japan sea with 4 loaded transports. So my friend that had drank quite a lot, didn’t see the threat. (He had 14 units in Japan and thought it was enough. He didn’t count shore bombardment, and aircrafts….)… Tokyo has fallen! Fortunately for us, only 1 American soldier survived. My partner was able to do a suicide attack on US fleet, and do an attack on Japan with 1 art + 1 fighter and took it back.
Germany : I’ve built like 0 tank in the entire game. By doing the G1 naval build, my fleet survived for a really long time and scared UK a lot. I was able to unload 4 inf each turn in the Russia front. So I didn’t need tank’s mobility. Every round that I made 50+, I’ve built 2 planes and the rest art+inf. The rounds where I made less, I tried to max my production, while trying to produce 1 aircraft. Eventually, UK and USA realized that my fleet was weak (3 dd, 2 ss, 2 cruiser). So they just sent in their airforce and sunk everything without too much casualties. But by doing so, they made the mistake of sacrificing 2 of their precious Fighter. My airforce was equal to UK fleet defense. So I sent my entire airforces and sunk UK fleet. It was a crazy roll! I rolled really badly the first round (my bomber hitting none). Eventually, It was 1 fighter vs my bomber. I need to destroy fighter and survive. If not, the transports survive and Germany/France were threatened due to the loss of Fighters. I roll a four and await my opponent roll…. and he roll a 6! I sink Uk’s transports and win a lot of time. Africa has been quickly retaken by America. Against Russia, I’ve been able to hold him on the defensive (due to my 4 troops transported there each turn + 2 inf/turn in KArelia that helped me to keep Russia in check). Eventually, Japan threw everything she had at Russia. My partner rolled terribly, as always… He lost everything, but Russia had 3 fighter left. Even with 6 inf, that wasn’t enough to stop Germany
Italy did what Italy do. With sz 16 closed, not much to discuss. Italy was never seriously threatened, so I’ve sent everything I had in France, my tanks went east.
It was a great game, mistakes on both sides, tons of fun. Playing with people is a lot better than playing online
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Sounds like a lot of fun! That’s quite an impressive feat to pull off with Japan and Italy as no shows. The German navy build is a new strategy, though I question if it’ll work a second time now that the Allies are wise.
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Its a very risky gamble. But I see it like this: Putting alot into the navy allows it to survive some turn against UK (if you’ve sink their fleet). Your fleet act both as transport (transporting 2-4 inf each turn to the eastern front. Average, its about 1-2 turn faster than walking all the way there), but it also threatens United Kingdom, which is fun. Combined with airforce (that you build starting round 2), you can easily sink almost any UK fleet for the first few turns. At a point of the game, UK will have spent so much into his fleet that it will easily beat yours (you can’t commit too much into fleet like UK can). But if before attacking your fleet, he needs to be sure that the survivors will survive to your air strike!! and this is when things get interesting. Germany navy will be week. But if UK rush to kill it, he will lose his too!! And that’s a very fair trade for the Axis.
My opponent probably made the mistake of not calculating well. The fleet could have been sunk with just their incredible airforce (due to my japanese partner being incapable of getting rid of US soldiers on his worthless islands, that give a powerful +5 ipc to UK)Robert
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The most immediate counter to such a strategy is for UK to rush-build bombers. That way they can simulatanously threaten the German and Italian fleets. Of course this keeps the British limeys - temporarily - off the mainland, which may assist in a Moscow push. Still, I’d like to see more of this strategy in play. Be sure to pick the Germans on your way to the table.
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I agree. A bomber rush could have easily sunk my fleet. And you also pointed correctly that going bomber rush mean that the fleet will be weak, so uk won’t be able to put any transports into sea
Robert
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Title: Allies vice on europe 1942)
Date: 8/25/09
Special Rules: Tech NO’s FTR escort/intercept
Victor: Allies won by axis surrender after taking Berlin
Game Length: 6hrs
Bias: 0 Bias me and my friend are equally skilled we play all the time so we know some strategies so we have to change it up a lot.
Description: Russia set up a defensive perimeter with infantry for 2 rounds then purchased tanks and artillery and began its push into eastern europe while Britians air-force dominated the atlantic as america stocked on transports with tanks and infantry protected by cruisers and destroyers…. a land invasion of france while germanys bulk forces were occupied holding off the red army opened up a dominating second front. Japan was suppressed in the pacific by the US’s dominant navy after they rolled improved shipyards. Japan dominated south east asia but berlin was captured very quickly allowing the allies to focus land sea and air forces on japan, china retreated west in the beginning to concentrate forces which was vital to their successful defense of 50% of china despite the japan dominance in SEW asia
Observations/Recommendations: germany needs to establish a fleet in the atlantic Japan needs to go for US so Britain cant open up another front -
Congrats on your first post! :-D
Observations/Recommendations: germany needs to establish a fleet in the atlantic Japan needs to go for US so Britain cant open up another front
Based on your game description, what led you to the conclusion that Germany needs to establish a fleet? With UK going primarily air and USA building a Western Expedition force, the last thing I would do is to build a German Navy.
I can understand Japan catching a bad break and being set back, but what did Germany and Italy do in the game. What was their game plan? If Russia was able to go on the offensive, where were the Axis efforts directed?
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Italy had all of africa by the end of the game… But it was too late as the allies had already established a huge foothold on the western front of europe and berlin had fallen… Italy was quite strong but the soviets, if berlin was liberated by the italians, would have easily crushed the counter offensive the next turn and recaptured berlin. I belive if germany had lets say a fully loaded aircraft carrier and a cruiser or two with subs ect… they could have easily held off any allied landing force, while spending money on infatry in order to hold their ground in the east untill britians cash was exhausted due to italys conquest of afrika… this is simply my opinion, it might have worked, but i guess we will never know
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Title: Russian Agression
Date: December 19th, 2009
Special Rules: NO’s + Tech (1941 setup)
Victor: Allied victory, world domination
Game Length: 12 hours
Bias: About equal, 1player allies (me) against 2 axis players
Description:
Russia implemented an agressive strategy and bought mostly tanks and artillery for several rounds. They used up their infantry on high risk battles but this severely wore down germanys assault possibilities. UK took scandinavia and supported Russia with infantry. US established a bridgehead in Algeria and kept Italy from moving his fleet to the caucasus. Japan soon controlled the entire pacific after long ranged aircraft bombed away every allied navy vessel there. However, the UK had built a factory in india and SA where land units where sent to fight a land war in asia. After the italian navy was sunk by UK planes the Americans took the balkans and Roemenia, russia followed with reinformentment. From here the Italians were soon defeated and allied navies rushed to the passific using the suez canal. Germany fell after a long war of attrition. Japan lost their fleet and production and capitulated.Allies techs: UK, warbonds/jetfighters, US, jetfighters
Axis techs: Japan, Jetfighters/Long ranged, Germany: Rockets
Observations/Recommendations:
Germany had a really hard time dealing with a very agressive Russia. They tried to counter it with lots of tanks but this only made them vulnerable. Japan was sole ruler of the pacific but it didn’t bring them victory because UK put all there effort on land. I would recommend every allied US/UK player not to attack France or Netherlands unless you’r able to bring enough to survive any counter attack. -
Seems pretty true to life. Except for the part about the Allies pushing their navy across the Suez Canal.
How successful was Japan pushing inward to Egypt and Russia?
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@TG:
Seems pretty true to life. Except for the part about the Allies pushing their navy across the Suez Canal.
How successful was Japan pushing inward to Egypt and Russia?
Overall not very successfull. Although Japan managed to temporarily knock out china, they never reached Egypt and the russians had grown too strong to take.
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Hey Guys,
I’ve been scouting the after Action Reports and I’m reading a lot of the same things…
For the No Tech games, 1941 scenario:
1. UK trying to place an India IC is a lost cause
-It’s just too difficult to defend
2. Japan, played correctly, typically becomes a MONSTER!!!
-I have a J1 opening that basically destroys most of the Allied Pacific fleet, positions for a fork move on India or Australia J2, and gets Japan all 15IPCs of their NO money
3. There is no Battle of the Atlantic
-German Navy usually gone on UK1
4. Germany can push early, but more often than not, Russia can hold
-Germany is too weak, and UK can apply too much back pressure
5. USA is mostly forced to go 100% Pacific
-They can never really get to Japan though, and if they abandon for Europe, then the game boils down to that same old “Can Allies get to Germany before Japan gets to Moscow fiasco” :roll:For the Tech Games, either scenario"
1. It’s a virtual Crapshoot!!!
-basically you spin the wheel and see if you can get luckyNow I know some of you don’t mind playing A&A like this, but for those of you who want a game with a more historical playout, and a more strategic form of Tech, I’d suggest checking out AA50: Strategic in the House Rules section (see signature below for link)
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I agree with your assessment for the most part.
A few comments / observations:1. There are times a UK India factory is acceptable. It boils down to what Japan does T1. If Japan lunges toward SSR, China, or the Hawaiian Islands, then an India factory is not indefensible. How often this actually happens is debatable.
2. Agreed. China is too weak in 1941 to put much resistance.
3. Agreed.
4. Sure. Again it depends on the rest of the Allies hitting the German rear. Germany can soften Russia up with Italy holding its flanks, though at the loss of operational flexibility.
5. I’m not so sure on this one. Most ‘successful’ build I’ve seen has USA committing entirely to Europe. … Or the opposite.
We might give AA50 a try in the future, but we’re having too much fun with AA50 already. :D
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Here is the assessment of AA50 from my play group.
1. Russia is still the weakest link in the Allied chain. It is land locked with Germany, starts with the least production, and is the hardest for the allies to reinforce. Most games come down to the take Germany before Russia falls category.
2. Germany has the most accessible capital for the Allies. Thus many games depend on Germany holding out against a combined assault until Japan gets it in gear. The purchasing of a German navy allows them to hold of any France landings for an extra couple of turns, and if the US and UK don’t work together to counter it, it may be what gives the Axis the victory.
3. While Japan can become a monster, the Axis will still fail without a clear cut plan of attack (ie which Capital they are going for.) We’ve seen Japan collecting 60+ IPCs and still lose because Germany fell and they weren’t in position to take Russia. Japan must threaten SOMETHING for the Axis to win.
4. A UK factory in India is feasible, but will most likely require backup from Russia through Caucasus via Tanks. May be more trouble than its worth, as it pulls resources from Russia and the UK, without having enough production to counter Japan’s 8 placements.
5. Italy should always be cautious, as both the UK or USA can annihilate their starting navy if caught out of position. Sacrificing its fleet for any short term NO gain is folly. Italy should focus on taking out Egypt, a hard to reinforce spot for the Allies, and take the time to do it with ample force.
6. The American player is the most likely to become distracted by a high income and waffle on the chosen strategy. Pick a theatre and stick it to ‘em. Sending in your starting navy to Morocco Algeria on Turn 1 usually sees the loss of said fleet. Take the time to amass a sizeable fleet before moving in either direction; Russia will not fall in the first few turns, so slow it down.
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Excellent analysis. Quoted for truth.
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2. Germany has the most accessible capital for the Allies. Thus many games depend on Germany holding out against a combined assault until Japan gets it in gear. The purchasing of a German navy allows them to hold of any France landings for an extra couple of turns, and if the US and UK don’t work together to counter it, it may be what gives the Axis the victory.
Agree with all but this one, although I could see where you’re coming from because of the UK to German proximity.
But this also makes them one more turn further away from USAOther points against (or Arguments for Italy being the weakest Axis capital)
Italy income is less
Italy can only produce 6 units in her capital
No axis help can intervene in a UK & USA one/two punch on the capital (yes, I realize Italy can help herself) -
I didn’t really consider Italy in the equation, as they’re a minor player. They can be effective, to be sure, but what can they really do. If the Allies focus on Germany and take it, Italy most likely won’t be able to do anything about it. However, if the Allies take Italy, Germany stands a better chance of having enough units and production take Italy back.
If we lump Germany and Italy together, my point should stand that it is easier for the Allies to take Europe than it is to take out Japan. :-)
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I didn’t really consider Italy in the equation, as they’re a minor player. They can be effective, to be sure, but what can they really do. If the Allies focus on Germany and take it, Italy most likely won’t be able to do anything about it. However, if the Allies take Italy, Germany stands a better chance of having enough units and production take Italy back.
Well that’s a main reason why AAR concepts must differ somewhat when trying to use them in AA50.
Italy does contain a capital now, that has an added bonus of their income (varies greatly from 9 IPCs to 20s) if conqueredIf we lump Germany and Italy together, my point should stand that it is easier for the Allies to take Europe than it is to take out Japan. :-)
I don’t disagree that KGF is {still} the strongest allied plan
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