Help with minor victory game plz

Try playing for 9 Victory Cities instead.  With the caveat that you can surrender if the game looks hopeless.  That’s generally how we play tournament games.  The reason is, 9 VC for either side means the other side is significantly damaged usually.  However, you don’t have to take down two capitols which can take a very long time in a normal game.

Axis can win with their starting VC + India, Karelia and Moscow.

Allies can win with their starting VC + W. Europe, S. Europe and Kwangtung.

There are only a few ways to attempt an 8 VC game and not have it be an automatic Axis win, and most of them have serious problems.

You could give the Allies a bid to allow for reinforcement of Karelia and/or India at the start, but with the game already unbalanced in favor of the Allies, the Axis either win in 2 turns, or it is a guaranteed Axis loss.

The other option is to work out a strategy that defends India with a coordinated defense effort by Russia/UK; and even the US starting in turn 2.

Doing so successfully is a fine balancing act, and there are repercussions in Europe.  Though that second option actually makes for a game that will fall more in line with the actual war.  Victory by the Axis is achieved when they finally crack either Moscow or the Allied Defense of India.  Victory for the Allies is when they take and hold Western, relieve the siege of Lenningrad, and take either Southern or (more likely) Phillipines.

Or, and this is just a thought, allow the Allies to relocate one of their Victory Cities to another territory.  For instance, Karelia could be moved to Caucasus. (Instead of Leningrad, move it to Stalingrad, which was Hitler’s biggest objective in Russia anyway.)  Or England could move India to Australia (bad idea, IMHO, but could do it.)

That way getting 8 VC isn’t so assured.

Yes, Leningrad and Calcutta are almost certain to fall to the axis early in the game.  :cry:  Therefore, I do not believe a quick Allied victory is possible in a minor victory game without very good fortune.

I believe your best bet is to do a KGF.

• Abandon Calcutta and reinforce Russia where you can.
• Abandon Leningrad, but retake it with a Russia & UK 1-2 punch later.
• Sink German Navy in Mediterranean
• Have UK and US fighters fly over for support once Leningrad is retaken.
• Have US do Torch, kick Germany out of Africa.
• Build fighters with US when you can.
• US reinforces London
• UK attacks/reinforces Leningrad via SZ4
• UK & US do Overlord
• UK & US slugs it’s way to Berlin and Rome
• Go after Calcutta or Shanghai for the win.

This is by no means “easy” or “quick”.  You all but give them the win at first, but I believe that if you try to defend Calcutta and Leningrad too early, you will be too weak to win later.

Way 2 Slow,

That is why I suggested the possibility of letting the allies move one of their victory cities.  I think it should be limited so that if you move a VC then you have to keep it in the same nation’s territory and obviously, it cannot be on the same territory as another VC.

Might want to exclude any moves to N. America as well as it would be as bad as where they are now, only it would be the axis who can’t win instead of the allies.

So limit it to Australia, Africa or Asia.

@SlipShot762:

My friends dont have the patience to play for more than minor victory and it seems a guaranteed axis win unless the axis players are dumb.

I have had your same problem! Try saying them that the minor Victory condition has been emendated by the Marginal Victory Condition, with 9 cities!

Or, more preferable, play with the Minor Victory Condition using OOB NA. I know that they are unbalanced favoring the allies  but the important thing is to play! Maybe your friends will became more involved in the games after same matches and you may propose them the Marginal Victory Condition (9 cities) that is a fully different matter!
Even my friends, once sceptics, have begun to appreciate A&A played with Marginal Victory Condition (9 cities). So do not overwhelm them with long game session, and be content to play for less time, your objective is to cultivate in them the passion for the game.
Good Luck!

No self respecting British player is going to let London fall before turn 15.  Though, you could make mistakes and let it fall early.

Shipshot762: oob = out of (the) box rules

Playing for 2 capitols is really gonna drag out the game. Once you capture 1 enemy capitol and hold it 1 full round the game is over in realistic terms. Playing for a 2nd capitol just puts one side through the agony of shoving pieces around to inevitable loss while the other side revels in it’s “even dice can’t touch me now” smugness. ~ZP

You could also add a Revised version of M84 from classic… Economic Victory.

Though in Revised it would need to be about $90 at the end of a complete turn (end of USA move) instead of $84 from Classic

@ncscswitch:

You could also add a Revised version of M84 from classic… Economic Victory.

Though in Revised it would need to be about $90 at the end of a complete turn (end of USA move) instead of $84 from Classic

Why the 6 IPC difference?  (as in what specifically, not just because there is more money on the board now. :P  )

Because germany starts at +8 and Japan at +5 so I would think you’d need to add 13 to the magic number, not 6.  So M97

SlipShot762, at me seems that your problem is not of the kind of objectives or the victory condition. Your problem is that your friend do not want to spend more than 2 or 3 hours in playing A&A.
As I said also I have had the same problem, and I resolved cultivating in them the passion for the game. How? Playing with the Marginal Victory Condition (9 cities) so there are no flaw in the game Victory Condition, but fixing the time for the end of the game.
By that time, if no side have the control of 9 Victory, you may use a predefined method to assess the winner, (the most IPC controlled, or the IPC gained, or the total value of IPC controlled (territories + units IPC value)), in tournament Games there are a way to asses the winner basing on the control of a certain number of key territories, that provide victory points.

Regarding Blitz, as stated in the rules, you may blitz trough an unoccupied territory, conquer it, and then finish your move in another territory, that may be:

• a friendly territory;
• another enemy territory, conquering it (so the tank may conquer two territories in a single move!)
• another enemy territory invaded by other unit of your nation, and so participating normally in the battle.

Moreover, you may blitz only during combat move.

Thanks can move up to two territories even if they are not blitzing. For example a panzer from Germany may participate in the attack on Leningrad in G1. Another example, in G1 non combat move, is a panzer from France that moves across Germany to reach Eastern Europe.

Regarding Germany first turn (G1) fighters, all six of them and the bomber can reach Leningrad legally. So you are working well with plane rules, in my opinion. The problem is that German fighters are needed also elsewhere on G1!

You are right, I mentioned the Marginal Victory Condition, that has been introduce in Larry Harris Tournament Rules, and was so called Marginal to differentiate from Minor.
Really in the latest version of those rules, LHTR 2.0, the Victory condition has been reduce to only two:

Standard Game (recommended for tournament play) 9 Victory City Controlled
World Domination Game 12 Victory City Controlled

We normally play with the rules from the game (OOB = Out of Box rules) but use the 9 city Victory Condition, so you may use the standard game rules but play with the 9 city victory condition. It has been introduced in LHTR because the Minor Victory condition (8 city) is flawed, and cannot be fixed!

@SlipShot762:

Say the japs have a bomber on midway. 1 move to enter the surrounding sea, 2 to enter west US seazone, 3 to enter west US and attack, 4 back into west US seazone, 5 back to midway seazone, and 6 to land on midway? Or am I screwing that up somehow.

You are completely correct here, you counted correctly every territories and sea zone you crosses. I continue to think that you are working well with plane rules!  :-D

Regarding Historical A&A I do not know of the esistence of components that may be bought, I know only of the material that may be downloaded and then printed. Maybe someone else on this forum may be more precise than me.  :?

they can split up.

But the “thumb rule” in a 8 vc gam is to executa KJF, thats the only way for allies to win.