Game 6, Europe, TGC (Germany) v. VF (Allies)

[The_Good_Captain]

@VictoryFirst

[The_Good_Captain]

sorry, I put your bid in the wrong spot. I’ll re do this in the AM.

[VictoryFirst]

Nah it’s fine. The Atlantic went so badly for the Germans that I think the Allies have a chance of winning this game, even with the incorrect bid. I’d be happy to continue this, you don’t often see a U-boat free Atlantic as the Allies 😁

[The_Good_Captain]

@VictoryFirst I’ve seen it three or four times and it is worse than doing poorly as the Germans on the east front. I feel I’m the only one from our group who understands this or even seen this but if you haven’t played a game like this, we should continue. It would be good for both of us. It would be good for me as another data point for an Atlantic fiasco.

This opener is Germany: -7.34 and the curse continues…

[VictoryFirst]

@The_Good_Captain

Cool, I will start cooking on the Allied turn, however I didn’t quite understand what you were saying. Do you mean an Atlantic fiasco is worse for Germany than cold dice on the Russian front or the opposite?

I felt in my games that the main thing that held the Allies back was needing to clear the Atlantic from U-boats, which forced them to spend valuable money on boats instead of fighters/transports. Now that that isn’t much of an issue, I am curious to see how this game will play out. I haven’t played a game like this before, or at least not one with an Atlantic that was that much in the Allies’ favor. If there is anything I’d like to see it would be an Allied victory against what I call the “Unstoppable Wehrmacht” strategy, just a giant army on the doorsteps of Moscow on G6 with more than 90% of winning. I don’t like it when one side keeps winning game after game lol.

You said in a game thread somewhere that you think this game is 70% in Germany’s favor. I am curious to know your thoughts on that because I think it’s more like 85%, maybe even 90%.

[kwaspek104]

I think he means bad dice in the Atlantic is worse than bad dice in the East front on turn 1 for Germany, and I happen to agree.

It had to do with what you said. The expense of the sea units. And the subs are a huge pain in the butt for the Western Allies.

Whereas if you have bad G1 East front, it sucks, but the units are much cheaper to replace. U-boats are generally not replaceable. You’ll maybe buy one or two in the first two turns as Germany, but that’s it.

[VictoryFirst]

@kwaspek104

Yeah I also think that way. There is nothing more annoying than having to hunt down those pesky subs, while Russia is in the greatest trouble. I’ve had games where the U-boats were gone as quick as turn 2 but Moscow still got sacked. However no U-boats left after G1 is new for me, this might allow the Allies to jump into the action before it’s too late…

[The_Good_Captain]

@VictoryFirst @kwaspek104

I feel that a terrible opener for Germany in the Atlantic is worse than a terrible opener for Germany on the east front because this means the western allies are one or even two turns ahead of where they should be. this translates to a much larger western army or armies available to save Russia or kill Germany (Whatever looks more effective). In effect you don’t only have IPC’s that are better spent as the western allies against Germany, but you have them a lot sooner than they otherwise should be.

[VictoryFirst]

TripleA Turn Summary: Russians round 1

TripleA Turn Summary for game: Europe Improved

Game History

Round: 1

    Purchase Units - Russians
        Russians buy 8 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Russians
        2 infantry moved from Karelia to Finland
        1 infantry moved from Vyborg to Finland
        1 armour moved from Archangel to Finland
        1 bomber and 1 fighter moved from Moscow to Finland
        2 infantry moved from Archangel to White Sea Sea Zone
        2 infantry and 1 transport moved from White Sea Sea Zone to Barents Sea Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from Barents Sea Sea Zone to Finland
        1 armour and 3 infantry moved from Caucasus to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 armour moved from Turkestan to Belorussia
        1 armour moved from Belorussia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 artillery and 4 infantry moved from Belorussia to Baltic States
        2 infantry moved from Leningrad to Baltic States
        1 armour moved from Moscow to Baltic States

    Combat - Russians
        Battle in Ukraine S.S.R.
            Russians attack with 2 armour and 3 infantry
            Germans defend with 2 armour and 1 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 2 armour and 3 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 2 : 3/5 hits, 1.50 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 2 armour and 1 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
                1 infantry owned by the Germans and 2 armour owned by the Germans lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
            Russians win, taking Ukraine S.S.R. from Germans with 2 armour and 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 10
            Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 2 armour and 1 infantry
        Battle in Finland
            Russians attack with 1 armour, 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 5 infantry
            Germans defend with 6 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 1 armour, 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 5 infantry in Finland, round 2 : 3/8 hits, 2.50 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 6 infantry in Finland, round 2 : 2/6 hits, 2.00 expected hits
                2 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Finland
                3 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Finland
                Russians roll dice for 1 armour, 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 3 infantry in Finland, round 3 : 3/6 hits, 2.17 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 3 infantry in Finland, round 3 : 3/3 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                3 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Finland
                3 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Finland
            Russians win, taking Finland from Germans with 1 armour, 1 bomber and 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for Russians: 5 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 6 infantry
        Battle in Baltic States
            Russians attack with 1 armour, 1 artillery and 6 infantry
            Germans defend with 2 armour and 2 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 1 armour, 1 artillery and 6 infantry in Baltic States, round 2 : 0/8 hits, 2.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 2 armour and 2 infantry in Baltic States, round 2 : 3/4 hits, 1.33 expected hits
                3 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Baltic States
                Russians roll dice for 1 armour, 1 artillery and 3 infantry in Baltic States, round 3 : 2/5 hits, 1.50 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 2 armour and 2 infantry in Baltic States, round 3 : 0/4 hits, 1.33 expected hits
                2 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Baltic States
            3 infantry owned by the Russians, 1 armour owned by the Russians and 1 artillery owned by the Russians retreated to Belorussia
            Germans win with 2 armour remaining. Battle score for attacker is -3
            Casualties for Russians: 3 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 2 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Russians
        1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Stalingrad to Belorussia
        3 infantry moved from Turkestan to Belorussia
        4 infantry moved from Moscow to Belorussia
        1 armour moved from Siberia to Leningrad
        1 bomber moved from Finland to Leningrad
        1 artillery and 4 infantry moved from Russia to Leningrad
        1 fighter moved from Finland to Karelia
        1 submarine moved from White Sea Sea Zone to North Atlantic Sea Zone
        1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from Archangel to Karelia
        1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Siberia to Russia
        1 aaGun moved from Moscow to Belorussia
        1 infantry moved from Iran to Caucasus

    Place Units - Russians
        8 infantry placed in Leningrad

    Turn Complete - Russians
        Russians collect 23 PUs; end with 23 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans regular : 2.33
Russians regular : 1.33

Savegame

[VictoryFirst]

TripleA Turn Summary: British round 1

TripleA Turn Summary for game: Europe Improved

Game History

Round: 1

    Purchase Units - British
        British buy 2 fighters; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
        1 infantry moved from Syria to Eastern Mediterranean Sea Zone
        1 artillery moved from Egypt to Eastern Mediterranean Sea Zone
        1 artillery, 1 destroyer, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from Eastern Mediterranean Sea Zone to Central Mediterranean Sea Zone
        1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Central Mediterranean Sea Zone to Southern Italy
        1 armour moved from Egypt to Libya
              British take Libya from Germans
        1 armour moved from Libya to Egypt
        1 destroyer moved from Celtic Sea Sea Zone to British Convoy 3 Sea Zone
              British take British Convoy 3 Sea Zone from Germans
        1 destroyer moved from British Convoy 3 Sea Zone to Mid-Atlantic Sea Zone

    Combat - British
        Battle in Southern Italy
            British attack with 1 artillery and 1 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 infantry
                British roll dice for 1 destroyer in Southern Italy, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Southern Italy, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the British lost in Southern Italy
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Southern Italy
            British win, taking Southern Italy from Germans with 1 artillery remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for British: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry

    Non Combat Move - British
        1 infantry moved from Palestine to Egypt
        1 infantry moved from Iraq to Syria
        2 fighters moved from United Kingdom to Leningrad
        1 bomber moved from United Kingdom to Leningrad
        1 aaGun and 1 armour moved from Canada to United States

    Place Units - British
        2 fighters placed in United Kingdom

    Turn Complete - British
        British collect 23 PUs; end with 24 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans regular : 0.67
British regular : 0.67

Savegame

[VictoryFirst]

TripleA Turn Summary: Americans round 1

TripleA Turn Summary for game: Europe Improved

Game History

Round: 1

    Purchase Units - Americans
        Americans buy 1 destroyer and 2 fighters; Remaining resources: 4 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Americans
        2 infantry moved from United States to U.S. Eastern Coast Sea Zone
        2 infantry and 1 transport moved from U.S. Eastern Coast Sea Zone to South Atlantic Sea Zone
        2 infantry moved from South Atlantic Sea Zone to Morocco
        1 bomber moved from United States to Morocco

    Combat - Americans
        Battle in Morocco
            Americans attack with 1 bomber and 2 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 infantry
                Americans roll dice for 1 bomber and 2 infantry in Morocco, round 2 : 2/3 hits, 1.00 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Morocco, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Morocco
            Americans win, taking Morocco from Germans with 1 bomber and 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Americans
        1 bomber moved from Morocco to Gibraltar
        1 destroyer moved from U.S. Eastern Coast Sea Zone to Mid-Atlantic Sea Zone
        1 fighter moved from United States to United Kingdom

    Place Units - Americans
        2 fighters placed in United States
        1 destroyer placed in U.S. Eastern Coast Sea Zone

    Turn Complete - Americans
        Americans collect 41 PUs; end with 45 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Americans regular : 1.00
Germans regular : -0.33

Savegame

[VictoryFirst]

@The_Good_Captain

Btw I would be interested to see how you would play the Allies in this position.

Something already went wrong for me lol, I shouldn’t have taken Ukraine. Those units are going to be vital for the upcoming battle for Moscow…

[VictoryFirst]

This game just moved to to the TripleA forum:

https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/3946/game-6-europe-tgc-germany-v-vf-allies

[VictoryFirst]

TripleA Turn Summary: Russians round 2

TripleA Turn Summary for game: Europe Improved

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Russians
        Russians buy 7 infantry; Remaining resources: 2 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Russians
        1 infantry moved from Karelia to Finland
        1 armour moved from Leningrad to Finland
        1 infantry moved from Caucasus to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 infantry moved from Belorussia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 bomber moved from Leningrad to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 fighter moved from Karelia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 infantry moved from Belorussia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 artillery moved from Belorussia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 artillery moved from Belorussia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 submarine moved from North Atlantic Sea Zone to British Convoy 4 Sea Zone
              British take British Convoy 4 Sea Zone from Germans

    Combat - Russians
        Battle in Ukraine S.S.R.
            Russians attack with 2 artilleries, 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 3 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 artillery and 3 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 2 artilleries, 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 3 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 2 : 2/7 hits, 2.67 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 artillery and 3 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 2 : 1/4 hits, 1.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
                2 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
                Russians roll dice for 2 artilleries, 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 2 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 3 : 3/6 hits, 2.50 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 artillery and 1 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 3 : 1/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
                1 artillery owned by the Germans and 1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
            Russians win, taking Ukraine S.S.R. from Germans with 2 artilleries, 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7
            Casualties for Russians: 2 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 1 artillery and 3 infantry
        Battle in Finland
            Russians attack with 1 armour and 1 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 1 armour and 1 infantry in Finland, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Finland, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 1 armour and 1 infantry in Finland, round 3 : 2/2 hits, 0.67 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Finland, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Finland
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Finland
            Russians win, taking Finland from Germans with 1 armour remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Russians
        1 bomber and 1 fighter moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to Belorussia
        1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Russia to Belorussia
        1 artillery and 12 infantry moved from Leningrad to Belorussia
        1 transport moved from Barents Sea Sea Zone to Atlantic Sea Zone

    Place Units - Russians
        1 infantry placed in Leningrad
        6 infantry placed in Moscow

    Turn Complete - Russians
        Russians collect 23 PUs; end with 25 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans regular : 0.33
Russians regular : 0.50

Savegame

[VictoryFirst]

TripleA Turn Summary: British round 2

TripleA Turn Summary for game: Europe Improved

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - British
        British buy 2 fighters; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 

    Combat Move - British
        1 armour moved from Egypt to Libya
              British take Libya from Germans
        1 armour moved from Libya to Egypt

    Combat - British

    Non Combat Move - British
        1 bomber and 2 fighters moved from Leningrad to Belorussia
        2 fighters moved from United Kingdom to Karelia
        1 destroyer moved from Mid-Atlantic Sea Zone to Celtic Sea Sea Zone

    Place Units - British
        2 fighters placed in United Kingdom
        Turning on Edit Mode
        EDIT: Removing units owned by British from United Kingdom: 1 armour
        EDIT: Adding units owned by British to Atlantic Sea Zone: 1 armour
        EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode

    Turn Complete - British
        British collect 26 PUs; end with 26 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Savegame

[VictoryFirst]

TripleA Turn Summary: Americans round 2

TripleA Turn Summary for game: Europe Improved

Game History

Round: 2

    Purchase Units - Americans
        Americans buy 1 artillery, 3 fighters and 1 infantry; Remaining resources: 2 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Americans
        1 infantry moved from Morocco to Algeria
              Americans take Algeria from Germans

    Combat - Americans

    Non Combat Move - Americans
        1 bomber moved from Gibraltar to United Kingdom
        1 fighter moved from United Kingdom to Karelia
        2 fighters moved from United States to United Kingdom
        1 destroyer moved from Mid-Atlantic Sea Zone to Celtic Sea Sea Zone
        1 destroyer moved from U.S. Eastern Coast Sea Zone to Celtic Sea Sea Zone
        1 transport moved from South Atlantic Sea Zone to U.S. Eastern Coast Sea Zone

    Place Units - Americans
        1 artillery, 3 fighters and 1 infantry placed in United States

    Turn Complete - Americans
        Americans collect 42 PUs; end with 44 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Savegame

[VictoryFirst]

@The_Good_Captain

Lol, I accidentally posted to our old thread. Ignore these posts, I am going to try to post to the TripleA forum.

[VictoryFirst]

TripleA Turn Summary: Russians round 3

TripleA Turn Summary for game: Europe Improved

Game History

Round: 3

    Purchase Units - Russians
        Russians buy 8 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 

    Combat Move - Russians
        2 infantry moved from Belorussia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 bomber and 1 fighter moved from Belorussia to Ukraine S.S.R.
        1 armour moved from Finland to Norway
              Russians take Norway from Germans
        1 armour moved from Norway to Finland

    Combat - Russians
        Battle in Ukraine S.S.R.
            Russians attack with 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 2 infantry
            Germans defend with 1 infantry
                Russians roll dice for 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 2 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 2 : 0/4 hits, 1.50 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                Russians roll dice for 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 2 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 3 : 1/4 hits, 1.50 expected hits
                Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Ukraine S.S.R., round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0.33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
                1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Ukraine S.S.R.
            Russians win, taking Ukraine S.S.R. from Germans with 1 bomber, 1 fighter and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
            Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry
            Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry

    Non Combat Move - Russians
        1 bomber and 1 fighter moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to Moscow
        6 infantry moved from Moscow to Turkestan
        10 infantry moved from Belorussia to Turkestan
        2 artilleries and 10 infantry moved from Belorussia to Russia
        1 armour moved from Belorussia to Moscow
        2 infantry moved from Belorussia to Russia
        1 infantry moved from Belorussia to Turkestan
        1 infantry moved from Leningrad to Belorussia
        1 aaGun moved from Belorussia to Moscow
        1 aaGun moved from Stalingrad to Turkestan
        1 armour and 1 transport moved from Atlantic Sea Zone to English Channel Sea Zone
        1 submarine moved from British Convoy 4 Sea Zone to Celtic Sea Sea Zone
        1 aaGun moved from Leningrad to Russia
        1 aaGun moved from Karelia to Finland

    Place Units - Russians
        8 infantry placed in Moscow

    Turn Complete - Russians
        Russians collect 25 PUs; end with 26 PUs

Combat Hit Differential Summary :

Germans regular : 0.33
Russians regular : -2.00

Savegame

[VictoryFirst]

Made the same mistake again 😅